My First Small Tank, What Are Your Opions?

[corradophil]

I have a 40 Litre (8.8 gal) tropical tank which I bought 2nd hand from a mate with a few small fish from his tank which he has now converted to marine.

The tank has a filter and heater and came with water from his previous established tropical tank.

I am doing a water change of 2 litres every week using water treatment.

The average temperature is around 26 deg C.

There are two plants plus one half coconut cave which has a plant growing on the outside.

I am feeding them on flake food, around a pinch twice a day.

From what research I have done the maximum amount of fish I can have is 12".

At the moment I have the following fish:

1 Bristlenose Pleco
4 Harlequins
3 Norman's Lampeyes
2 Cardinal Tetra
4 Black Neon Tetra
2 Panda Cory

I am looking for comments on the current set up, i.e. what's good and what's bad and a guide to what I should be aiming to do in the future to keep it a healthy attractive tank.

My mate suggested I may be able to put some Kuhli Loaches in without causing any over crowding problems. I suspect the numbers are already a little high. He also suggested a could possible put snails or small crabs in there.

So, all you fish experts where shoud I go from here?

 

[Slufa111]

I have a 40 Litre (8.8 gal) tropical tank which I bought 2nd hand from a mate with a few small fish from his tank which he has now converted to marine.

The tank has a filter and heater and came with water from his previous established tropical tank.

I am doing a water change of 2 litres every week using water treatment.

The average temperature is around 26 deg C.

There are two plants plus one half coconut cave which has a plant growing on the outside.

I am feeding them on flake food, around a pinch twice a day.

From what research I have done the maximum amount of fish I can have is 12".

At the moment I have the following fish:

1 Bristlenose Pleco
4 Harlequins
3 Norman's Lampeyes
2 Cardinal Tetra
4 Black Neon Tetra
2 Panda Cory

I am looking for comments on the current set up, i.e. what's good and what's bad and a guide to what I should be aiming to do in the future to keep it a healthy attractive tank.

My mate suggested I may be able to put some Kuhli Loaches in without causing any over crowding problems. I suspect the numbers are already a little high. He also suggested a could possible put snails or small crabs in there.

So, all you fish experts where shoud I go from here?

I know the corys can get large, and the pleco can too. If you by the rule of thumb your only given 8in of fish to work with. 1in = 1 gallon but that is a bit overratted

 

[dwarfgourami]

Afraid this one is overstocked already. Panda corys don't get very large, but they can be sensitive to water stats, bristlenoses can get to 5-6 inches and are major poop machines, so any 8 gallon containing a bristlie won't stay good quality for very long.

I would rehome the bristlenose; he will be much better off in an 20 gallon+ tank. I would also decide on one group of tetras/lampeyes and keep 6-8 of those only. And I would do weekly water changes in the region of 10 ltrs. You may be able to keep the pandas too, but then you would need to be very careful with water stats. A better option might be to get some shrimps (not crabs!) to add interest to the tetra school.

 

[mark.w.jones]

Sounds like a good starter tank with a poor collection of fish. Bad combinations as well as fish that are unsuitable for the tank, not your fault I realise. I agree with the advice above I'm afraid. If you don't rectify the stocking issues you will soon have more to deal with than a few too many fish.

 

[corradophil]

Hmmm ok, I added the bristlenose and the Harlequins.

Thought I was doing the right thing by adding the Bristlenose to eat algae.

Now down to two lampeyes due to one having it's tail nibbled off.

10 litres per week I am completely new to all this, but assume this is to keep the water quality spot on, not just to keep the tank clear, it does look nice and clear. I was advised 5% every week, which is 2 litres.

So to sort out my stock:

1. Re-home the Bristelnose and 2 lampeyes.

2. The Tetra numbers are about right at 6 overall (2 Cardinal & 4 Black Neon) or should they all be of the same type?

3. I may get away with keeping the 2 Panda Cory or replace with shrimps. How many shrimps?

4. What about the Harlequins, can I keep those?

 

[littlest]

OK, I won't comment on the stocking because I don't know enough about it to give you reliable advice.

10 litres per week I am completely new to all this, but assume this is to keep the water quality spot on, not just to keep the tank clear, it does look nice and clear. I was advised 5% every week, which is 2 litres.

