80 Gallon Aquarium In Cycle With 20 Year Old Fish :(

[rrats]

this is my first time to this forum, i'm hoping to get a reasonable solution here...
 
first of all, the reason my 80 gallon aquarium is cycling is MY OWN FAULT... and i suspected i'd throw it into cycle...
 
so, i inherited an 80 gallon tall aquarium from my mom when she passed away in march... it came with five 15-20 year old silver dollars, 2 catfish, 1 pleco, 1 severum, and i added my 2 parrot fish in there so i wouldn't have to maintain 2 aquariums...
 
fish were doing great, but i wanted to get rid of the undergravel filtration and rocks, switch to sand... of course, i put off cleaning the tank because i'd originally set it up on a stand that was just too tall for me to reach the bottom with any means... the stand was only 3ft tall, but yeah... and i also got lazy and busy... my own fault the undergravel got FILTHY - the filters were filthy... i only lost one fish - the severum got a fungal infection resulting in pop-eye and death within 24 hours of beginning treatment...
 
so we built a new stand, nice and short (2ft) and i tore down the aquarium, bagged up 2 nylon stockins worth of gravel and muck, removed all rocks, put in sand, a few decorations (poor tank had been bare), cleaned the filters and added filtration medium (they'd had none in there - thanks mom)... and now my aquarium is cycling with all these giant fish in it. 
 
so far the fish appear healthy, they're eating well (i'm only giving them a small amount at a time) and 48 hours later, the ammonia is testing at 2-3ppm. 
 
i want to know, what is the best thing to add to keep the ammonia under control - i have the seachem prime for water conditioner, and i know i can add this to help - but i want to add bacteria and avoid as much stress as possible during this cycle... i do not have any test kits for the nitrates/nitrites, but will go to the store and pick some up today so i can see if there are bacteria at all working in there.
 
also - i want to switch to cannister filters, these power filters are strong enough to circulate the water, but they're terribly cheap and NOISY... i plan to wait until after we pass the cycling stage and will leave the power filters in place for several weeks while the cannisters pick up the slack...
 
 

 

[SamB]

There isn't anything to really add - at this point the recommended course of action would be a lot of water changes, which won't be easy in a tank this large. It is necessary, however, for all of your fish to survive undamaged.

 

[daizeUK]

Since you live in the US, I strongly recommend you get hold of some Dr Tim's One and Only bacterial starter.  I used it to cycle my tank and it is one of the best products you can get for a situation like yours.  Good luck!

 

[rrats]

thank you - i'll do a partial water change after i get some more testing equipment... i have a sink fill/drain adapter, so the changes actually aren't too terrible!  i'll also look at the dr. tim's!
 
i feel bad for the fish, but they were in terrible shape before this... hoping to clear this up quickly so they stay healthy!

 

[TwoTankAmin]

daize gave you great advice. If you can not find Dr Tim's product, look for Tetra Safe Start. These products are you best option right now. They will get your tank out of danger fast and get you cycled about as quickly as possible.is you follow the directions. This is a one time addition thing.
 
You next bast option is to find local fish keepers/stores who are willing to share some of their cycled media with you. This is another way to get needed bacteria into a tank rapidly. the problem is I thing you need more than your will be able to find  especially in a short time.
 
You have a huge fish load in there. I honestly see little way you will get through this trying to do massive water changes daily or even more often. You have not even hit the nitrite stage as far as I can tell and that will be rally bad as well. If your tank were empty and you asked what fish you put into it to do a fish in cycle (even with the bacteria you might still have now) I would have suggested six zebra danios maybe eight. Most of your current stock would consider that a small snack.
 
If you follow the above advice please be sure to follow the directions of the products (a similar set of precautions also applies to using cycled media).
 
1. Do a huge water change before you add the product. You want to start with a lower level of ammonia (or nitrite) present when adding these things.
2. With the bottled product, turn off the tank lights the first 24-36 hours
3. Try not to change any water for the same time period. The bacteria need time to settle in your filters and on other hard surfaces in your tank.
4. To be safe, buy more product than you need for the tank. Basically the more you add, the faster it can work but it never hurts to have a bit of backup.
5. Fish tend to fight off ammonia better if fed. The trick is not to feed them too much. You want to insure there is no uneaten food. However, its better to err on the too little side here.
 
If you get stuck or have questions, post here.

