8 Fishbought On Sunday, Only 1 Left Alive Today!

[kakihara]

Hi there, I am new to this site and to the fishleeping game. I have a tank which had been running for one week and added to fish to it (8 Neon Tetras). After the fist night one was missing, possibly died of shock from the transfer. Then I noticed that one of the fish had a white lump on the side of his body (which was quite big) and the rest has little tiny ones all over theirs (some had more than others) anyway they started to fall, one after the other, in quick succession.

During this time the smallest of the lot seemed to be attacking the others. It also was the least affected of the lot, only a few spots.

My girlfriend to me on the phone on Monday that he/she was headbutting some of the others and seemed to be the friskiest of the lot, we named it "Moochy" ... do people usually name fish??.

On Tuesday I bought a water testing kit and I also put Salt into the tank as I was doing a 20%-ish water change to help combat this whitespot, I also turned up the heat to aroun 30 degs. At the time another one had died (which left me with 5) and anotehr 2 were on their way out. I put 2 tea spoons of salt per gallon (I have a Hexagon Tank - 60 Litres, which is about 13 gals). A while after the water change another 2 went, leaving me with 3.

I got up yesterday morning and the 3 were still alive, so I thought fantastic, it worked, however, I came home from work yesterday and 2 were gonners, leaving Moochy on his own in the tank.

My girfriends parent have some whitespot medicine but will I be able to put it into the tank after I put the salt in on Tuesday?

My tank readins on Tuesday were as follows (btw I'm going back ot the pet shop today where I got them to complain, plus I'm bringing a water sample with me)

Ph 8.2
Ammonia .50
Nitrite .00
Nitrate:?
Temp. 26c (The temp is now 30 - 31)

Can anyone help me?

Keith

 

[Clairel]

Sorry to hear about that !!

Your tank sounds like it is still cycling, sometimes fish cannot make it through this process, and unfortunately the fish you have are not hardy fish for cycling, they dont usually survive through this process..

Why are you adding salt? Most fish these days, dont even need salt, most of the fish have adapted very well just to plain old water, with decholirnator of course.... I wouldnt reccomend putting salt in, but i will leave that up for discussion with other members, and there input into this...

It sounds like a bad case of white spot, which i am not familiar with, as none of my fish have ever had this, but there are good treatments out there, to help you with this.

I would stay as you are, without adding anymore fish, do a small water change each or every other day (if you still have fish in there) If theres NO fish, how about doing a fishless cycle? There are plenty of topics about that on here.

Also if you havnt already, i would invest in a water test kit, get a master kit if you can, this will test for everything, and is much more reliable, and accurate than the strips, and i find the test tubes easier to use...

Good Luck
Claire x

 

[black angel]

The problem was the salt. Neons dont like it at all and your ph is quite high so maybe your water is hard which may also be a reason why the fish are dying.
Is your pet store local to you and have the same ph?
Neons like well established tanks that have been running for around 6 months as well. You should wait until the tank is fully cycled which will take anything up to six weeks.
As for the other fish do 40% water changes each day until the salt has gone and then basically start again by adding a bit of flake food near the filter to keep the ammonia levels going. Your remaining fish may or may not make it though.
If the fish is still showing whitespot then treat the whole tank with the medication.

 

[SkiFletch]

Yeah, go ahead and add the whitespot med right away. Make sure you remove any activated carbon from your filter when you add the meds as carbon decomposes most fishmeds. Keep the water temp high, do daily waterchanges as reccomended and cross your fingers.

As mentioned, Neons are not hardy fish, they like well established tanks, and are not good first fish in a tank. If Moochy survives it will be a big surprise. Good luck

 

[kakihara]

I thought the salt would help to get rid of the whitespot, would that not be the case? As far as I could see the fish were already dying before I put the salt in. I don't know whther or not to chance changing the water especially if the little guy is still alive when I go home this evening. Maybe the water change could do him in?
If I do a bit of a water change would I start putting the medicine in, even though salt would still be in the tank?

How long would I have to keep the water temp at around 30 - 31 degs?

