Ammonium Hydroxide

[bikerfish]

Hi ALL
Quick question please , I am starting my tank from afresh and last time did not no about the fishless cycle but want to do it right this time .
 
Where can I buy ammonium hydroxide from please ?  would some where like Tesco sell it
cheers
cathy

 

[daizeUK]

Tesco's won't sell it, most places don't.  Try Homebase, if they don't sell it there then your best bet is to order Kleenoff from the internet.

 

[Ch4rlie]

Tescos, Asda, Sainsburys, as far as I am aware, don't sell ammonium.
 
Homebase sells Household Ammonia - that contains about 9.5 % ammonium hydroxide. About £2.79 or something like that. 
Make sure that when you shake the bottle it does not froth, if just a few bubbles that disappears quickly then should be ok.
 
You can do as daize says, order online for Kleenoff which is fairly popular brand and does work.
 
I got my ammonia from eBay, a little more expensive at around £5 (inc p&p) 
IMO better quality as this is specially just for Aquarium Cycling, on eBay you can get this aquarium ammonia, do note that is much stronger at 35% so you will need to calculate doses carefully. 
 
I've just finished doing a fishless cycle using this ammonia, no problems at all.
 
Pic is from eBay : 

 

[bikerfish]

Hi cheers for getting back , ive just been to tescos and homebase and neither had this , thinking I will go on line .
I bought interpet new aquarium start up kit and started that Saturday but when reading there booklet it has no mention in there about testing ammonia only nitrite on day 7 .
Are these kits any good ?
cathy

 

[Ch4rlie]

Homebase do have it, you will find it in household cleaning, i had a time finding it in Homebase as well!
 
Yeah, Interpret won't say much about ammonia as they are probably aimed for fish in cycles or something like that. I'd ignore that booklet IMO.
As for the kit, hit or miss really. Some work and some don't. 

 
You will be much better trying to get a tried and tested product providing their use/sell by dates are well within their expiry date, Dr Tim's One and Only is a popular brand on this forum. 
 
Products like Tetra Safe Start are basically hit or miss really, these products do not like being mixed with the dechlorintor you need for tap water so that works against you straightaway and becomes complicated really.
 
The very best thing that you could do is to ask a fishkeeping friend or someone on this forum perhaps, you may get some from your LFS if you beg/plead/buy for some of their mature filter media. That will give you the best in getting your fishless cycle to a good start.
 
Also have a read of reading this forum's 'Cycling a Tank' link if you have not already done so :
 
http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?/topic/421488-cycling-your-new-fresh-water-tank-read-this-first/
 
Buying ammonia from whichever source suits you best, Homebase or online and getting hold of Dr Tim's One and Only or mature media being your best choices really.
 
Its worth doing things this way.

 

[bikerfish]

Hi read your link earlier cheers any way , my homebase def did not have it , going to try b@q tomorrow , I asked at my local lfs and a no go on Saturday for media .
I hate this as had tank for 3 years and use to looking at  me fish , but had something nasty in there that slowly killed my fish off , so shut it down .
I still have 4 left in my small quarantine tank but do not want to touch media from there just in case, plus had some strong meds going on .
I miss my fish
Want to do this right as can not bare to lose any more
cheers for your help
cathy

 

[bikerfish]

Hi I called into my local aquatic shop and asked if they had any aquarium ammonia and the gentleman I spoke to told me to put  a few raw prawns or mussels in the tank , put them in a bag of some sort but so the water can flow through as this will add the ammonia into the tank and to test after 4 days and take out old prawn and add new , then when reading of ammonia starts then to start putting live bacteria in and this will cycle the tank.
I have added few raw prawn into a fry tank so the water can floe through and will test on Friday to see if I get a reading of ammonia .
He said as the fish breaks down it has the same effect as adding ammonia into tank and also work out a bit cheaper , which if this works will be slightly
cathy

 

[daizeUK]

It does break down to ammonia, the problem is you have no idea how much and can't control it.  It will also stink and foul up your tank.