 

[rrats]

definitely no bacteria working yet... i'm in process of changing about 50% water - i'll take it down as low as the fish seem able to tolerate, i have lots of air movement in there but the filters will be off a few hours... i got the seachem version of bacteria - they didn't have dr. tims or the tetra version at the fish store and i didn't have time on my lunch break to run all over!!!  seachem stability says i can use 1 capful for each 10gal immediately, then 1 cap for each 20gal for the next 7 days... i'll be sure to add some to the filter media as well.  there are some decorations, so there's definitely surfaces for the bacteria to adhere to also!
 
thank you so much, i'll update on how this goes... i'm pretty sure right this moment, even with the ammonia around 2ppm the fish are happier than they've been in months... and the kids love the lower stand where they can see the fish more easily!!!

 

[rrats]

50% water change yesterday, ammonia level still at 1ppm at that time... woke up today, still at 1ppm - no sign of nitrites yet though... have filters off (added bacteria to them) until tomorrow, all lighting off, and poured the bacteria all over the decor as much as possible!!!

 

[rrats]

well, this strain of bacteria is doing absolutely NOTHING.  50% water change going again now... will go buy some of the tetra safe start, can get that locally... fish still look good, but still reading 0 nitrites and after 48 hours, the ammonia is about 3ppm

 

[ncguppy830]

good try to be patient cycling takes a while

 

[doraemon213]

A newbie here myself, but just went through fish in cycling with tetra safestart successfully so I thought maybe I could give some insights here. (Thanks to the forum folks here I have learned a lot throughout the process)
 
For tetra safestart, it is very important to NOT use detoxifying products at least 24 hours before adding bacteria. Ammonia is bacteria's food, adding those products means killing their food -- this includes things like Seachem Prime.
 
Here are some very good instructions on tetra safestart, possibly applicable to what you were using as well:
http/www.fishlore.com/fishforum/aquarium-nitrogen-cycle/58116-q-tetra-tetra-safestart.html
 
Also, regarding water changes, you want to bring the ammonia down to <0.25ppm. With 3ppm reading, that means you need to do like a 95% water change... Now I am not sure how practical that is, maybe other experts here could speak to that. But the idea of water change is to dilute the ammonia so that you can bring it down to a relatively less poisonous level. (e.g. 3ppm * 0.95 = 2.85ppm. That means after 95% water change it is diluted to have 0.15ppm of ammonia)
 
If I were you, I would do a massive water change with a non-detoxifying conditioner (e.g. tetra aquasafe conditioner worked well for me) so that the ammonia is <0.25ppm. Add the bacteria and see how it does. Since you would want to avoid water change after that, I might even stop feeding for the next 2-3 days and keep testing.
 
Oh, also, I used wayyyyy more tetra safestart than what the bottle suggested (about 125ml for my 10 gallon).
 
Again, I am a noob as well but that was what worked for me. Be patient and good luck!!

 

[rrats]

i may have to get a different conditioner... although my tap water comes out at 1ppm for ammonia, so there's just plain no way i'm going to get it below that... i've now added 3 different brands of bacteria and ordered some dr. tim's as well.  at this point, i'm just hoping SOMETHING takes and my fish can make it through a rough 48-72 hours before i have to siphon water out AGAIN (possibly losing bacteria even though i'm careful to not stir anything up right now and only pull from mid-tank)...
 
80 gallons is a tough cycle, it's HUGE

 

[daizeUK]

Seachem Prime will dechlorinate and temporarily detoxify the ammonia in your tap water, I think you're definintely going to need it if your tap water is as high as 1ppm.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

According to Tetra (from reading the link above) they don't want you to use anything that detoxifies ammonia 24 hours before and 7 days after adding SafeStart. They say if levels get too high do a water change and add more.
 
I prefer Dr Tim's, but that is not available here.
 
One thing you can do, if you have ammonia in your tap, is to to set up a holding container and let the water age. If you add an airstoe or small power head to roil the surface, you can out gas both ammonia and chlorine. A nice Rubbermaid Brute garbage can is an ideal water holding prep option.
 
rrats your best bet is to try and find somebody who will donate some cyled media to you if you can.

 

[rrats]

i still have cycled media from the tank from before... i'm not sure anyone can donate enough media to me to really make a difference... i had a 29gal before and cycling it was fairly simple, i never realized just how hard it would be to cycle this one!  i have ordered some dr. tims, will be here early this week... i'll watch ammonia, if it spikes too high tomorrow, i'll go get a different conditioner to only clean the chlorine out and change water again, but i'm going to try to give them at least 48 hours to let all the bacteria i've added so far work before i suck any of it back out...
 
what exactly do fish DO when ammonia gets high - do they act out before they start to die?  i've got to replace the power filters soon too, one is so loud all the fish go nuts when i turn it on, so it is off right now also   there's no bacteria colony in those either, so it isn't really hurting it to be off - i believe they're rated 60-90 as single units.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

Watch for lethargy, hanging out at the surface more (or the substrate), red gills, etc.