ICH

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star_tenshi

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I don't know...is it just my tank.....or do all neon tetras (paracheiridon innesi) seem to be particularly vulnerable to ich? Everytime i buy them from the LPS (PETsMART)....they end up with ich all over them...i try to use the anti-ich solutions...but it doesn't work....is something wrong?
 
Ich exists in pretty much every tank. Normally your fishes immune system keeps it in check. An outbreak of Ich generally indicates that the fishes immune system has been compromised by some factor. Bad water, thermal shock, or most probably in this case, the stress of being moved.

It is true that certain species are more prone to Ich than others, although I can think of a long list that are more prone than Neons.
 
Interesting...

So in theory, if this is the case (I'm sure it is, I'm not questioning your knowledge... :D ), how come once the weak fish "catches" ich, the rest of the fishes in the same tank catches ich as well? I would have thought that other fishes are still as strong as they were before introduction of the new weak fish...
 
To understand this, you need to understand a little about the little sod that causes white spot. It has quite a complicated life cycle. The bit we're most familiar with is the white spots on our fish. These are small nodules each of which house a "trophont". This eats away at the fishes cells and body fluids, it is constantly wriggling about and irritates the fish no end.

Once it is mature, it erupts from the cyst and attaches itself to something fixed, (rock, plant etc.), where it builds a strong skin around itself. This stage is called a "tomont". This is the principle replication phase. Inside it's protective sheath, it divides and divides and divides. Eventually, the skin ruptures and many of the new, free swimming stage tomites start swimming around trying to find a fish. There can be 1000's from a single cyst.

Note, the cyst on the fish, and the encapsulated tomont are pretty much indestructible. It is only the free swimming stage that is killed off by medications. The reason the heater is often screwed up a little when treating Ich is not to kill the parasites, but to speed up the life cycle and get them to the free swimming stage faster.

Now you know that, lets consider some scenarios.

First, it is possible there was no white spot in the tank at all, and the new fish introduced it. Possible, but I suggest unlikely.

Second, after a treatment, there are always a few parasites at the trophont stage that enter a dormant phase. They stop growing, stop feeding, stop irritating - they're there - but are not doing anything. Once your stressed Neon start releasing, (albeit indirectly), tomites, a chemical signal triggers the previously dormant trophont to resume activity. Spot breaks out in the hosts where previously they were in check. These dormant trophonts normally congregate in the gills, or at the base of fins, it is for that reason that the original fish often seem to be intensly irritated as those trophonts in the gills are in particulaly sensitive places.

Third, the very few tomonts in the dormant stage release free swimmers at intervals, but their number is sufficiently low for the immune response of the normal fish to reject them. Along comes your stressed Neon with trophonts popping out like corks, a few days later, there are now tens of thousands of the free swimmers in the water, even the tougher fish in the system are overwhelmed by the onslaught.

There are probably other scenarios as well, but consider, you do not need to introduce new fish to a tank to trigger an outbreak. An established tank of many years with no change of occupants can suddenly have an outbreak of white spot if the tank gets chilled, or some other stress factor is introduced. The little sods are there looking for an opportunity...

Imagine having your body covered with, (to scale), egg sized parasites wriggling about on or just under the surface of your skin. I'm starting to itch just thinking about it.
 
Although thoroughly disgusting, that was an excellent reply, LL. I thought I had a pretty good understanding of ich, but I learned a few more things reading that. Of course, now I can't sit still because I have creepy crawlies up and down my back. :lol:
 
Thanks 'Nut! Actually I just edited a little to correct some grammar.

>>> now I can't sit still

MAkes you think doesn't it - poor little Neons, etc. :(
 
Yes, sure does. When you see the poor tortured things flashing against rocks, you know something is certainly irritating them beyond what they can bear.
 
Great explanations! Thanks for clarifying my curiosity! :D
 
Wow.

I never expected so many responses!

Anyways....i've read the life cycle of ich many times on the internet and in books before...but i don't think i've ever seen an explanation as concise as Lateral Line's explanation. Really, thank you. I'll probably remove the neons and put them into another smaller 'sick' tank.....but it'll hafta wait...i need another heater....the one i had for ten years (technically it's my parents'..but o well!) just broke one me...so i'll hafta wait till i stop by an LPS to grab another heater. Much thanks to everyone's replies!!

(And yes...i've imagined myself with ich....nasty little parasites!) ;)
 
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