7X2X2 - Aro, Ray?

[ChilliPepper]

Just chucking some ideas about at the moment.

We're wondering, if we get a 7x2x2, could we house an arrowana or a ray? Also, would these fish be compatible with Severums and Geos? Also got a JD.... I am pretty sure an Oscar would be OK. He's a good size.

Sounds like it will probably be a 'no', but thought I'd ask anyway to make sure

The volume of the tank works out around 800L, but usable volume at least 750L.

 

[Davo86]

tank size would just about be ok for an asian aro, and one of the smaller ray species, (retic, or hystrix) and you could probably get away with a few Sevs or middle swimmers, Large Geos may work but spending a lot of time on the bottom may suffer at the hands of the ray. Would personally leave the Oscar and JD out of this kind of setup but it could be done IMO

 

[ChilliPepper]

Thanks Davo. That's definitely food for thought. OH is thinking of building a stand/cabinet, and buying the glass. This would be a replacement for our current 637L cube.

We both like the Aro's. What sort of price would an Asian set me back, do you know? And the same for the Rays really.

I haven't done any research yet into these fish, which I would do if I were seriously to consider buying one, but nice to know that they'd be happy in that space.

Oh, would they get along with Bichirs? I have one fatty Ornate, and a smaller Delhezi.

 

[Davo86]

Depends on the colour and quality your after, Greens start at about £75-£100 Banjars at around £100 to £200 and then a variety of reds which go anywhere from £300 to £500 upto and over £2000+

And at a guess I'd say one of the above rays would set you back between £50 to £120 depending on size and how well acclimatised they are to tank life.

Large bichirs in theory should be ok, and usually are, but again there are no guarantees with Rays

Edit: If your building it from scratch may be worth making it 30" width, which would benefit both species and would arguably increase the ray options available to you

 

[MBOU]

Was going to say, you wouldnt want to keep even retics in a tank only 2ft front to back, we have a pair at work (Steve and Shirley lol) and I had to clear a load of tanks and play musical rays as they grey because with Steve being about 15sm across his ray and Shirley being bigger and fatter is about 25cm across, they still had plenty of room in length to turn around and shifty up and down in a 5x2x2 but they kept managing to catch their tails on the side when they turned around if they didnt leave enough room. I moved them as soon as i started to see what it was causing the damage to the tails.

They are now loving life in a 5.5x3x2 tank, its 3ft front to back and the rays look tiny in it now!! They are happily living in with Severums, a young oscar, pair of firemouths, a few odd juwel cichlids we had to put into the bigger tank to stop the aggression and its worked! They now shoal.

The severums and the Rays especially always seem to swim up and down together.

I think the most important thing when thinking big fish is the width of the tank! People dont consider that you can keep 2.5-3ft fish in a tank only 2ft front to back!!

I kept a Pearl Arrowana with a large male Motoro (we think) but it did end in tragedy when the Arro spooked at something (we never found out what) but he pinged accross the tank and hit the stingray who promptly stung him and that was that. It was a fairly slow painful death for Arnold, a beloved pet. He was absolutely stunning fish at about 30-35cm and growing fast and with the foulest mood that puts even your average grump Pearl arro to shame!

 

[ChilliPepper]

Thanks. Have done a little reading on Aro's yesterday, and decided they are not for me. I don't think Boris (my Oscar) would take too kindly to another fish taking up all his surface area either. He likes this part of the tank for himself.

I am unsure about rays still, not really read up about them yet. I know they can be fussy to feed... Or was that the salty rays?

It's all up in the air as we haven't even moved yet, so depending on space and if we do go ahead, maybe an extra foot of width would be possible. I agree it's much better to get a good width. My current tank is 3ft wide, but only 3ft long. This is OK, but would like to have a longer tank ideally.

I could always try an Endlicheri in with my others if I got the bigger tank. Has taken a few months for my Delhezi and Ornate to co-exist happily. My Ornate has grown at a staggering rate compared to the Del, and he was bullying him a little. But as the Del spends most of his time resting in the hanging plants, and the Ornate at the bottom looking for food, they get along harmoniously now. They will eat side by side and be fine. I think they had to establish a pecking order.

