Confused!

[dixiedawn]

I worked in a petstore in the states as a teenager..cleaning..bagging etc etc...
When i was a teenager some bright spark gave me a fishbowl and some odds and ends to go with it. Never really had any issues with it. I put the water in..the dechlorination stuff and some stress releiver...couple of days later i bought an angelfish and a couple of guppies...they all lived for about 5 years amazingly.
Now i have this little 10 gallon tank..filter..air..the whole works and im so confused! I've read the threads on cycling..which i really wasn't aware i was supposed to do. And another newbie error i used the cycle liquid they gave to me. Which until recently joining this forum, didn't know i was supposed to not use!
So now i've had like 11 fatalities, and one remaining survivor..Fred (kid named him) he's a goldfish. I've been doing emergency 911 since reading some of this stuff..cleaning tank..etc etc etc..putting the dechlorination stuff in and stress coat. SERIOUS NEWBIE ERROR on my part and i admit it. I'm confused about some of the jargon you guys use.
Should i get some bio filter things to go in the filter?
I know i have to get some ammonia stuff...but im just very very very confused..and i admit i jumped the gun a bit with this one..as i recalled having a bowl was easy! Had no idea that it got complicated...I'm unable to get to the petstore until tomorrow morning to get various other things that i need...any reccomendations on what i should buy and what should be avoided if the ppl try to sell me stuff? ta in advance!

 

[Lynda B]

First of all, don't feel like you're alone in your newbie confusion. There are so many people who are nodding yes as they read your post, because they can relate to your frustration.

This doesn't have to be hard. In fact, I think the less chemicals you use, the better off you probably are. Chemicals, in excess, will kill your fish.

When my husband and I cycled our first tanks, we didn't know about fishless cycling. He cycled his tank with 6 black skirt tetras. I cycled mine with 3 serpae tetras and 2 red eye tetras. The only chemical we put in there was a dechlorinator (Prime brand). Our fish made it beautifully through the cycling period, we had no losses and everybody's been happy ever since. We slowly added 2 or 3 fish per week after that, with no problems. We have been faithful in doing our water changes and readings (with a drop test kit), we don't overfeed and we have beautiful, happy and healthy fish.

Why do you need to purchase ammonia? You have fish in your tank, right?

I'm not sure I understand, so please tell me how long you've had the 10 gallon set up and what's in there. Also, what steps have you taken so far and what are your current readings? How often are you doing water changes?

Take a deep breath, get yourself into a bubble bath, and we'll help you do this the easy, stress free way.

 

[dixiedawn]

I DON'T KNOW LOL

When i bought the tank for the Sprout..the lady at the shop said..set up the tank for about 2 weeks or so before putting in any fish. With the tank came the dechlorinator (sounds like something from the terminator movies) and the cycle stuff. So that's what i did. Ever since i've been having issues. I wasn't really aware of needing the kits for the ph etc etc etc...as i was so kindly directed that i shouldn't need it if i set up the tank the way they specified....There's one goldfish left...and a few mins ago he was playing in the bubbles from the air thingymahootsits..don't know if that's a good thing or not...i think with the ammonia thing i meant treatment..not ACTUAL ammonia..for that mix up i am sorry!...how can i get my tank going the way it should? I knwo it's a small tank and with that come very little room for error..but if lucky fish number 12 dies..im gonna give up for a while and research more..as i should have done in the first place

 

[GRJ]

Hope you dont mind me butting into this thread, but i am currently cycling my 108ltr tank andhave made some of the same errors as you. I left my tank running a week and then got 5 fish, 2 zebra danios and 3 platies. I am a week in and i have lost a zebra danio and the female platy(she left me with a present though, some fry!!). The remaining zebra danio is looking a bit peaky but the platies are doing just fine. I am doing daily water changes of 15% and every other day 20% and testing ater paramters daily, currently my readings are ammonia 0.50, nitrite 0.25, nitrate 20ppm so my cycle is underway as far as i can tell. When my tank is cycled i will introduce around 3-4 fish every two weeks untill i am just below my stocking level (i want to leave space for fish if i ever see an unusual one at my lfs. I have added this that and the other and found it hasnt really made much difference. I dechlorinate using Stress Coat and i have added a couple of doses of Ammo Lock(converts ammonia to ammonium but doesnt affect your testing). I did buy some Stress Zyme but have stopped using it. I reckon i just have to be patient and wait for my ammonia and nitrite to drop to 0 and nirtate to be 40 or below. I have been told 4-6 weeks so its a waiting game really. Hope this has helped.GRJ

 

[Lynda B]

Okay, one goldfish, one 10 gallon tank. Got it.

