Cryptocoryne Wendtii + Sand = Death

[iroc]

So last weekend I took my jungle aquarium and rescaped it, everything is doing great just like it was before EXCEPT my Cryptocoryne wendtii they have wilted away and are limp on the substrate. Part of the new scape was a change to 2" of sand on top of an inch of gravel. Could this be the reason? I am confused

 

[invader]

Crpyts usually lose their leaves when put into a new environment... maybe the changes prompted the leaves falling off? Just wait a bit and see if new ones come in.

 

[Themuleous]

Yeh crypts are very sensitive to changes, especially being moved, melting is a common result. Just give them time, they'll bounce back in a week or so

Sam

EDIT - thinking on my feet, it my actually be a selective advantage, as the new leaves they grow will be adapted to the new environment (OK its not that new but in nature moved could dramatically change the environment that the plant ends up in) which means that they don't have to fight to 'convert' their existing leaves, rather just grow a new set, which means they may actually adapt faster than those that don't do this, no idea if this is true, just my ramblings

 

[AndyTaylor]

My experience has suggested that it's very hard to grow Crypts in sand, certainly in my tank anyway.

 

[SuperColey1]

If you look at my tank, the plant front right is Cryptocorene Wendtii.

3 weeks ago it was in plain 2 inches of gravel, then I changed to 1 inch TetraComplete and 1 inch PlaySand.

The outer leaves, have melted and are being rapidly eaten by the mollies and Pitbulls.
The inner leaves have doubled and new shoots appearing everywhere.

Have you got a nutrient substrate underneath the play sand.

I have read that Crypts are one of the hardiest plants in ther, although they will deteriate for a period if they are interfered with, before bursting back into action.

 

[Miss Wiggle]

mine are doing brilliantly in sand, they wilted when first put in then grew back bigger and better than before

 

[AndyTaylor]

If you look at my tank, the plant front right is Cryptocorene Wendtii.

3 weeks ago it was in plain 2 inches of gravel, then I changed to 1 inch TetraComplete and 1 inch PlaySand.

The outer leaves, have melted and are being rapidly eaten by the mollies and Pitbulls.
The inner leaves have doubled and new shoots appearing everywhere.

Have you got a nutrient substrate underneath the play sand.

I have read that Crypts are one of the hardiest plants in ther, although they will deteriate for a period if they are interfered with, before bursting back into action.

Not sure if this question was for me but I'm going to answer anyway! I have TetraComplete as a substrate too, with play sand over it and gravel on top.
For the first few months this was fine and my Crypts grew like weeds, but play sand compacts too readily,is nutrient free and over time becomes anaerobic very quickly. So it's likely that the problem is not with growing Crypts in sand as such but that MY sand is no longer suitable for growing anything (and possibly that play sand is the wrong sand to use anyway), hence i'm off to get some Tropica Aquagrow for my planned substrate replacement this weekend. God help me!

 

[SuperColey1]

With 75% of my tank planted and 3 pitbull plecs continually moving the sand about in the open area at the front, there should be no chance of anaerobic pockets in it.

It should be hard to get these pockets in a planted tank because in the planted areas the root systems should take care of this problem and in an open section either a fish that moves the sand like corycats, kuhli loaches or pitbulls etc, should turn the sand over so that the pockets don't develop. My pitbulls play at the front of the glass so much that they have moved a lot of sand. There is now a ridge ½" lower at the front then a lip before dipping again. They are moving about ¼" of sand here, weekly, as I keep levelling it again.

If you don't have fish to do it then you can gently 'stir' the open section yourself, but you shouldn't have problems with the planted part.

The sand is just my barrier between the nutrient rich substrate and the bulk of water, it stops the substrate having any chance of making my water a different colour, and also controls the substrate + it looks nice.

Maybe the water is more acidic in Ireland? Not making fun just wondering.

Mine is in Ph6.4

 

[AndyTaylor]

With 75% of my tank planted and 3 pitbull plecs continually moving the sand about in the open area at the front, there should be no chance of anaerobic pockets in it.

It should be hard to get these pockets in a planted tank because in the planted areas the root systems should take care of this problem and in an open section either a fish that moves the sand like corycats, kuhli loaches or pitbulls etc, should turn the sand over so that the pockets don't develop. My pitbulls play at the front of the glass so much that they have moved a lot of sand. There is now a ridge ½" lower at the front then a lip before dipping again. They are moving about ¼" of sand here, weekly, as I keep levelling it again.

If you don't have fish to do it then you can gently 'stir' the open section yourself, but you shouldn't have problems with the planted part.

The sand is just my barrier between the nutrient rich substrate and the bulk of water, it stops the substrate having any chance of making my water a different colour, and also controls the substrate + it looks nice.

Maybe the water is more acidic in Ireland? Not making fun just wondering.

Mine is in Ph6.4

Nope, PH 6.5 out of the tap.

As you say, if your fish stir up the sand it's not a problem but I foolishly layered sand and Tetracomplete when I was building up the level so the deep down sand does nothing except stops plant roots from reaching the nutrients. The gravel I put on top of that makes sure that not even my plecs can stir up the sand!! Beginners mistake which I won't be making again, I can assure you. This time it'll be substrate with gravel over the top and if the water gets discoloured for a while, so be it.

 

[iroc]

seems like this got a lil derailed............

Well I will leave them in the tank then if ppl are saying they might make a come back. I was thinking of doing a carpeting plant around them if they bouce back whats the easest to grow, I have co2, and 5.5wpg, seachum forish 2 times a week

 

[SuperColey1]

seems like this got a lil derailed............

Well I will leave them in the tank then if ppl are saying they might make a come back. I was thinking of doing a carpeting plant around them if they bouce back whats the easest to grow, I have co2, and 5.5wpg, seachum forish 2 times a week

They will grow back as long as they don't get interfered with too much, I wouldn't surround them until they have recovered, as for a carpeting plant, it depends what look you are after. Some are low light, some are highlight, some work in both but are very slow growers under low lights.

Look at Jimboo's journals and you will see a huge variety of different 'carpeting' plants, and his 3 journals all have varying amounts of light, so they are quite good as guidelines for what will grown under each level of light. (Don't expect to get the same results as Jimboo though, as he magicly manages to get some plants to grow in low light that would just die in the majority of low light tanks)

 

[iroc]

Thanks for the advice I looked at jimboos jornals, my question isn't as much about light but more about substrate, I attempted to grom some drawf hairgrass a while back and it lived just fine but it's roots wouldn't weave through my gravel substrate, now that I have sand I am wondering if that is no longer an issue....

 

[SuperColey1]

Hairgrass is a light issue. Its a high light plant really, although someone will probably kick me down that has managed to grow it well in low light. lol

Sorry just read 5.5WPG!!!!! Are you doing EI and pressurised. or experimenting like me?

Oh Yeah do you have pure sand or a Nutrient Rich Substrate under the sand (which with 5.5WPG and hopefully pressurised CO2 + ferts the plants if not now WILL need) if not buy lots and lots of root tabs.

 

[iroc]

I have kelm dryed sand with some sort of nurtants in it, however I do use root tabs once a month or so, but when I tried to grow hairgrass everyone said the reason it wasn't growing was becuase of substrate.