First post in SW

[itZme]

I just acquired a 140 USgal 72x18x25 inches. I have talked to my wife and she actually ENCOURAGED me to go SW "if that's what you really want"
She has been great with the whole fishkeeping hobby of mine. It can be hard to not get upset when they see the MTS getting bad. I have 7 FW tanks right now and was talking about getting rid of 4 before setting up the SW 140gal. She actually said, "I like the one on my side of the bed so don't get rid of that one, and the one in the kitchen is nice too... and I like the hex tank in our bedroom too." I was like... Did she just say that ???

Now I am getting all the parts together and I will be building a wet/dry. I have a 20gal that I was going to use for the filter construction. I was wondering what is the purpose of having a large sump area? I considered using a 10 gal for the filtration and then overflow it into the 20 after that. Anyone think I could just use half of the 20 gal for the filter and the other 10 gals for sump? I can do it either way but don't know the benefit of having more sump volume yet.

Also, I have 2x 300 watt submersible heaters. I thought they should probably be on opposite ends of the tank but with the sump setup it would make sense to heat the sump water then pump it into the main tank. Would you put one heater in the tank and one in the sump? I will be running 2 seperate 500 gph pumps and returninig them to opposite sides of the tank with drilled spray bars. I have seen many setups without any skimmer and wondered if it is something I could get in a few months, or maybe not need at all, or is it an absolute neccessity that some people just ignore? (like cycling or testing water params)

Sorry for the long post but I am getting excited about this now. You will probably hear from me again soon. Be nice to SW noobs

Thanks in advance for your help.

-- itZme

 

[steelhealr]

Itzme...hi...I'm not the sump expert here but I can at least give some thoughts to get you going. Keeping equipment in the sump area is one of the nice things about having one...keeps the stuff out of your main tank.

With regards to the heaters, I"m sure you will be 'dry' running your tank before adding LR with all pumps and filtration. I would experiment and perhaps put on in the sump, one in the tank or see if both could be put in the sump. Other experts can chime in here.

With a 150 gallon tank, I wouldn't go without a skimmer. You can argue against one in a nano tank, but, I would say it should be routine equipment in a tank that size.

and....a wife with MTS is a good thing. SH

 

[Ed4567]

I would put both in the sump, to avoid looking at them in the display, and since there will be a good flow of water past them here.

IMO unless you are running a large refugium or have very low bioload a skimmer would be a great idea.

Also have you decided if you will be running a fish only tank, or using live rock as filtration (fish only with live rock), or going for a full reef setup?

 

[superman]

Is your new 140 gallon drilled? If it is drilled then yes, put both heaters in the sump, if you are just using a siphon overflow box, then put one in the sump, one in the tank (near the bottom) The point of having as large a body of water in the sump as possible is to keep the tank as stable as possible, and a larger body of water is naturally more stable. Definitely go with a skimmer, especially since this is your first try at saltwater. I would sincerely think about using a refugium, so possibly the 20 gallon could be your refugium, and your 10 gallon could be your sump. Dual 500 gallon pumps are not near enough flow in that size tank, especially if you ever want to keep corals. I would either suppliment some powerheads in the tank, or get larger return pumps. Do get back to us with more specific information so that we can pin down exactly what the best start up equipment and scenarios you should go with. Take your time, and have fun setting up this tank, it should be a joy.

 

[itZme]

Hi again and thanks for the replies. I do think I would like to keep corals as well as fish. I know that the lighting will be a large part of the setup cost. I have read that filtration should be roughly 5 times the aquarium's volume per hour and thought that 1000gph would be sufficient for 140gal tank. Were you referring to just water movement or actual filtration flow rate? I can add a couple power heads to make more movement in the tank if neccessary but thought that the 500 gals at each end would be enough if the drilled outlets were facing each other.

The refugium sounds like a good idea. I will be building a stand to house the sump/refugium/fitration below the 140gal since it is on an iron stand now and I have always hated the look of those and want to enclose them in the stand to help dampen the noise. Plus I don't want this to be loud since it is in our living room with our 106" home theater/surround sound setup. Is there a way to make a skimmer quieter?

The tank is not drilled and it is 3/4" glass so I planned on using dual hang-on-back overflows made from acrylic boxes in both rear corners and using 1.5 inch PVC pipe to make the syphon tubes. I planned on making lots of tiny slots in the rim of the overflow boxes to sift away any floating items or fish. If I use this method won't most of the protein be whisked away to the filter as the water will be pulled from the surface?

If I make a 20 gal refugium and a 10 gal wet/dryfilter I am guessing that I should just use a small 20gph pump to fill the refugium and then overflow it back to the 10 gal before pumping it up to the 140, Does this sound correct or am I missing some info? I have read that the refugium should have a turnover rate of once per hour so it doesn't disturb the growth of the algae and othe good stuff.

Thanks for your input.
-- itZme

PS. This is supposed to be done on a budget since I have 3 kids, a wife and a house to keep happy during the process. I might not be able to get the equipment needed to make this tank SW for a few months so maybe I will set up a 29 gal that I have as SW to start getting my feet wet and develop some experience while waiting for the "big one". There's nothing I hate worse than losing fish due to lack of knowledge and not only would I feel bad about the fish dying but the cost is significantly higher than FW too.

 

[superman]

Hi again and thanks for the replies. I do think I would like to keep corals as well as fish. I know that the lighting will be a large part of the setup cost. I have read that filtration should be roughly 5 times the aquarium's volume per hour and thought that 1000gph would be sufficient for 140gal tank. Were you referring to just water movement or actual filtration flow rate? I can add a couple power heads to make more movement in the tank if neccessary but thought that the 500 gals at each end would be enough if the drilled outlets were facing each other.