First things first, now that you realize that the fish store person doesn't know their arse from their elbow, you can ignore their advice.

Things you need to have:

A reliable drop test kit
Prime dechlorinator (or the equivalent)

That's all that you need to purchase, if you don't already have it.

What do do, with what you have:

Do your water changes faithfully, as your goldfish is a huge waste producer, lots of ammonia (pee), lots of poop

Take your readings faithfully, as this will help you monitor your water

Feed sparingly (in other words, don't overfeed)

Get to know your fish (by this I mean, really watch the fish, know how it looks when it's healthy and you'll recognize immediately if it's unhealthy)

That's really all you have to do. See how easy that was?!?

 

[Lynda B]

I should mention that we keep a computer log of all of our tanks. We have the following columns:

Date:

Readings:
pH
Ammonia
Nitrite
Nitrate

Meds:
Aquarium Salt (we note the amount we added after that day's siphoning)
Prime (we note the amount we added after that day's siphoning)

Water change: (we note the amount we siphoned that day)

Fish added: (we note the date that we added the fish, what we added and where purchased)

And then, for the hospital tank, we have a huge comment section. That way, we write who's gone into the tank, the reason, how we're treating them, what their general appearance/behavior is, etc.

By keeping these logs, at any time we can look back and see what our progress has been, as well as the longevity of any given fish.

 

[dixiedawn]

Got it!!

Thanks!!

so just the kit you mentioned..am bout to write it down so i don't forget should be all i need?


Next question. I'm looking at aquiring a 96L tank...(found it on ebay and am watching it carefully!)...IF i win it and BEFORE i muck up yet another bunch of fish...in plain english what would i need to do and when cycling..how long for that particular size tank?

 

[rdd1952]

Sorry to hear that you've had so many problems. You didn't mention what other fish you had but goldfish are BIG waste producers. They're eating and pooping machines. As a general rule, a single goldfish should be in a 20 gallon tank and then each additional goldfish is another 10 gallons. If you could return him and either do a fishless cycle or get some smaller community fish like the serpae or red-eye tetras, that would be best. Both of those species of tetras are very hardy and can handle a cycling tank although, IMO a fishless cycle is best for the fish and easier on you.

I will go out on a limb and say that the goldfish you have will survive as they are extremely hardy and can live throuh a lot. The bad part about that for you is that your tank is prety much fully stocked with him in there. They can grow to over a foot long but won't in your tanks as his growth will be stunted, leading to a short life (goldfish can easily live for 25+ years in an aquarium and close to 50 in a pond).

You didn't do anything wrong in using the cycling liquid. My opinion (as well as most everyone else's) is that it is pretty much useless but it lso won't do any harm. I will second what Lynda B has already said about chemicals. The less the better. I use Stress Coat as a dechlorinator and nothing else except for some fertilizer for my plants.

As far as cycling is concerned, the time required varies from tank to tank. Most of mine have cycled in about 3 weeks but I had one that went 16 days with o change at all in ammonia so I broke it down and started all over as nothing wa happening. Click the link in my signature for a fishless cycling thread.

 

[dixiedawn]

Sorry to hear that you've had so many problems. You didn't mention what other fish you had but goldfish are BIG waste producers. They're eating and pooping machines. As a general rule, a single goldfish should be in a 20 gallon tank and then each additional goldfish is another 10 gallons. If you could return him and either do a fishless cycle or get some smaller community fish like the serpae or red-eye tetras, that would be best. Both of those species of tetras are very hardy and can handle a cycling tank although, IMO a fishless cycle is best for the fish and easier on you.

I will go out on a limb and say that the goldfish you have will survive as they are extremely hardy and can live throuh a lot. The bad part about that for you is that your tank is prety much fully stocked with him in there. They can grow to over a foot long but won't in your tanks as his growth will be stunted, leading to a short life (goldfish can easily live for 25+ years in an aquarium and close to 50 in a pond).

You didn't do anything wrong in using the cycling liquid. My opinion (as well as most everyone else's) is that it is pretty much useless but it lso won't do any harm. I will second what Lynda B has already said about chemicals. The less the better. I use Stress Coat as a dechlorinator and nothing else except for some fertilizer for my plants.