Water changes are indeed to keep your water quality good, rather than keep the water clear. Clear water can still have high levels of ammonia and nitrite which are toxic to fish, so what the water looks like isn't a good indicator. If you haven't already, get some water test kits for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and pH. Liquid drop kits are better then strips. The API Master kit is a good choice and will include all you need. Also read up on cycling. If you got the filter with the tank and didn't change the media, hopefully your tank will be fully cycled anyway, but reading up on cycling will help you understand the importance of testing and water changes.
Anyway, changing 10 litres of water a week isn't much more difficult than changing 2 litres of water a week. Most buckets are ten or 12 litres, so it would just be one bucketful a week for a tank that size.

 

[corradophil]

OK, I won't comment on the stocking because I don't know enough about it to give you reliable advice.

10 litres per week I am completely new to all this, but assume this is to keep the water quality spot on, not just to keep the tank clear, it does look nice and clear. I was advised 5% every week, which is 2 litres.

Water changes are indeed to keep your water quality good, rather than keep the water clear. Clear water can still have high levels of ammonia and nitrite which are toxic to fish, so what the water looks like isn't a good indicator. If you haven't already, get some water test kits for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and pH. Liquid drop kits are better then strips. The API Master kit is a good choice and will include all you need. Also read up on cycling. If you got the filter with the tank and didn't change the media, hopefully your tank will be fully cycled anyway, but reading up on cycling will help you understand the importance of testing and water changes.
Anyway, changing 10 litres of water a week isn't much more difficult than changing 2 litres of water a week. Most buckets are ten or 12 litres, so it would just be one bucketful a week for a tank that size.

Ok, I've made a note about the API Master kit, and read up about cycling on here.

I'm using the media from my mates previous tank, so hopefully that will be fine.

Looks like I'll be getting a gravel vacuum and API Master kit over the next day or so, and doing tests and a proper water change.

Thanks for the advise, keep it coming the more the better.

 

[Aphotic Phoenix]

There really is no reliable way to determine how many "inches" of fish you can have in a tank. It does work as a very basic starting point, but properly stocking a tank is one of the more difficult aspects of the hobby!

As a beginner you should think of the these basic principles when it comes to stocking:
1 ) Bio-load. Different fish produce different amounts of waste...no one expects you to remember exact details of each species metabolism, but do keep an eye out for fish described as "messy". For some reason it's often generalized that three 1 in. fish will produce less waste than one 3 in. fish (even in some books), but I'm unsure of how accurate this is. Too many fish in a tank can quickly cause water quality problems, and smaller tanks are actually a bit more tricky in this respect because the small volume = less stability.

2 ) Swim behaviors. Some fish like to stay in the top levels of a tank, while others prefer the middle or bottom of the tank. It's always a good idea to try to get a nice balance of species that prefer different levels so they aren't constantly bumping into each other. Also, some fish are much more active swimmers than others so even though they are small they need a big tank! Keeping an active fish in too small of a tank can cause behavior problems like aggression.

3 ) Schooling vs. territorial. Many fish are schooling fish that like to be in a group with their own species (usually around 6 is a good number). This helps them feel more safe and at ease in their environment, but also helps disperse aggression amongst the group for species in which group hierarchy is important. Some fish are territorial and therefore cannot be kept with others of their own kind, or are even aggressive towards any fish that enters into their "territory".

This is why it's always a good idea to research each individual species of fish that you are considering for your tank.

In regards to the water changes. 25% a week is usually the suggested minimum for beginners. Once you've gained more experience you can consider adapting the amount of water you change to your particular tank. For example, some of us prefer to do large (50%+) changes every week, while others prefer multiple changes per week, and others every other week, but understand that often people are basing those decisions on their own set-ups and what works for one person may not work for another. FYI, as long as there is no significant difference between the basic parameters of your tap water and the tank water it is perfectly safe to do large water changes every day.

 

[Luketendo]

I heard Shrimps don't produce much waste and also they won't get fish diseases so they're a good idea, but get pygmy corys they are corys but grow to only an inch.

 

[corradophil]

Aphotic Pheonix, thanks for the response , some really useful info there. 10 litres per week it is then.

Luketendo, My Corys are about an inch long at the moment, so for now I'll keep them, but may get a few shrimps when I have become more acustomed to keeping the fish.