 

[Ch4rlie]

Was about to say what Diaze just said basically! 
 
While any decomposing matter will actually produce ammonia, it will also mess up your water.
 
Quoted from Cycling a Tank by TTA :
 
"Fish food or shrimp allowed to rot in a tank will produce ammonia. They will also produce some other nasty looking stuff there is no reason to have fouling a tank. This method does not allow one to have any control over how much ammonia is introduced or when. And rotting food can cause a bacterial bloom (not the bacteria we want) which turns the water very cloudy.  We advise against using this to create ammonia in your tank."
 
If you have already read 'Cycling a Tank' you will also see that you will need to dose the tank with 3ppm ammonia when :
 
Quoted from 'Cycling a Tank' 
 
"If at any time you test and ammonia is under .75 ppm and nitrite is clearly over 2 ppm, it is time to add more ammonia. Add the same full amount as you did the first time. Now, begin to test the ammonia and nitrite levels every other day. (You should be seeing nitrate soon if you have the kit.)"
 
And this is just one stage, you will also need to do maintenance snacks as well as full doses of 3ppm ammonia at relevant stages.
 
How will you accurately add this ammonia if you are using decomposing matter?
 
So I will recommend once again you try and get some ammonia from either a hardware store or from an online website as I've already shown in an earlier post on this thread.
 
Cycling a tank, for me at least, was not particularly easy to understand and I read that link over and over again during the processes and slowly began to understand how this worked and really do appreciate how much it actually benefitted me and of course for the stocking of my tank.
 
While I actually cycled my tank without too much trouble, I did worry a lot and asked some silly questions that am sure TTA shook his head and tutted at but in the end with his patience and understanding along with advice from others in this forum, my cycling worked and felt an enormous sense of achievemnet that I followed everything correctly and cycled successfully. And soon after I fully stocked my tank in one weekend 

 

[bikerfish]

Hi All
I have order some ammonia from amazon , will be delivered next week but want to do this right

I took the prawns out earlier this evening , they were only in the tank for a couple of hours
cathy

 

[Ch4rlie]

Great!
 
Whew, was getting worried you were letting yourself in for a whole heap of trouble and hard work trying to cycle your tank with a few prawns.
 
This did actually used to be the way things were done by some people years ago or by adding fish food as well was another way but certainly not worth doing now. 
 
Let us know how you get on and hopefully in just a few weeks time you be so glad you did things this way. 
If you get stuck, unsure or need advice, just let us know and we'll be glad to help out in whatever way we can. 

 

[bikerfish]

Hi will do.
I have had to restart my tank with all new except tank itself as had something nasty in there and no one could work out exactly what it was and lost a lot of fish so do not want to make any more mistakes

Hopefully what ever it was has gone now.
cheers for all your advice
cathy

 

[paradiddle]

Hey i had this problem in the UK too this year when i did a fishless cycle, i had to order it off ebay (only place i found it, tried all shops within 25m and found nothing.
 
If your close to me i could give you whats left of my bottle...

 

[bikerfish]

HI cheers for offer well appreciated but should be here hoping Saturday all crossed , you would think the local lfs would sell it.
cathy

 

[TwoTankAmin]

Just an FYI in case there is any confusion. Ammonia is a gas and is highly toxic and very dangerous. This is why we can't just buy pure ammonia to cycle a tank. But ammonium is basically a salt of ammonia which when added to water will have some portion convert to the gaseous form (unless the water is acid).
 
So ammonium is used. However, this means it is not found as the lone ingredient, there needs to be something else. This can be ammonium hydroxide or ammonium chloride. The former is a form with a very high pH and the latter a lower pH. Ammonium hydroxide is a weak base, an aqueous compound in normal state. Ammonium chloride is a an acidic salt and is a white powder in normal state.
 
Both will provide the needed ammonia for fishless cycling- they will just affect the pH differently. Oh yes, you can buy ammonium chloride as a dry powder and mix it with ro/di water to make your own solution. Or you can buy it pre-mixed from Dr. Tim's or as illustrated above in post #3 by Ch4rlie,