Advice For Newbie In A Mess

[socmwils23]

Ok here is my situation and im hoping that some kind soul here will be able to help me out. I recently came into possession of a fish tank from a relative who is no longer able to take care of them. To say the tank was dirty was an understatement. I managed to ascertain from her that the tank is a juwel Lido 120 and that she hadnt changed any filter in it for over 4 months (she has been ill). From reading the tanks instructions i can see one of the filters needs to be changed once a week.

Now inside the tank the water level had dropped to below the filter intake so im not sure the water was actually being filtered at all. There was thick algae all over the glass making looking in difficult and also a huge ball of algae taking up over half the tank. The gravel at the bottom looked like thick sludge and a couple of live plants at the back (i use the term live loosely) had started to rot and decompose. So i used this forum and other sites for tips on what to do and learnt about how to clean etc and then planned on doing a fishless cycle and starting afresh. My knowledge was/is zero but the useful guides here and elsewhere made me think i could do it and when it was setup properly would be a good addition to the room as some look stunning.

All good so far until the problem occured. The lady said the fish had all died and she hadnt seen any for a couple of months which is why she hadnt kept up the maintenance. From the little you could see in the tank there were no fish. How wrong was I. It turns out there are 5 fish still alive. This was discovered when we got 3/4 of the way through emptying the water and i saw one move and then another etc.

So to cut a long story short i got the tank home and the fish and cleaned out the tank before replacing the fish into a nice new clean tank. I know this was probably the wrong thing to do but i panicked so now i have a clean tank with five fish and a filter system that is gunked up but i havent touched yet as the cleaning advice is to clean first and replace the filter a week or so later.

So what do i do? The fish which im told are 2x corydora, one yellow algae sucker, one penguin tetra and a neon tetra should by rights be dead with all i have read but they are now swimming happily in there new clean tank.

So my questions are as follows:

When do i change the filters and in what timeframe?
Given i cant do a fishless cycle do i have to follow some other cycle system or because my filter is old and gunky could this change things?
i would like to add fish eventually but at the moment im thinking i should wait till these depart and then start from scratch with a fishless cycle as i had planned but given there still alive after all this im thinking i may be able to add to them in a couple of months if i can get my head round on how to proceedfrom here.

So like i said hopefully some kind sould can help and advise. I will be getting a water testing kit later on today so will be able to post results from that later but my main query is what to do with the gunked up filter?

 

[loraxchick]

Dont change the filter. If it is gunked up give the media in the filter a few good swishes around in dechlorinated water to get rid of as much "gunk" as you can. You can clean the filter housing but do not get rid of the media. 4 months isnt all that old for media to be honest. They only say change once a week to make money. If that were the rule there would never be any cycled tanks. I have media that is well over a year old. when the flow in the filter slows or it looks "gunky" i just take the media and swish it around in a bucket of old tank water during a waterchange and then right back in the filter it goes.
as far as the rest of the tank just keep up with maintenance. Do partial water changes and gravel vac/algae scrape each week. In no time the tank will come around. You can take decor out and scrub it under hot tap water to clean.
what kind of fishes are left?
all the best
cheers

 

[Tizer]

The gunk in the filter no doubt contains plenty of good bacteria, dont be too hasty to clean it out / replace.

Might help to list what type of filter it is then if it needs a clean people can advise how to go about it.

People say clean filter sponges in tank water, as long as you dechlorinated the water you put in, you should be able to scoop out a jug load and give the sponges a squeeze in it then replace.

Give that a week then perhaps give your white filter media a dunk in tank water to wash off any fish waste then job done really.

The main killers will be ammonia and nitrite, high nitrate, although wont kill unless its very very high, will just leave fish open to infections. Small weekly water changes will keep it low.

I'd also leave them without a tank light for a few days to help deal with any stress. Also, be careful not to over feed them, im sure the temptation will be high to feed and "cheer them up" but too much might just kill them off.

 

[markandhisfish]

agreed , youre on the right track already , and as loraxchick said the whole change filter every week is pure moneymaking nonsense by juwel . what size is the tank the fish are in , what are they , and how many of each? from there we can better advise on what to do for stocking. in the meantime keep an eye on your stats for ammonia/nitrite and keep up on your weekly maintainence.

and above all dont panic , youre going about things the right way

 

[Gvilleguy]

What a journey this is for you. I can't give better advice than you already received. Just subscribing to this thread so that I can follow your results. Would love some pictures, too.

 

[socmwils23]

Hi cheers for the advice. The tank is a juwel lido 120 which given the manual takes juwel compact filters. Theres a white flossy type one, a black carbon one, two blue sponges, some stones and then two more blue sponges. The white flossy one is now just mud in all honesty.

The fish are one penguin tetra, one neon tetra, two x corydoras and one large yellow thing which sucks on the glass a lot. That one is a bit aggressive and chases the others about a fair bit when he cant be bothered sucking.

I just did a tank water test and got the following:

PH is 8.0 or 8.2 i cant decide which it is closest too.
ammonia is 0
nitrite is 0
and nitrate is closer to 5 than 0 id say so ill go with 5.

Now if i only knew what that meant!!

Cheers for the help so far,

 

[Gvilleguy]

Those test results are great, considering how you found the tank. You want ammonia and nitrite to be zero, and nitrate as low as possible. 5 is nothing.

