A Quick Question

[tonydb]

Hey guys.
 
Im fishless cycling and using ammonia.
 
My ammonia levels are going down as suggest by the guide on this site but my nitrite and nitrate levels dont seem to be going anywhere (except UP in nitrate)Nitrite is over 5pp and nitrate is around 80ppm perhaps more.
 
surely this cannot be right? Oh and my ph level has dropped to 6.2 ish.
 
Recommendations anyone??
 
Or am i being paranoid?

 

[techen]

Nitrate will always go up, Its the bi product of ammonia anyway.
 
Keep at it, Once you see Nitrite drop to zero and your dosing ammonia you are pretty close.

 

[attibones]

If your nitrite levels are reading 5ppm, they probably are actually higher than that but you just can't see it. Your cycle sounds like it is doing what it should. Just give it more time.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

Do a 25% water change to get your pH up. This is important. Low pH stalls a cycle and can stop it dead in its tracks. Under 6/5 or so pH the bacteria are being inhibited and some killed off. t takes many months to get a tank cycled for acid water and it has to be done in stages dropping the pH .2 or so at a time and then restablizing the cycle. Get your pH up at least near 7.0 and you should be OK.
 
The bacteria want a pH 6.5 and up and sufficient carbonates to function. If your pH or KH drop too low the result is the cycle stalls or goes backwards. Inmost cases a water change which correct things. before changing the water test for ammonia. After the water change add enough ammonia to bring the tank back to the same ammonia level it was at before the change, do not worry about the nitrite part. Also testing for nitrate here is mostly a waste of time and money. To get an accurate reading for nitrate you must subtract the reading from nitrite from the nitrate reading since the nitrate test works by converting the trates to trites and then reading them. So any nitrite in the water will be read as more nitrate. Since the nitrate tests are awful they are best used as a directional indicator rather than an absolute level indicator.

 

[tonydb]

Ok i did do a 50 ish % water change last Monday and got the ph back to 7.6 ish.
 
What has made it drop so quick in 4 days almost?

 

[TwoTankAmin]

The cycle itself does that.

the nitrogen cycle creates a tendency for an established tank's pH to decrease over time. The exact amount of pH change depends on the quantity and rate of nitrates produced, as well as the KH. If your pH drops more than roughly two tenths of a point over a month, you should consider increasing the KH or performing partial water changes more frequently. KH doesn't affect fish directly, so there is no need to match fish species to a particular KH.

from http/fins.actwin.com/mirror/begin-chem.html
 
If one does regular water changes they should almost never see this. However, during cycling it can also happen. Both nitrite and nitrate produce some amount of acid in the process and this drops the pH. Since we try not to change water during a cycle, some tanks can drop in pH. It depends on one's water params etc. It is why the cycling article here says
 

To get a tank cycled in a reasonable amount of time, you need to make sure that, in addition to ammonia, the bacteria will also have:

• Lots of oxygen by keeping the surface of your water well agitated to let oxygen in.
• Inorganic carbon (as carbonates) by keeping your KH up. Do not let it drop below 3 dg (55 ppm).
• A good pH level by insuring it is above 6.5. The closer to 8.0 the faster the cycle will go. We do not recommend one alter their pH if it holds fairly steady anywhere between 6.8 - 8.5.
• An optimal temperature by having a heater set to between 75F and 85F. Lower tends to slow the cycle while higher won’t make things go even faster.

I have it on good authority that the person who wrote that is also devilishly handsome

 
Do you know what your KH is? That is likely the answer. If you don't, take a water sample from the tank (use a clean container) to your local fish store and ask them to test the KH for you.
 
The good thing is as long as you replace the ammonia removed, you can do water changes during a cycle w/i reason. By adding back ammonia you add back the nitrite production too. While you are at the fish store, if they have sw or african cichlid tanks they may be willing to give or sell cheaply a cup of crushed coral. Put about 1/3 of it into a bag in your tank or filter and it will slowly dissolve to release calcium carbonate which will help build bones and help keep up the KH.