It always makes me laugh that bichirs are in the predatory section - they are blind as a bat and quite stupid when it comes to food Well, the Delhezi in particular. He has finally got the hang of it though, and now comes out before the food is put in, rather than just after all the food has gone

 

[MBOU]

you soooo havent met my cousins pair of delhezis. noone told them that they dont have good eyesight! they are almost as wide as they are long and id class them as morbidly obese now lol. they stalk, hang in plants and grab the malawis mid swim!! eaten two jacobfreibergiis, an acei, electric blue hap, 6 adult male golden wonder panchax a fire aulonocara and im sure there was another!!

I dont know why but never had problems with feeding rays!!! my pair at work eat flakes, prima pellets, massivore pellets (the hikari ones are absolutely amazing! everything loves them and they can be broken easily for smaller fish), prawns, chopped whitebait, mussel, cockle, their new favourite is cockle in shell, they love chewing on the shells to get the meat out!! and of course they'll eat bloodworm, krill, P.E. Mysis etc but it just goes everywhere in the resevoir tanks and they'd never find it before it went though filtration.

If rays dont eat, i always found that prawns were the answer, not any prawns, had to be sainsbury's prawns because tescos prawns were too chewy. (dont ask, wasnt me eating them!! LOL). Everyone goes on and on at me about not feeding prawns because the fish get addicted to them but i have never had or seen that problem and always found that once a fish is steadily eating prawns and got a good feed reaction, they are more happy to accept new foods when they are chucked in.

Also found that making feeding time fun helped, put loads of smooth pebbles in the tank with young rays and they loved having to hunt for the food and get it from little gaps.

 

[ChilliPepper]

Obviously I just have an extremely stupid Del

Thanks for the advice on feeding rays. Will have to see what sort of space we have to play with before deciding on final dimensions. Could maybe do a width of 2.5'. The trouble with 3', which we found with our cube, was that it was impossible to get through the door, so we had to take a window out to get it in the house

 

[always4lora]

Wouldn't consider any fully grown ray in a 2 ft wide tank, for growing out it is fine. My largest ray has a 14inch disc , include the about 10inch tail thats your two foot! mines 6x2.5x2x.5 and ideally i'll be upgrading within the next year or two.

As for the cost of rays... you'll generally pick up retic's for about 50-60£ but they a bit finicky when it comes to eaten and are generally not imported in great condition. You'll see a lot of motoro's around £90 but these you should stay away from as they get big over a period of time. Marbled motoro's will set you back around £100-130 for a juvi or £300+ for a 10" high quality one, you could get a male one as they tend to stay smaller but i'd expect at least 14inch disc from it eventually getting to 16inch ish. My female marble motoro has gone from 9" to 14" disc in about 11 months so do grow quite quickly.
Other good rays are True hytrix, which have recently started to appear for sale again normally cost around £150 but there is someone on AC selling them for £58 if you can get one (they're selling str8 away) I've asked for a text of the guy when these come in as they're a good ray. Will stay around 13-14inch max for females and slightly smaller for males.
Scobina rays are good but tbh you aint going to get one as theyre rare in the UK. You can import these from Europe (Germany and holland) for around 300euro a pair excluding delivery tax etc.

When it comes's to feeding rays stay away from Sea Foods, they're not part of the natuaral diet and should not be fed, especially something like prawn as a staple diet as they';re bad for them, stay away from mammal meat.
Pellets are the way forward, either go with Hikari massivore / carnivore as mentioend above or try NLS Carnivore / extreme.

Tank mates need to robust and not remotly edible! I recently had my florida gar filleted by my ray


If you've got some serious money youcould get something like p14 rays for growing out, will take a wile before you would need to upgrade but will cost you min of £600 if you're lucky.




On the arowana front have a look for Black Arowana's these stay smaller than the normal silvers and will cost you less than £100, asians are really nice but cost you a few hundred/