Anybody Here Breed Bolivian Rams

[philak]

I have three Bolivian Rams in my g/fs tank that are starting to mature. In a previous thread when they were younger i put pics on here and it was suggested there may be two females and a male which would have been extremely lucky.

As they have matured though all three of the fish would appear to have female vents (at least in profile), but then they all have longer 2nd and 3rd rays on the dorsal fin and the heads of at least two have developed forehead ridges( I think the 3rd fish may just be younger as it's colour is also less pronounced). In other words what some people class as male characteristics. They show no sign that i can see of pairing off and breeding and the mouth to mouth grappling is obviously not mating behaviour in this case (or its the longest courtship in history).I'd like to leave a pair in my g/fs tank if possible and take the remaining Ram to my tank to pair off with a newbie once i know their sex.

Does anybody here actually breed them? Rather than me posting more pics and people giving their best guess i would either like to go somewhere local or see pics of definite males/ females from someone who is in the know and maybe even buy a properly sexed partner for these Rams from them if they are willing to sell.

I'm in Wiltshire/Dorset area.

Cheers

 

[meguro]

There's much less guessing involved with mature rams.

 

[meguro]

Here's a photo of one of my males. Crank up your monitor brightness to see it easier.

 

[philak]

Thanks Meguro. At least one of my Rams looks very much like that in terms of head shape,colouring, tail fin extensions and pelvic fin extensions. A second is also very similar but the extensions aren't so obvious yet. The main difference in both of those is the shape of the vents, which according to the pics i have seen looks more female , hence the confusion.

From all the stuff i've looked up, yours has the classic male vent shape i would expect to see.

I've packed my camera and tripod for the weekend to try and get some decent shots of all 3.

Cheers

 

[philak]

Managed to get pics of two of them. The third that i havent captured yet has the most obvious fin extns. Tell me what you think these two are to start with?

 

[meguro]

both female

 

[philak]

"both female"

What degree of certainty are we talking about here? If the third one is also female what are the chances of me randomly picking 3 females out of a tankful when i bought them? Are you going on vent shape or other factors too?

If you are right then i'm in a pretty good situation to start breeding them

Finally got a pic of number 3:

 

[Faythee]

First 2 look female to me. Males have more color and their dorsal would have extended points at the front and back. In the 3rd picture.....is the tail fin pointed or is that somthing in the background ?

 

[philak]

Tail fin of the third is pointed yes. How old do they need to be to mate?

 

[meguro]

Males have more color and their dorsal would have extended points at the front and back. In the 3rd picture.....is the tail fin pointed or is that somthing in the background ?

females can have all of those traits. easiest way is vent + body shape with consideration of other traits

6-9 months old they should be mature enough to breed

Better pics of 1 and 3 (horizontal like pic 2, not looking down on the fish like 1 and 3 are) would help but it looks like you have 2 females and 1 male. With the fish in pic 2 being the maturest and the fish in pics 1 and 3 the youngest. I don't think they'd try breeding until another 1-2 months.

 

[philak]

Thanks all. I'll give it a few more months and see what happens i suppose. If i can get better pics i will but the tank is planted and it's proving hard to get good whole body shots.

Thanks again.

 

[coldcazzie]

I have that problem - plus I think mine have cottoned on and as soon as I appear with the camera they shoot off behind the bogwood (very much a different reaction to me appearing to feed them, then they wait expectantly at the surface!).

I'm adopting a wait and see approach, and have a friend who can rehome one (I have 3) if it ever seems necessary. 2 are definitely males. The third is yet to be determined.

 

[philak]

Know what you mean Cazzie,,,, when the camera appears they either shoot off behind something or stare straight at me which is no good. As i try to outflank them they just slowly rotate and follow me headfirst