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gwand

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After the babies have hatched, how do you maximize separation of shells etc from the BBS? I read one can purchase two sieves held in tandem with different mesh counts: one which hold on to shell debri but lets the babies pass through and the second mesh which catches the babies. Is this what you do?
 
That is a high tech tool. what are BBS? I like to siphon with airling tube also, i go after leftover food with it.
 
That is a high tech tool. what are BBS? I like to siphon with airling tube also, i go after leftover food with it.
Baby brine shrimp
 
I use a flashlight or, these days, a cell phone light, to draw the BBS to one corner of the hatching jar then use airline tubing to siphon them out.
Thanks for the advice. A second question. How much salt water can I expect to siphon off from an incubation of 2 teaspoons of eggs in 700 ml of salt water?
 
I'm not going to answer that question - i never worry about the salt but if it concerns you you can rinse them.

Just remember bbs is only nutrious for a day or 2 and if you want to keep them longer you either need to feed them and turn them into brine shrimp or cool them down so they don't consumer their egg sacks where most of the nutrition is found.
 
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Thanks for the advice. A second question. How much salt water can I expect to siphon off from an incubation of 2 teaspoons of eggs in 700 ml of salt water?
I hsve no idea. What is your concern?
 
I use a light to get them to the bottom and then I use the mesh thing also- it works well and you can rinse it a few times to get the most of them. I use that fancy hatcher with the spout at the bottom (can't remember the name and too lazy to look it up) and that prevents me from having to use the mesh thing for the most part, but the mesh thing works well.
 
I have minimally hayched BBS, I did this when I had angel fry. I gpot into a major discussion on Aquaria Central years agi when I quote a marie biologist on the nutriional value of Brine shrimp and BBS. it ended up with another member being banned from the site. I read an article, the second of two, on hactching and feeding live foods punlished on The Advanced Aquariist, An online publication from reefs.com. However the information also can be applied in many cases to Fresh water fish. I actually corresponded with the author.

Aquarium Invertebrates: Nutritional Value Of Live Foods For The Coral Reef Aquarium, Part 2​

by Rob Toonen | Jan 15, 2004 | 0 comments

Dr. Toonen is a Research Professor at the Hawaii Institute of Marine Biology. while his focus is on salt water fish etc. what he wrote about broine shrimp applies equally to fresh water fish. Here is how he describes his background:
I did my Master’s Degree in the Pawlik Lab at UNCW, before moving on to a PhD in the Grosberg Lab at UC Davis. I joined the faculty at the Hawaii Institute of Marine Biology in 2003, but I have a hard time describing my research program in a few sentences. During my research career, I have used a variety of approaches (including individual behavioral assays, ecological experiments in both the field and laboratory, and molecular genetic tools) in an effort to address a variety of interesting biological questions.


Let me quote some of what he wrote on Brine shrimp and specifically on BBS.

"The nutritional value of adult and baby brine shrimp can be very different, and even if we consider only newly hatched baby brine shrimp, it is not possible to make any sweeping generalizations about the nutritional value to your tank. The reason
that nutritional value varies so much is because it depends on a number of factors, including the age, the source, and the quality of the brine shrimp “eggs” from which baby brine are hatched how nutritious the newly hatched brine shrimp will be.

How much difference does the source and quality of your brine shrimp “eggs” make? Well, there are great differences in the nutritional value of different batches of baby brine shrimp hatched from different sources, and the dealers separate the stock according to the quality into at least 4 or more categories: premium, high- and low quality aquaculture grade, and then hobbyist grade (in that order). As suggested by this list, the brine shrimp available to us in the hobby is not exactly the best quality stuff out there. Even among the aquaculture grade cysts there are enormous differences in the nutritional profile of the baby brine hatched from different locations.

