Fishless Cycling - Nitrosomonas Bacteria Source?

[Aqua07]

For the first time, I'm going to embark on a "Fishless" cycling methodology.

In that regard then, where does the source of the Ammonia eating bacteria(Nitrosomonas) come from? I assume such bacteria is in all our water to start out with?

 

[fluttermoth]

There are bacterial spores in the air.

There aren't really any in the water, although I think there used to be; that's how people got away with not cycling in the 'old day's, IMO.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

The autotrophic nitrifiers, of which Nitrosomonas is one, do not form spores. They come in live via tap water.

 

[BlueDragon]

But presumably there must be much less bacteria in todays water as it has so much more chlorine etc in it than it used to, which I though the bacteria were sensitive to?

My mam kept huge tanks with Goldfish in them and she never cycled them. When I mentioned it to her when I had started my first (Fishless) cycle she asked what I was on about. She'd never heard of doing a cycle before. She also never needed to use any form of water treater either. But all her Fish lived perfectly healthy lives and lived a fair while too. She only had to treat for a fugal infection, I think, twice in all her years of keeping her Fish. Non of her Fish died of anything other than old age, I'm sure.

Something must be different these days. I think so anyway.

 

[Bugdozer]

Research by Hovanec and DeLong indicated that Nitrosomonas is not what oxidises ammonia in freshwater aquaria, but Nitrosococcus.

 

[fluttermoth]

The autotrophic nitrifiers, of which Nitrosomonas is one, do not form spores. They come in live via tap water.

Oh, I didn't know that! Thank you

 

[TwoTankAmin]

Research by Hovanec and DeLong indicated that Nitrosomonas is not what oxidises ammonia in freshwater aquaria, but Nitrosococcus.

ThIs is not the case. That paper was a 1996 one which merely discovered that the bacteria in tanks, especially the nitrite oxidizers were not the ones everyone had thought were there. "Comparative Analysis of Nitrifying Bacteria Associated with Freshwater and Marine Aquaria. Applied and Environmental Microbiology Vol. 62, No. 8: 2888-2896. Hovanec, T. A. and E. F. DeLong. 1996."

A 1998 paper "Nitrospira- Like Bacteria Associated with Nitrite Oxidation in Freshwater Aquaria. Applied and Environmental Microbiology Vol. 64, No. 1: 258-264. Hovanec, T. A., L. T. Taylor, A. Blakis and E. F. DeLong. 1998." showed:

Instead, nitrite oxidation in freshwater aquaria appeared to be mediated by bacteria closely related to Nitrospira moscoviensis and Nitrospira marina.

And then In a subsequent paper by Hovanec et. el., they identified the fw ammonia oxidizers:

Identification of Bacteria Responsible for Ammonia Oxidation in Freshwater Aquaria. Applied and Environmental Microbiology, Dec. 2001, p. 5791-5800. Paul C. Burrell, Carol M. Phalen, and Timothy A. Hovanec.
Abstract: Culture enrichments and culture-independent molecular methods were employed to identify and confirm the presence of novel ammonia-oxidizing bacteria (AOB) in nitrifying freshwater aquaria. Reactors were seeded with biomass from freshwater nitrifying systems and enriched for AOB under various conditions of ammonia concentration. Surveys of cloned rRNA genes from the enrichments revealed four major strains of AOB which were phylogenetically related to the Nitrosomonas marina cluster, the Nitrosospira cluster, or the Nitrosomonas europaea-Nitrosococcus mobilis cluster of the subdivision of the class Proteobacteria. Ammonia concentration in the reactors determined which AOB strain dominated in an enrichment. Oligonucleotide probes and PCR primer sets specific for the four AOB strains were developed and used to confirm the presence of the AOB strains in the enrichments. Enrichments of the AOB strains were added to newly established aquaria to determine their ability to accelerate the establishment of ammonia oxidation. Enrichments containing the Nitrosomonas marina-like AOB strain were most efficient at accelerating ammonia oxidation in newly established aquaria. Furthermore, if the Nitrosomonas marina-like AOB strain was present in the original enrichment, even one with other AOB, only the Nitrosomonas marina-like AOB strain was present in aquaria after nitrification was established. Nitrosomonas marina-like AOB were 2% or less of the cells detected by fluorescence in situ hybridization analysis in aquaria in which nitrification was well established.

The full texts of all three of the above papers are available free online.

 

[Bugdozer]

Well forgive me for only reading a brief summary of the paper rather than the paper itself. I was unaware that they had conducted research which directly contradicted their research of two years earlier. The identification of nitirite oxidisers was neither mentioned nor disputed.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

I was unaware that they had conducted research which directly contradicted their research of two years earlier.

Nothing contradicted anything. And there was five years between paper 1 and paper 3.

Paper 1 (published 1996) concluded that the bacteria all had assumed was doing the nitrification, was not in fact the case. Due the technology available at the time, they were unable to detect the Nitrosomonas in most fw tanks.One of the possible reasons for this discussed in the paper was that the bacteria might not have been present in sufficient numbers for them to find.
Paper 2 (published 1998) identified the nitrite oxidizers.
Paper 3 (published 2001) identified that Nitrosomonas were, in fact, the ammonia oxidizers in fw tanks. They also showed they are there in smaller numbers, which is one reason why they could not nail them down 5+ years earlier. Better techniques were also available by this time which made it much easier to find the Nitrosomonas marina-like AOB in fw tanks.

BluDragon Chlorine is not the agent of choice in drinking water systems. It is now Mostly chloramines. Research shows that chloramine in the concentrations used does not wipe out the bacteria. it mostly makes it go dormant. Once the chloramines are not being added, what is there breaks down and creates ammonia. The bacteria then revive and feast. Morover, once the water crosses the sidewalk and enters the private plumbing systems of homes or apartments (which are not regulated like the public part of the system), there are many parts of the home system which dont get used daily. Thing like a basement utility sink or bathroom, or a guest bathroom etc. are parts of the home network of pipes where the nitrifyers can establish and thrive. So it is not hard for them to find their way into the water system and then into our tanks.

Moreover, even chlorine at the levels used in drinking water treatment systems will not wipe out all of the bacteria. There are studies on this all which support this. Both chloramine and chlorine are more toxic to the fish and other tank inhabitants than they are to the bacteria. If you are curious and want to read more on this then you can look at these:
UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES OF CHLORAMINE HIT HOME
Development and Use of Microelectrodes to Evaluate Nitrification within Chloraminated Drinking Water System Biofilms, and the Effects of Phosphate as a Corrosion Inhibitor on Nitrifying Biofilm
There is lots more. Do a Google Scholar search for :"AOB and chloramine" and/or "AOB and chlorine".