Keith

Yeah, go ahead and add the whitespot med right away. Make sure you remove any activated carbon from your filter when you add the meds as carbon decomposes most fishmeds. Keep the water temp high, do daily waterchanges as reccomended and cross your fingers.

As mentioned, Neons are not hardy fish, they like well established tanks, and are not good first fish in a tank. If Moochy survives it will be a big surprise. Good luck

What is this carbon you are talking about? is it in the filter?

I'll start the changes this evening and start putting the meds in too.

When will I be able to put more fish into the tank by the way?

How do you know if whitespot has gone from your tank?

Keith

Sorry to hear about that !!

Also if you havnt already, i would invest in a water test kit, get a master kit if you can, this will test for everything, and is much more reliable, and accurate than the strips, and i find the test tubes easier to use...

Good Luck
Claire x

Thanks Claire, I've got myself the master testing kit and I'm using the 4 test tubes to bring my water over to the pet store this evening. Very handy indeed!!

 

[mr.dark-saint]

Well, Persimmon Belly I hate to tell you but you need to do some looking on the fish's requirements. Neons are very touchy to begin with and I'm wondering if you didn't buy sick fish to begin with. I'd always buy fish a day or two before the shop get's their deliveries or have them hold on to them (got to be "in good" with the shops for this). By waiting the fish left has a better chance of survival in your tank. Or if you have the shop call you when your special order arrives you can quarantine them yourself at home that is if you have the tank set up for this purpose.

Just the same I'd read up on your wants and take a good look before buying.

 

[SkiFletch]

Well, what kind of filter do you have? Sponge? Undergravel? Hang-over? External canister? Each type has specific locations where they have thier activated carbon, if any. Usually in the case of a sponge or undergravel its a container with little black pellets in it near where the water comes out of the tube. If you have an overhang filter its usually the slide-in piece that is black. If you have an external canister, they vary a lot so you'll want to check the filter's manual.

Using meds before removing activated carbon is a waste of time since the carbon breaks down the meds

As for the salt, salt does kill whitespot AKA Ich, but it also can be harmful to neon tetras in too much of a concentration. Diluting it through water changes over time is the answer there as mentioned before.

As for when its safe to add more fish I dont have enough experience with the disease to give you a solid answer, hopefullly someone else does.

 

[kakihara]

Hi, Went back to the pet store I bouight the fish from and got no sympathy from the guy there. He blamed me for putting the fish into an uncycled tank whose ph was too high (when I did a test on tuesday the reading looked like 8.3) and whose water was too hard (is that no ph also)? HE said that the water were I live is erally hard and that I could only keep african fish and not amazonian fish. He said that tyhe only way to keep amazonian fish was to either collect rainwater and use it for the water changes or get a buckt, fill it with water and put some peat moss into a stocking anfd put it in and that will softenm the water. H also said that it will turn the water a brownish colour but that every amazonian tank that is set up correctly should be like that (is he right?) Did that guy ever hear of PH balance or the PH reducing products? surely that would lessen the ph of my water.

anyway, I wont be going back there again.

Moochy stiil lives, he's a superhero fish!!

I'm gonna go to another pet store after work to see what that guy thinks and I'll probably get my water tested by him tomorrow. I did a test last night and the ph looks like it's 7.5, at least that's what my girlfriend said (I'm kinda colour blind and can't really tell with any great conviction what the colour on the card the water in the test tube matches up to :stupid: ) I put in more balance last night too, so hopefully that will bring down the ph a bit more. I was more worried about the PH than the nitrite, nitrate and ammonia seeing as Moochy is the only fish in the 60 litre tank, I still did the tests though and they all seemed to be at safe level. The guy will be testing it tomorrow anyway so I'll know all the levels then for certain.

Is it possible to lets say fill a bucket full of water and put the tapsafe stuff in it and the ph balance as well and have it ready for the water changes a day or two before you actually do it, so that you wouldn't be increasing the PH as much with the water change? (if you see what I mean).

