anyone had success keeping panda gara in the warmer temperature of their stated range???

[Magnum Man]

I have a couple tanks with thriving panda garas, but they are both cool water tanks... I've tried adding them to a couple of my tropical temperature tanks, and they've never taken... I know they require highly oxygenated water and a lot of movement... both failed tanks are soft to neutral water, and are highly filtered tanks, with large air stones... I've found the garas to be the best plant caretakers for my various anubias... the anubias in both tanks with the garas have nice green polished leaves... otherwise the anubias tend to get a build up over time, on older leaves... if I could, I'd add one to any tank with live plants, but I just can't get them to thrive in the tropical temp tanks, which most sources say they can tolerate... I know the warmer tanks, can't hold as much oxygen, as the cooler water, but in my tanks I'm trying to oxygenate as much as practical... so I'm curious the set ups where people have kept them in tropical temp tanks???

 

[GaryE]

I think they're telling you something....

 

[Magnum Man]

like the printed temperature ranges should be lowered ( at least the higher temps ) maybe printed that way, because cool water tanks aren't as popular as tropical tanks, to sell more fish??? they don't die immediately, they just don't last long enough to grow to adulthood... the group in my cool water hillstream tank have gone from 1/2 inch at arrival to almost 5 inches over a couple years... the group in the cool water bitterling, tank have just arrived recently, but appear to be doing well, and the little, suffering, nana anubias in that tank, has some bright green polished leaves, since they were added to that tank...

maybe I should add a group of tank bred Oto's to the warmer tanks... I've had the wild caught before, but they also did not live real long... I think about a year has been my best there, and that was a zebra oto...

both my cool water tanks range between 71 and 72 degrees F.

this from one on line source...

"RECOMMENDED TANK PARAMETERS:

• Temperature: 71.6° - 80.6° F (22° - 27° C)
• pH: 6.5 - 7.5
• KH: 6 - 10 dKH
• Minimum tank size: 30 gallons for a small group"

this from Seriously Fish...
Temperature: Normally said to prefer cooler conditions but temperatures in its native streams have been recorded between 22 – 27 °C during warmer months of the year. Presumably during the wet months of the monsoon these values are lesser.

pH: The pH in its natural waters has been measured at 6.9 – 7.1 with a range of 6.5 – 7.5 recommended in aquaria."

 

[Naughts]

I know the warmer tanks, can't hold as much oxygen, as the cooler water

I suspect their very specific oxygen requirements may override the temperature issue and your point here is pertinent. You have the filter, air stones and plants oxygenating the tank. Also consider practices like low stocking, significant regular water changes and good maintenance (filter and substrate cleaning) to stop that oxygen being depleted.

A wholistic approach will ensure their expectations are met. They are a social species so will thrive in groups and not individually. They need to graze constantly, so a mature tank with good lighting for lots of natural biofilm will keep be them healthy. They appear to like digging in a sand substrate.

I don’t know if I will have longer term success with my young panda garra but their tank is 74f/24c. I hope so, because I think they’re great.

 

[Magnum Man]

coincidentally , and highly unusual for me, the 2 warmer tanks I've tried them in, aren't heavily stocked, one has pebbles on the bottom, the other sand, and I have lots of RO water on hand, and do 1/3 power water changes weekly, or bimonthly...

 

[GaryE]

Oxygen is one consideration with temperature, but so is seasonal adjustment, and with some fish, digestion. A panda garra may be at its high range for part of its lifespan, but there is probably fluctuation. Or, the ones in hot springs that are abused by spas may have adaptations that all panda garra might not. That's an idea to consider.

In many fish, a limiting factor on their spread as species is digestive enzymes. At the extremes of their tolerance, they grow slowly and don't thrive because they can't digest their food well enough. In nature, species with different needs that thrive in different temperatures (with different enzymes) replace them.

It's known from killie studies, but I know of no studies of Garra.

Seasonally, the classic example is the "oxbow trap". Many species from rainy/dry season habitats have the ability to go into a cruise control state when things get dry, and can survive in poor aquarium conditions and crowding for a long time as they have adaptations to shrinking, evaporating pools in rivers that have stopped flowing. Their bodies wait for the rains to kick back into gear. A lot of short sighted aquarists recreate the dry season conditions with no water changes, high pollutants, over crowding and high temperatures, and think they're emulating nature. To a degree they are, only nature can be harsh and nasty.

If I ever get collected for the mammal tank of some extra terrestrial, I hope it doesn't decide I want to live my whole life in the freezing winds and heavy snowfall outside my window now, as I'm typing. It is my habitat and my ancestors knew how to survive it and make it to Spring, but I'd do better in May than in January.

The ability to stay alive when things are bad, and the desirability of things being to be endured are different.

 

[Magnum Man]

it sounds like their natural temperatures vary seasonally a lot... hard to mimic in the aquarium, so offering them a "paradise" temperature somewhere in the middle seems our best option... though my group of 5 in my hillstream tank are seeming to thrive, although not reproduce, but that tank is at the very bottom of their temperature range... but seriously fish makes the comment "Normally said to prefer cooler conditions"

I've read of people keeping them in their tropical community tanks, was just hoping to hear from some...

 

[Back in the fold]

Are they a river fish ?

 

[Magnum Man]

I believe so, they love fast moving highly oxygenated water...

 

[FishBR]

I have successfully kept 4 panda garras for more than 5 years now. As far as oxygenation goes, I have the output of the canister filter pointed to the surface, plus a sponge filter. I also have a powerhead to increase water circulation in my 75g tank. I keep them at 77F (25C), which I assume is not in the high-temperature range you are referring to.

 

[Back in the fold]

I have yet to see these at Panda Express .