Well, I’ve been talking about enrichment throughout this article, but I haven’t really given you any guidelines for how exactly to accomplish that enrichment. Let’s use brine shrimp as an example, and go through how to enrich your food before feeding it to an aquarium. When Artemia nauplii first hatch (Instar I), they do not have a complete gut, and it is not until they develop to Instar II that the baby brine start to feed. The time of development to Instar II depends on a variety of factors (most importantly temperature, but also salinity), but occurs within 6 to 30 hours after hatching. At 28°C (roughly 82°F) it takes about 8 hours for the newly hatched nauplii to begin feeding, and as the temperature drops, that time becomes much longer. As soon as the nauplii hatch, they begin to digest their yolk and become less nutritious with time after hatching, however, once they reach the second instar, they can begin to feed, and you can enhance their nutritional value by feeding them a highly unsaturated fatty acid (HUFA) supplement that provides high concentrations of essential fatty acids for the health of most marine animals (reviewed by Coutteau and Mourente 1997; Rainuzzo et al. 1997; Sorgeloos et al. 2001).

Many people seem to have the idea that you’re trying to soak the nauplii in the stuff to coat them before feeding. While that may be true of frozen foods, it is not particularly effective, and most of the enrichment solution ends up floating freely in your aquarium as dissolved nutrients (just as if you had dumped it into the tank directly) rather than getting into your fish. In this case, what you’re really trying to accomplish is to get the baby brine shrimp to eat the stuff, so that they are basically swimming grocery bags full of those nutrients when you feed them to your reef tank. The problem is that baby brine shrimp are very inefficient feeders, and it takes a long time for them to ingest enough of the HUFA supplement that they become “enriched” (e.g., Evjemo et al. 1997; Han et al. 2000; Han et al. 2001). For newly hatched brine at the second instar, it takes at least 12 hours to get decent enrichment – in fact, its much better to enrich your Artemia nauplii for two 12 hour periods (with a water change between them to limit the growth of bacteria in the culture water). To clean the nauplii, simply pour the culture through a “brine shrimp net” (one of the fine, white mesh nets available at any pet shop) and rinse them a couple of times before setting them up in clean water and adding new HUFA. After the two 12-hour feedings of the HUFA supplement, the nutritional value of the nauplii is typically much greater than when they are newly hatched (reviewed by Coutteau and Mourente 1997; Rainuzzo et al. 1997; Sorgeloos et al. 2001).

The same is true of adult brine: they are largely devoid of nutritional value when you purchase them at the local petshop, and it is important to enrich them before feeding brine shrimp to your fish. For live adult brine shrimp, it is relatively simple to enrich them with a HUFA supplement (such as Selcon or Zoecon), and that greatly enhances the nutritional value of these animals as a food for your aquarium pets. Brine shrimp become more efficient feeders as they grow, and as a result, larger Artemia can be enriched in shorter times due to that increased efficiency of filter-feeding. In fact, although live Artemia can benefit from periods of enrichment equivalent to those of the nauplii, adults can be significantly enriched in as little as about 1-2 hours of feeding in a HUFA supplement. Be enriching live brine prior to them being introduced to your reef aquarium, you not only provide a popular treat to your animals, but also gain the maximum nutritional benefit from feeding these foods to your pets."

You can read the entire article here https://reefs.com/magazine/aquarium...ive-foods-for-the-coral-reef-aquarium-part-2/

Bear in mind that the article was written for SW keepers, but a lot of it applies to FW as well. The article discusses other foods we aliso use in fw and there is some specific info on fw feeding. You will learn a lot by reading it.

Despite the article being from 2004 it is still some of the better information I have read re live foods. After the Brine section it covers a number of relevant topics which include: Tubifex or Black Worms, Freshwater Crustaceans, The Water Fleas ( Daphnia And Their Relatives), Freshwater Copepods (e.g., Cyclops ), Freshwater Amphipods (e.g., Gammarus ), Mosquito Larvae, Ghost Shrimp And Crayfish, Squid, Shrimp, Mussels Or Clams On The Half Shell and Macroalgae, Nori Or Leafy Vegetables.

He also Cites the 16 articles he has quoted from or referenced in the paper.
 
I hsve no idea. What is your concern?
I guess I trying to understand if it’s easy to see where the live shrimp are so I don’t collect too much debris. A shaft from the wheat question.
 
I can tell you that when I was had my angels spawn in a community tank I had to pull the eggs to hatch them and then grow them out in their own grow tank, Early oine they really do need live food and then was when I had to hatch out BBS. I had just gotten the first spawn go free swimming and I was going away for a weekend. I got a couple of in tank brine shrimp hatcheries. The device below goes inside a tank.
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https://piscespets.com/blogs/feature-products/tom-aquarium-brine-shrimp-hatch-n-feede

Brine Shrimp Corral​


This unit can be used in both marine & freshwater tanks. The eggs start hatching in approximately 18 - 24 hours. Hatched shrimp will swim out of the corral and into the aquarium as they mature!