Keith

 

[Clairel]

I would stay well away from ph products, that either take it up or down, for one, every time you do a water change, you are going to have to get the water perfect, as an inbalance in ph can kill your fish, also its costly, i have read up so much about Ph Chemicals, and i wouldnt use them, your fish may suprise you, and be used to your water already, especially if your lfs is nearby.... I would get your tank cycled first, then look into the more hardy fish you can have, maybe fish who like their Ph a little higher...

Good Luck

C x

 

[red-devil0602]

please read the fishless cycle artical and the how to avoid new tank syndrome in the faq's.

 

[kakihara]

please read the fishless cycle artical and the how to avoid new tank syndrome in the faq's.

It's a bit late for that now.

 

[SkiFletch]

Sounds like the guy at your LFS doesnt really know what he's talking about... While Neon Tetras very much do prefer water that is closer to neutral or even acidic, you do not need those conditions for "all amazonian fish". Thats a load of horse... Lots of other amazonian fish enjoy slightly alkaline water.

The biggest thing about pH is this: keep it stable! Fish can adapt to pH's outside their normal range provided whatever pH that is is maintained. I live in an area with exceptionally hard water and high pH 8.0. Although I dont have any now I used to keep a tank with a school of 6 neons in it for a bunch of years. No pH altering products were ever used on that tank and the fish never got diseased and were healthy their entire life. If you really want to get your pH down, look into bogwood, CO2 addition, or peat moss. For the beginner I reccomend bogwood. Go buy a piece, soak it in a bucket of warm water until it stops or at least slows its leeching of brown stuff, then put it in your tank. It wont do anything drastic but it probably will keep your pH down in the upper 7 range which will be safe for most fish types.

How far are you from that LFS? Are you guys on different water supplies?

 

[red-devil0602]

please read the fishless cycle artical and the how to avoid new tank syndrome in the faq's.

It's a bit late for that now.

i was thinking in case any fish you have left die and you have to start all over again

 

[kakihara]

Sorry about that Red Devil, I was just a bit sore from losing my fish . Thanks for your advice though, if I really get used to this fishkeeping business then I'll defenitly be going the fishless cycling way. It makes much better sense. I hate seeing animals suffer.

Can you give me advice about what fish I'm gonna put in next (the tank has been cycling for 2 weeks).

Thanks again

if I really get used to this fishkeeping business then I'll defenitly be going the fishless cycling way

I meant of course if I get another tank

 

[kakihara]

Sounds like the guy at your LFS doesnt really know what he's talking about... While Neon Tetras very much do prefer water that is closer to neutral or even acidic, you do not need those conditions for "all amazonian fish". Thats a load of horse... Lots of other amazonian fish enjoy slightly alkaline water.

The biggest thing about pH is this: keep it stable! Fish can adapt to pH's outside their normal range provided whatever pH that is is maintained. I live in an area with exceptionally hard water and high pH 8.0. Although I dont have any now I used to keep a tank with a school of 6 neons in it for a bunch of years. No pH altering products were ever used on that tank and the fish never got diseased and were healthy their entire life. If you really want to get your pH down, look into bogwood, CO2 addition, or peat moss. For the beginner I reccomend bogwood. Go buy a piece, soak it in a bucket of warm water until it stops or at least slows its leeching of brown stuff, then put it in your tank. It wont do anything drastic but it probably will keep your pH down in the upper 7 range which will be safe for most fish types.

How far are you from that LFS? Are you guys on different water supplies?

Hi,

Yeah, I live about 20 miles from the LFS, though I think it should be FAFS (Far Away Fish Shop), it's in dublin city centre and I leave beside the sea. I work in the city centre though so that's why I'd go there.

I think I'll defo be getting some bog wood (might pick up some tomorrow). I no longer go to that place I bought both the tank and the neons from (I thought seeing as I had spent over 200 euro there I thought he'd try to keep my business, but I guess not), but there's another store about 10 minutes away from that one which I plan to use in future. I had my water tested there today and they said everything was fine with it. The PH was about 7.5.

I asked them what fish I could put in and they reccomended gouramis (I have a 60 litre hex so I know they'd have to be dwarf ones) but would gouramis be the right choice? I thought platys or danios would be the best option.

advice please oh wise ones of the forum ...