 

[markandhisfish]

theres a good pinned topic in the beginners resource centre on the nitrgogen cycle , but for now il gove you the quick version so you can better understand your results .

fish produce waste in the form of ammonia , your filter proccesses this ammonia which then turns it into nitrite. the nitrate is then turned into nitrate which the filter cant remove , this is done via your waterchange .

this is the better longer explenation

http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=271928&hl=

the beginners resource centre is a pinned thread at the top of the new freshwater tank section of the forum

 

[Essjay]

The white flossy pad is one that does need changing. It goes all shapeless when you try to wash it more than a couple of times. It's very thin compared to the others and won't hold many bacteria. But don't buy Juwel ones, they are expensive. You can buy rolls of the stuff much cheaper and cut it to shape. Pond filter wool is even cheaper.

The blue sponges and the stones (perhaps cirax?) are the main home for the filter bacteria, and these should only be washed gently in old tank water, never under the tap. The black sponge is impregnated with carbon. As it's been in there a long time, it'll be full and will no longer adsorb anything, but it will be full of bacteria. I'd wait till you're sure everything is running fine, then decide whether or not to keep it or replace it with more blue sponge - carbon isn't actually needed.

 

[Tizer]

the fact that ammonia and nitrite are 0 probably means the filter is in good nick for bacteria, the nitrate is quite strangely very low! (test your tap ater levels, would be interesting to know what that reads for nitrate)

You dont have many fish in there to put the filter to the test really, i would leave it be for while. Its the white stones that the bacteria cling to although the "muddy sponge" probably has a lot of good bacteria in it too. You could take it out, give it one squeeze in tank water then replace it. Leave the tank going as it is and test the water every 24 hours. If you get any ammonia / nitrate readings, do a 10% water change. rinse and repeat. give it two weeks, then give the sponge another squeeze. Sponges only need replacing when they rot away, what you consider muddy and dirty, is probably whats keeping your tank so clean and is doing more good than bad.

 

[karin]

Given how much filter material you have, I would just take the filter floss out and get rid of it. Your other sponges and material have more of the bacteria and if you have a good testing kit you can watch for a mini-cycle and respond with water changes. My guess is you won't have a mini-cycle though. Once things are under control again you can see about adding in the filter floss again. Good luck.

 

[socmwils23]

the fact that ammonia and nitrite are 0 probably means the filter is in good nick for bacteria, the nitrate is quite strangely very low! (test your tap ater levels, would be interesting to know what that reads for nitrate)/quote]

Just done that test and it comes back as 0.

From what you are all saying i got lucky with the filter and so long as results stay consistant and i dont see any spikes etc then i may be able to add fish in a few weeks which would be nice. My worry is one mentioned above though that the fish are not producing enough waste to test out the filter. The last thing i want to do is to think its all ok only to find it wasnt. The fishless cycle guide shows that the ammonia decreases etc with time and you can be sure its ready. This way seems a bit more guesswork. Maybe im just on information overload with it all as i have been reading loads of material over the last 24 hours.

 

[Tizer]

Well the neons prefer to be in a group and they are extremely cheap to buy. Some people cycle tanks with a small number of fish and its always the cheap ones because you dont really want to risk the more expensive ones snuffing it. They are also extremely small and the amount they eat and waste they produce is obviously smaller than larger fish.

If you wanted to, you could put the filter under a little more pressure and stick half a dozen of them in there and see how the tank goes for a week or two.

If say in two weeks your tank is stable, no signs of the nasty stuff, you could introduce a couple more corydoras. These too feel safer in small groups and easy to look after. Aim for a total of six. You can always add more later when you are super confident the tank is ok.

People prefer fishless cycles because you dont have to panic about the wellfare of your fish every day. As you already have fish and you have a filter which is pretty well cycled (although messy), you could well get away without having to cycle it.

You always have the option of taking the fish to a local shop, telling them you are going to do a fishless cycle on your tank and ask them to look after them for you. There is a good chance they will, if they know you are going to buy a few fish off them i the future.

Its really down to the amount of time you can put into the tank really.

A breeder will change 50% of a tanks water on a daily basis, sometimes more, so dont worry about water changes having a negative effect, as long as you dechlorinate it. although obviously your not breeding, so the amount of ammonia in the tank, (if it appears) often dictates how much water you should change.

If you went to a public swimming pool, im sure you would be swimming around in a small amount of p1ss, but you cant taste it. Its the same with ammonia, think of it as fish p1ss, they dont like it either

 

[socmwils23]

I think my plan now is to wait it out two weeks and see what happens. If my tests produce the same results consistently ill add a 3 or 4 more fish. Gives it some time whereby if anything is going to go wrong it will in next 14 days id imagine. I had a look around and know ultimately id love angel fish but not sure if there a beginner fish and i know mixing them and neons is a bad idea for the neons.

The pet shop is a great idea in theory but we only have a pets at home nearby and the horror stories i have read about them mean i wouldn't trust them with any thing. So two weeks to monitor and plan my potential next fish. Never thought id be saying that 24 hours ago.

 

[Warehouse]

I think my plan now is to wait it out two weeks and see what happens. If my tests produce the same results consistently ill add a 3 or 4 more fish. Gives it some time whereby if anything is going to go wrong it will in next 14 days id imagine.

Great plan. Keep the thread updated please?