As far as cycling is concerned, the time required varies from tank to tank. Most of mine have cycled in about 3 weeks but I had one that went 16 days with o change at all in ammonia so I broke it down and started all over as nothing wa happening. Click the link in my signature for a fishless cycling thread.

when i originally bought fish..i bought two mollies..one silver one black...2 male guppies and 3 tetras. I allowed the tank to settle for a couple of weeks before buying them..as i thought that that would be enough..as the freaking idiot at the store said....also to the lack of my memory..i forgot that mollies prefer to be warm..so that didn't help being as i don't have a heater! So after all the deceased was removed, i did a half tank water replacement and allowed it to settle for another few days before i bought the goldfish..bought two originially as i wasn't aware that they needed so much space..so i sent one back.
I know it sounds selfish..but if i can keep this little bugger alive i'll do it, my daughter is attatched to him already and i'd hate to take him back but i might do that at the weekend if he doesn't liven up!

 

[Lynda B]

I didn't realize that fantails need 20 gallons for just one..... wow.....

These guys are the pros on fishless cycling.... I'm sure next time, I'd do it that way, if I didn't have filter material already available.

 

[gilaesther]

Lots of fish like the bubbles, don't worry about him playing in them.

Get a testing kit. Most people here like the API Master Test kit - it's a liquid testing kit (the strips can be very innacurate) and tests for everything important, and stuff you never knew existed. It lasts a LONG time, so use it every day until your tank is fully cycled. Do 20% water changes at least once a day, and if the tests have moderate to high amounts of ammonia, do another 20% water change. If you can keep the stats level until the ammonia and nitrites dissapear (we love bacteria) then the fish should be fine.

In the meantime, watch the fish a LOT. Notice where he likes to swim, pay attention to any scratching or darting he may seem to randomly do (not good signs if he's scratching himself on things, or randomly darting often). Also keep an eye out for fin/tail rot (the fins and/or tail will be getting eaten away, and if left unchecked it will start eating at the body) and ich - all signs of illness due to poor water quality.

Also, just to be prepared, you should have on stock an anti-bacterial medication, and an anti-fungal medication. These should hopefully never be used, but if you need them, it's better to have on hand than to rush out in panic to an lfs that has given you bad advice before.

 

[Lynda B]

This is true, it's always a very good idea to start building up your first aid kit.

 

[rdd1952]

Actually, all of th fish you bought with the exception of the goldfish need a heater and a temperature around 76 to 78 degree. Most people say that goldfish and tropicals won't work together and although it isn't the best situation for the goldfish to be in tropical temperature water, they can certainly live and thrive in it. My dad has had a goldfish pond of about 1000 gallon in his back yard since I was a kid (I'm 55 now). Those fish live for years through single digit winter temperatures to 100 degree summer days. I can't tell you when he last had a fish die although an owl and a blue heron decided it was a great place to get a quick lunch or dinner a couple years ago and cleaned out a bunch of his bigger fish but that's another story.

Back to your situation. You can keep the goldfish and possibly get a couple other small fish after you have worked through the cycling situation but you will need to get a heater for any tropicals (maybe set it on the lower range of about 76 degrees) and you will also need to plan on upgrading to a larger tank in the next year or 2 so that the goldfish will have suitable quarters to live in.

Edit: Be careful spending too much money on medications though as they all have shelf lives on them. They're a little too expensive to buy and end up throwing away because you never needed them. As long as you're within a short drive to the nearest fish store where you can buy them, I wouldn't keep any on hand. I never do.

 

[dixiedawn]

..unfortunately it's the only one we have around here, i'd have to go to London near abouts to get to a proper fish store! This one in particular is apart of a garden centre. I'll get these kits etc and see how we go..im just hoping the little bugger will survive!

i feel like im on the set of goldfish 911 !!

I'm already looking to upgrade, and possibly use the smaller tank for something like red clawed crabs OR a turtle..not together tho...for the kiddo...This small tank business is alot harder than i thought.

 

[GRJ]

Hi, i am cycling my 108ltr tank at the minute with fish. I had five and lost two already so i am doing regular water changes, testing ect. I know any amount of ammonia and nitrite are bad, but what level is consisdered too bad and needs an urgent water change more than once a day. My levels are ammonia 0.50, nitrite 0.25. ThanksGRJ