The refugium sounds like a good idea. I will be building a stand to house the sump/refugium/fitration below the 140gal since it is on an iron stand now and I have always hated the look of those and want to enclose them in the stand to help dampen the noise. Plus I don't want this to be loud since it is in our living room with our 106" home theater/surround sound setup. Is there a way to make a skimmer quieter?

The tank is not drilled and it is 3/4" glass so I planned on using dual hang-on-back overflows made from acrylic boxes in both rear corners and using 1.5 inch PVC pipe to make the syphon tubes. I planned on making lots of tiny slots in the rim of the overflow boxes to sift away any floating items or fish. If I use this method won't most of the protein be whisked away to the filter as the water will be pulled from the surface?

If I make a 20 gal refugium and a 10 gal wet/dryfilter I am guessing that I should just use a small 20gph pump to fill the refugium and then overflow it back to the 10 gal before pumping it up to the 140, Does this sound correct or am I missing some info? I have read that the refugium should have a turnover rate of once per hour so it doesn't disturb the growth of the algae and othe good stuff.

Thanks for your input.
-- itZme

PS. This is supposed to be done on a budget since I have 3 kids, a wife and a house to keep happy during the process. I might not be able to get the equipment needed to make this tank SW for a few months so maybe I will set up a 29 gal that I have as SW to start getting my feet wet and develop some experience while waiting for the "big one". There's nothing I hate worse than losing fish due to lack of knowledge and not only would I feel bad about the fish dying but the cost is significantly higher than FW too.

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Good to hear that you are searching out good information. I wasn't refferring to the amount of water that should be filtered, but actually flow turnover inside the tank itself. I would forget the wet dty filtration, ok for freshwater, usually bad for saltwater unless you are planningon keeping a fish onlly tank. If you are planningon a reef type tank then ditch the wet dry and use a good skimmer as your main means of nutrient exportation. As for the refugium, that flow rate In my opinon is way to low, I would go with at least 100gph going through the refugium, I personally have 500 gph going through my refugium. I would section off your ten gallon tank so that the pump that feeds the refugium sucks water after the protein skimmer, that way you can avoid so much settling of orgaics in your refugium, it will happen anyways, but this way you can avoid so much stuff rotting in your refugium. What are you planning on keeping?

 

[itZme]

I would forget the wet dty filtration, ok for freshwater, usually bad for saltwater unless you are planningon keeping a fish onlly tank.

Am I understanding you correctly to assume the refugium and skimmer are the only means of mechanical/biological filtration? I would love to do that and can set that up pretty cheaply. Unless you meant to use a canister in addition to the skimmer/refugium in which case the price goes up quickly.

I would go with at least 100gph going through the refugium, I personally have 500 gph going through my refugium.

I am thinking I could use another overflow box in the sump to siphon into the refugium then set up one of the 500 gph pumps to pump the water out of the overflow and up to the main tank. It has an adjustable magnetic impeller and I could cut it back to maybe 200 gph. I can get another one for circulating the main tank water since you recommend more flow inside. That would be roughly 200 gph returning from the refugium + 500 gph in each corner circulating. Or I could get a larger pump this time if needed. What do you recommend for total water movement volume in a 140US gal? Also, should I be looking into some sort of wave generating device at all?

Hope all these questions haven't been asked 1,000 times before. I usually just lurk around forums soaking up info for a while but now that I am getting some quick answers I keep thinking of more things to ask.

What are you planning on keeping?

I am surprised to say that I don't have a plan on livestock yet since I am really trying to get the tank set up and get the live sand/rock and clean up crew settled before investing in anything that I love and don't want to die. (no flaming... I haven't researched compatibilty of any SW fish yet) I think I would like to have a lionfish, some large stars, clown fish, clown triggerfish, couple different butterflyfish, would LOVE to have some sun coral but will need much more research before stocking anything other than snails and crabs

-- itZme

 

[fraservet]

live rock would be the main biological filtration, with the skimmer, refugium, and water changes being the methods for nutrient export.

This is not a flame, just advice.

Your current thinking on what fish you have will have to be altered for several reasons.

- lionfish, voracious predator - will eat any small fish, and probably inverts as well, not a great reef tank fish. Might be possible if you get a dwarf species?

- clown trigger - stay well clear, probably the most belligerent fish you can buy. Will end up killing everything. Can also bite through electric cables! Gets pretty big.

- stars - not with the above fish or similar.

- clowns fish - again not with large predators.

- butterflyfish - wouldn't recommend for beginners. at best a tricky fish to keep, many species are pretty much impossible.


In a 140G tank I would recommend fish from the following families.

- tangs, although avoid the really big ones (naso, sohal etc.) a group of yellow tangs is nice in a tank that size.

- clownfish

- chromis

- angels, although not very reef safe

- gobies/blennies

- wrasses, as long as the tank is covered

many others are possible also.

 

[itZme]

Thanks for the tips on livestock. I will begin looking at those and try to set up a plan of attack. Like I said before I will have a few months of setup/saving/construction before introducing anything that doesn't have a shell into the tank. I can be happy just watching the crabs and algae grow before investing in any fish.

I like constructive criticism and appreciate the advice about the incompatibilities of the fish I mentioned. I did mention that I had done zero research into the mannerism and habits of the fish but I just liked the looks of them as I was checking out the pictures on the internet. Just as I might like the looks of a red-bellied pacu but would never attemp to own one unless I had a 500 gallon tank
You can bet if I had a 500 gal tank I would not stock it with one freshwater fish though.

I will get back to reading other people's posts now and try not to ask anything that has been answered lots of times already.

-- itZme

 

[Scorp1on]

Are you planning FO, FOWLR, reef? Lighting plays a big part. For help with research www.reefcentral.com