1 Dead, 2 Almost...could This Be Gill Flukes

[jonnyuk]

i have one dead mbuna, 1 very ill looking mbuna and another showing early signs.

the visual signs

gasping for air,
gills going like the clappers
hanging either at the surface or on the bottom
staying away from the other fish
i'd say maybe a hint of colour loss
scratching on stuff,
gills are slightly red

i lost 1 last week, so on friday did a 50% water change and dosed with waterlife sterazin.

i have riped my tank to bits today catching the fish (the one showing signs of illness took ages), i gave them both a salt bath for 20 mins (used the tmc pro reef salt i use for the marine tank).

the very ill one i thought was dead as it was on its side, i have took it out and currently giving another salt bath.

all my stats are good and i have lowered the temp to 21c, i have also had the lights off for the last 2 days.

tank is 125ltr with a rena xp3, 10 juvi mbuna in total (5 bought two weeks, 6 bought last week)

i thought gill flukes was not deadliy if the fish where strong? is it something else?

thanks
jonathan

 

[This Old Spouse]

What are your water parameters?

 

[jonnyuk]

ammonia and nitrite = 0
nitrate 15

i have just finished the salt bath in the very ill fish, its sitting on the bottom again. i don't think it will make it through the night.

 

[jonnyuk]

ok, just seen another one flicking.this is getting very serious

any ideas?

 

[alihar]

Could be a number of issues unfortunately.
Ammonia spikes,ph swing,not enough dissolved oxygen, bacterial gill disease, gill flukes, envioromental stress, acid from waste food irritating the gills and velvet all have similar symptoms.
Gill flukes are normally only fatal at the last stage of infestation.
Fish will normally start gasping at the surface,laying at the bottom of the tank,isolating themselves, stop eating and
lose weight before dying with fluke infestations.
I would check your ph levels morning and night for any swings, test ammonia an hour after feeding for any spikes.
Take a look in the tank with a flashlight at night with the room darkened for signs of velvet.
Velvet isn't always clearly visible in normal light and will show up much better this way.
As you have already started treatment for flukes I would finish the course. Crank up the airstones and return you tank temperature to normal as fluke eggs hatch quicker at higher temps.
Unless you have a microscope to positively ID gill fluke for sure you could just be medicating blindly unfortunately.
I would keep up the salt baths and make sure when you do tank maintenance you pay particular attention to the glass, filter and gravel.
I've had an absolute nightmare with gill flukes over the past 6 months.
If you go thru a process of elimination and are pretty sure it's what you are dealing with I recommend fluke solve I found it much more effective and easier on fish, plants and bio filter.
Alison

 

[alihar]

Just to add!
Many Protozoa parasites infest the gills of fish so costia, trichia and chillofonella can also show these symptoms without the obvious signs of the parasite on the fishes body.
It really is a process of elimination.
Good luck
Alison

 

[HayzH]

i gather your tank was properly cycled?

 

[jonnyuk]

sorry i've not replied sooner and thanks for all the advice. i've checked my water again today and its fine, same as yesterday. i have had the lights off for days so would hope its not a ph swing (for info its about 7.8).

the one fish that still looks ill i thought was getting better as its gills are no longer going mad and its not gasping (i'm pritty sure though one gill is not moving much). however its still sitting on the bottom but will have moments where its up and about (maybe its on the mend).

all the other fish are looking fine, i lightly fed tonight and all but the ill one took food. i've not seen any more flicking.

i'll raise the temp now (my thinking was to slow down the hatching process to allow the meds to work).

i did take the dead fish to the place i bought it, he seemed to think it was not flukes because the belly was bloated and scales slightly raised, he seemed to think malawi bloat (to get 3 fish all at the same time though?).

for info i feed them on jbl malawi flakes (vegi stuff), i feed every other day.

although its a new tank it is cycled as i used the substrate, 50ltr of water and media from old setup.


thanks again, been having a nightmare few weeks. i lost all my live stock in marine nano marine tank a few weeks ago and thats now started a full blown cycle.

 

[jonnyuk]

abit of an update and more questions.

my 1 remaining ill fish is still sitting on the bottom, today however i have noticed white stringy poo. does this rule out gill flukes and point to malawi bloat or secondary infection?

i have also seen a few fish flashing against the substrate today which makes me think its still gill flukes but the white stringy poo tells me its flukes.

i'm stuck on what to do, either stop my treatment for flukes, hope its not this and start malawi bloat treatment or finish my flukes treatment. by this time though i could of lost more fish with malawi bloat.

help please.

 

[nitrogen15]

Glad some of your fish are on the mend. I've got some new fish struggling with what appears to be flukes at the moment, and haven't lost any yet, but fingers crossed. It does sound like you could have more than one disease present. Keep in mind that white poo can also be a sign of not eating.

If you can get it, Praziquantel covers both internal and external parasites. Looks like your med is mostly intended for external ones. Some people also like to use an antibiotic such as Maracyn to cover secondary infections. At that point, your meds would really be covering all bases, but antibiotics may take out your biofilter, so you'd have to monitor your levels closely.

If the cichlids seem to be improving just with your current approach, though, stay the course. I'd only switch out if it seems to be doing nothing.

 

[jonnyuk]

the fish i put in a seperate tank seems to have responded to malawi boat treatment

the fish in my tank seem ok although i have seen them flashing against stuff last night. all the fish seem to hide a little more than i'm used to. hoping this is because of the gill fluke med and not a sign of malawi bloat.