 

[vinylman]

With a small tank, I'd work on the premise of : small tank = small fish. I'd concentrate on just having two groups of small fish; not many fish like to be kept in twos and threes.

 

[corradophil]

UPDATE

Since my post, I have now found out my tank is actually 27 litres, I first measured it and calculated the volume, then I eventually found it on the net.

It currently has the following:

4 Harlequins
3 Black Neon Tetras
2 Cardinal Tetras
2 Panda Corys
1 Norman's Lampeye (The others had their fins nipped by something)
1 1" Bristlenose Plec
2 Snails which have probably got into the tank with plants.

I have 1 peice of bogwood, 1 half coconut with plant growing on it, 2 large background plants and 1 small plant.

The filter is an internal one supplied with the tank.

Clearly I still have an overstocking issue, although the only deaths or signs of ill health have all come from fin nipping, and this has only been happening to the Lampeyes. I'm concerned about the final remaining lampeye, he can't be happy being on his own, should I take him to a shop for re-homing, as I don't plan on getting more Lampeyes?

I've been looking on the Think fish site and used there aquarium calculator. According to that, if I were to get an external filter it would allow me to increase the number of fish in my tank. I'm considering this, so I can keep the ones I have but increase their numbers to the minimum recommeded amount. Is the external filter a good idea?


According to think fish I could have the following tank set up:


6No. Harlequin Rasbora 2701 vs,s,m,h 22 - 26C
1No. Bristlenose Plec 0301 vs,s,m,h,vh 22 - 28C
4No. Panda Cory 0509 vs,s,m,h,vh 20 - 25C
6No. Cardinal Tetra 0904 vs,s,m 24 - 28C
5No. Black Neon 0921 vs,s,m,h 24 - 27C


Aquarium size:
W30 cm L33 cm H37 cm

Filtration Type:
Oversized external filter

The stocking levels are based on the information provided above and displayed as overall length of fish in cm.

Guide stocking level: 73.26cm

Current stocking level: 67cm

Recommended temperature: 24 - 25 C

 

[SJ2K]

First point, as much as we'd all love to believe, unfortunatly think fish is no good to use when working out over stocking issues. They will ALWAYS say you can have far more then you realisticly can, take about 25% of those fish off for a good estimate. Think fish is, however, good for showing up incompatibilty issues . Personly if I were in your situation id choose EITHER the Plec or the Cory's, the tank is small enough as it is so having multiple species that carry out similar functions isnt advised. I think Perhaps 3 small cory's and no Plec would be best

 

[corradophil]

First point, as much as we'd all love to believe, unfortunatly think fish is no good to use when working out over stocking issues. They will ALWAYS say you can have far more then you realisticly can, take about 25% of those fish off for a good estimate. Think fish is, however, good for showing up incompatibilty issues . Personly if I were in your situation id choose EITHER the Plec or the Cory's, the tank is small enough as it is so having multiple species that carry out similar functions isnt advised. I think Perhaps 3 small cory's and no Plec would be best

Thanks for the information, I do like the Corys and from what I have read they would be happier with higher numbers.

I noticed your in Southend, I live in Burnham-on-Crouch. Which shops do you use/recommend? So far I've been using Swallows and Wickford Aquatics.

Yesterday I did a water test and my stats are:

PH 7.5
Ammonia <0.25ppm
Nitrite 0.25
Nitrate 40

How do they sound? According to my test kit the PH would be better being lower, although that depends on the fish.
Ammonia should ideally be 0, and Nitrite at 0 is ideal and the Nitrate is fine.

Would there be any merit for the fish if I got a small external filter to replace the current internal one? Obviously the media would need to be cylcled.

 

[mark.w.jones]

pH is the least of your worries. Ammonia, nitrite should be 0ppm and nitrate less than 50ppm at most. All of your levels are rather high as a result of overstocking and this is only going to get worse as they grow biggerand excrete more. I would certainly return the lampeye and the bristlenose. Both will be happier. Your tank is really, too small for a bristlenose. External filters are also really not designed for such a small tank and would create huge currents. I read somewhere of a company selling mini external filter but can't remember the make. Stick with your internal for now.

Stocking wise you really aren't great still. I would say you best option is:

5 black neon tetras
3 panda cories
2 snails
and a couple of freshwater shrimp.

OR

a 20 gallon tank which is what you should have to accomadate that stock