Directions​


  • Keep the water temperature between 77°F - 83°F
  • Connect the airline tubing and air pump
  • Remove the partition in the hatchling chamber
  • Wait a few minutes for salt to dissolve into water
  • Insert the partition into the groves
  • Place brine shrimp eggs into the hatchling chamber
  • hatched shrimp will swim out into the aquarium
  • Total sequence will take approximately 24 - 30 hours
  • Read the included operation instructions before use
 
I get no shells in my feedings. It's easy.

First, I hatch the artemia (5 days a week for 30 years) in homemade hatchers made from pop bottles. Air bubbles keep the hatchery rocking. When I harvest, I take the airline off the gang valve from the air pump, and wait five minutes. In suddenly still water, the eggs float up and the bbs go to the bottom. You can see them in the photo. I then drain them out through a fine net and feed. The shells are up at the top.

Carbonated drink bottles very in size, so you can tailor the bottle to the amount you want. You just have to experiment with the salinity.

The source of the cysts matters. I used to get low grade Utah cysts at a local marine store. They imported from brine shrimp direct (BSD). I did have a lot of shells relative to the hatch rate. I found a source for better, but pricier BSD, and the shells were way less of a problem. Economy cysts aren't great. The mostly dead ones in pet shop tubes are awful, and messy. I had a source of very tiny Russian artemia at one point, and they were very easy to manage. I now use a Chinese source with phenomenal hatch rates, but that may not be as rich as the larger American ones. For what I'm doing, slight differences are unimportant.
 

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I get no shells in my feedings. It's easy.

First, I hatch the artemia (5 days a week for 30 years) in homemade hatchers made from pop bottles. Air bubbles keep the hatchery rocking. When I harvest, I take the airline off the gang valve from the air pump, and wait five minutes. In suddenly still water, the eggs float up and the bbs go to the bottom. You can see them in the photo. I then drain them out through a fine net and feed. The shells are up at the top.

Carbonated drink bottles very in size, so you can tailor the bottle to the amount you want. You just have to experiment with the salinity.

The source of the cysts matters. I used to get low grade Utah cysts at a local marine store. They imported from brine shrimp direct (BSD). I did have a lot of shells relative to the hatch rate. I found a source for better, but pricier BSD, and the shells were way less of a problem. Economy cysts aren't great. The mostly dead ones in pet shop tubes are awful, and messy. I had a source of very tiny Russian artemia at one point, and they were very easy to manage. I now use a Chinese source with phenomenal hatch rates, but that may not be as rich as the larger American ones. For what I'm doing, slight differences are unimportant.
Do rinse the BBS before adding to the tank?
 
Do rinse the BBS before adding to the tank?
I don't. With what I'm hatching now, in about 750ml of water I use one heaping teaspoon of fine sea salt from a bulk food store. With US cysts, I used more salt, but either way the amount of water or salt going in no worry to me. It's never caused any issues.

I use the net full of bbs after the shrimp are drained and feed using the point of a sharp knife to scoop. I am feeding 30 tanks at times though, so I have to measure like that.
 
After the babies have hatched, how do you maximize separation of shells etc from the BBS? I read one can purchase two sieves held in tandem with different mesh counts: one which hold on to shell debri but lets the babies pass through and the second mesh which catches the babies. Is this what you do?
I use a Ziss Hatchery with bottom drain but a smaller one of similar design would be similar. The keys to separation of BBS from eggs and shells are:
-correct ratio of proper salt to water (I use Instant Ocean)
-air line to keep eggs moving
-constant temperature (80f)
-premium eggs
-24-36 hour hatching time
-I use a light the entire time (not sure how essential)
-turn of the overhead light, air and add a bottom light
10 minutes be for harvesting
-slowly drain the bbs into a 200 sieve, avoiding floating shells
-rinse the bbs in fresh water to remove salt and feed to fish
-thoroughly clean the hatchery and sieve for the next hatch

If done this way there will be minimum, if any, shells or unhatched eggs in the batch.
 

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