Ammonia, Scale And Fin Damage

[twodoctors]

I really don't know what's going on now. Let's start from the beginning.

Request Help

Tank size: 215L
pH: 7.8
ammonia: 0.25 (was 0 for a few weeks prior)
nitrite: 0
nitrate: 10
kH: don't know
gH: 9
tank temp: 25C

Fish Symptoms (include full description including lesion, color, location, fish behavior): All fine except my male sajica, see below

Volume and Frequency of water changes: daily for the last few days, see below

Chemical Additives or Media in your tank: SeaChem Prime (used to be Aquasafe)

Tank inhabitants: 12 tiger barbs, 6 boesemani rainbows, 6 corys, 2 sajica

Recent additions to your tank (living or decoration): nil for a week

Exposure to chemicals: None

Digital photo (include if possible): when I get a chance

I started cycling my tank in early Dec and finished just before Christmas. I added 6 tiger barbs before and 6 after Christmas. Absolutely no problem with ammonia or nitrite.

Then I had problem with planaria 2 weeks ago. Turned out all my food and poo are falling between the coarse gravel I used to have. So I changed it to fine gravel/sand. Rechecked water 2 days later, no problem. I added 3 boesemani and 6 corys after that. Tested the water daily, still stable. Added another 3 boesemani two days later. Water still stable for 2 days. Added 2 sajicas. Did a water change. Rinsed out the filter as well as it was covered in muck and slowing the flow. I rinsed the biomedia as well as it was slightly dusty from the bits that got through the filter. All done with old tank water.

Water ok for about 2 days, then ammonia started climbing. Ammonia was 0.25, nitrite 0 on Sunday, so I did a 50% change. Rechecked on Wednesday. Ammonia 0.5 nitrite 0, so I did 75% change and really disturb the gravel. Found quite a bit of muck, so siphoned that off as well. Have been doing that with 50% change yesterday and today. Ammonia was still 0.25 before water change, nitrite 0. There isn't really much poo or dead plant stuff now. So I can't really understand why my tank has uncycled itself in the first place. I thought if my bio filter is trying to catch up I would get ammonia and nitrite rise, not just ammonia.

They are all small fishes, so I don't think I'm overstock. I did have tablet feeds, which broke down rather rapidly and caused a bit of pollution. I think I got most of it with my recent gravel cleaning. The corys would have taken care of that in any case as their food is being eaten by the barbs and sajicas. I recently changed from Aquasafe to SeaChem Prime. Got it from ebay and I think it is genuine. All the fishes are pretty happy except water change time.

The only problem fish I have at the moment is my male sajica. I noticed a bit of damage to his scales, which prompted me to check my water in the first place. That damage is actually getting better, but he is getting a few more in other places. His pectoral fins are slightly damage as well, and one of them has a white spot on it. It is too big for ick, and not really that fluffy enough for fungus (I think). It hasn't changed in size over the last 5 days.

Photo - note fin and two area of damage. The one at the back is improving. The one in front is new. The sajica has paired up and doing things together. I don't think she is attacking him. She has a breeding tube down, he hasn't yet. The barbs are afraid of them both, though they live happily together in the tank.

I'll try to upload the video.

Thanks. And please help!

Adrian

 

[Rynofasho]

I can't really comment on the actual ailment of your fish, but as for the ammonia spikes and the like, you introduced a LOT of fish in a very short time period.

It sounds like you finished your cycle and had 12 fish for a bit, and then you more than doubled your stock in less than a one week period.

In the future, take it easy on the speed at which you stock. The bacteria in your filter are only going to continue to grow (colony wise) until they are able to constantly consume all the waste put off. When you add 9 new fish, you need to give the tank a week, and ideally maybe even 10 days to continue to build up the necessary bacteria to consume the larger amount of waste that is now in your tank. Sounds like you caused a spike which induced some stress in the fish and as a result the are more susceptible to disease and infection.

Slow and steady wins the race

 

[twodoctors]

Note the left pectoral fin damage and right pectoral fin white spot. Also the scale damage.

I know I added too many fishes in too short a period of time. My fishes and I are paying for it now. But I thought I would be getting both ammonia and nitrite spike, not just ammonia alone. My nitrite is steady at zero. I'm using a farily new API liquid kit.

Adrian

 

[Rynofasho]

It might take a few days to see the subsequent nitrite spike. Regardless, the effect on the fish would be pretty much identical in regards to stress. I feel like I over advertise this product, but if you dont condition your water with Seachem Prime, I would strongly consider it. Besides the affect it has on chlorine / chloramine, it also detoxifies ammonia and nitrites so while they will still be present and measurable in the tank, they won't be harmful.

Hoping someone else can chime in as to the actual ailment as I know very little about fish disease (minus my first case of Ich I'm about to begin treating today).

 

[twodoctors]

It might take a few days to see the subsequent nitrite spike. Regardless, the effect on the fish would be pretty much identical in regards to stress. I feel like I over advertise this product, but if you dont condition your water with Seachem Prime, I would strongly consider it. Besides the affect it has on chlorine / chloramine, it also detoxifies ammonia and nitrites so while they will still be present and measurable in the tank, they won't be harmful.

Hoping someone else can chime in as to the actual ailment as I know very little about fish disease (minus my first case of Ich I'm about to begin treating today).

Thanks. I am already using SeaChem Prime. I switch from Aquasafe and I wonder whether I was sold a fake bottle of the stuff. The fishes seems ok in terms of ammonia level... I am not seeing gasping etc from them. They seemed very happy, just very hungry as I am trying to lower my ammonia load. I think I have got most if not all the dead leaves etc out. Same with uneaten food I think. I will probably have to feed them tomorrow, just a bit. Another day of filtering the sand tomorrow and I'll put the tank back together on Sunday and then just change water.

I wonder what is happening to my fish though...

Adrian

 

[star4]

If the females breeding tube is down it looks like she is biting at him, basically telling him off she is nearly ready to spawn. The white spot on the fin could be a calcium lump, these happen sometimes when fins are damaged and its where its repairing itself, like a broken bone does. Looks nothing to worry about to me, I have seen loads of little bite marks like these on pairs.

 

[twodoctors]

If the females breeding tube is down it looks like she is biting at him, basically telling him off she is nearly ready to spawn. The white spot on the fin could be a calcium lump, these happen sometimes when fins are damaged and its where its repairing itself, like a broken bone does. Looks nothing to worry about to me, I have seen loads of little bite marks like these on pairs.

Thanks Star4. That's very reassuring. I was worried there's some other problem with my water.

I shall continue cleaning the sand as planned and redo the tank on Sunday.

Do you think I should get these coconut shell for them to hide/breed in? I already have a "helmet" and "vase" for hiding. Thanks.

eBay Coconut Cave

 

[star4]

The 2 I looked after showed no interest in a coconut or caves they spawned on a rock for me. You could try a flat smooth stone down behind the helmet, there looks nice all round cover there, turn the helmet round so the entrance is not facing the front of the tank so much and they might spawn on the stone them move the fry into the helmet.

Forgot to say, some extra wc for your ammonia etc (but you already know that) they might be holding off till the water is just right.