What The Hell Just Happened?

[RyAir]

okey dokey....well I had 2 guppies that have been here for about a month and a bit now and couple of weeks ago I got 4 neon tetras.

Ok,everything was going fine, I was changing 10% water every other day and feeding in the days between. Everything seemed to be fine until my visit to the not so local pet store. Got a water test done and the bloke said its a big improvement from last time, and recommended I stop changing water for a week to let the bacteria grow quicker. At first I wasnt so sure, but took his advice.

At the end of the week I noticed the tetras had seemed to lose slight colour and wasnt so bright anymore. I started changing water again, but after three days all tetras were covered in white dots. and yesturday I woke up to find one dead and hour later another one dead two hours later another one dead and when I got back from work (approx 6 hours later) got home to the last tetra dead

And today one of the guppies has the same white dots.

Can anyone please explain whats goin on, what can I do.

If all fish die, do I change all / nearly all water and start again?, or start another fishless cycle.

And is the LPS's advice to blame, or was it just one of those things?

thanks a lot

All the best

ryan.

 

[Uriel]

In my opinion and it's simply that opinion. The lfs advice is to blame yes.

Stopping changing the water unless the tank has completely cycled has caused a spike in either ammonia or nitrite. This has weakened you fish which has lead to them contracting ich. Which left untreated is killing them.

 

[karin]

Sounds like you have ich. Don't be too hard on yourself. Most of us... don't know percentage but probably most of us have dealt with fish diseases and death. It is part of the hobby.
If the fish looks like it has sand grains stuck to it, it is probably ICH.

Hard to tell what is the cause as it did not seem that you added any new fish from that LFS? New fish often bring in disease that is why many use quarantine tanks.. others just take the risk. If you did not get new fish it may be that stopping the water changes led to a slight spike in ammonia or nitrites or both and then stressed the fish, lowered their immunity and then disease which may have been harbored in one of the fish showed its ugly spots. ICH is contagious and has a long life cycle that includes periods when it is active but invisible. The white grains or spots are the last part of the disease for a single fish. So this may not be related to the LFS. He just thought your tank was cycled.

Nevertheless, it does happen so you need to get educated on ICH. Some people have luck just raising the temperature to 30 C for a couple of weeks. Some add a tiny bit of salt as well. Some go for organic solutions available in pet stores. For me, my opinion and experience, none of the above worked. I used a formalin/malachite solution (typical ich cure available at pet stores) and followed the full dose directions. I did full doses, left the water for 48 hours, 50% water change and then another full dose. I did this four times and it worked. (Take any carbon filter medium out for the duration of the medicine cycle) Many people stop too soon with the medication or don't follow the directions and the ICH returns so you got to find that commitment in my opinion.

Good luck and if you have more questions post in the emergency section.

 

[the biffster]

hi do you have a test kit
what are your stats
how long as the tank been set up

 

[KittyKat]

+1 for ich. Neons and guppies are possibly two of the least-healthy community fish you could have picked. This is also why I always make sure to have treatments on hand: one for generic fungal infections and one for ich.

 

[holidayinn]

Neons are best suited as later additions to tank setups, when the tank is more establised, as they're very fragile fish.

 

[BethK]

Was your tank cycled? Or were you doing a fish-in cycle?

I only ask, as if your tank wasn't cycled (by the sounds of what the LFS said an improvement, I'm taking that your nitrite and ammonia levels were not at 0?). 10% water change everyother day to a non-cycled tank, won't achieve anything. If you have ammonia levels in the tank, you need to conduct a good 40-50% water change (possibly every day, until ammonia is at 0).

So no, the LFS is not to blame, that's just passing the blame.

Neons need to really be added to a mature tank, they aren't the hardiest fish about.

I would suggest a new start to the tank and have a read through TFF's resources center on cycling a tank;

My link

 

[Ryan12]

+1 to ich. As i understand this common fish disease, its kind of like human colds (though more deadly to fish than a cold is to a human). The cold virus or bacteria is omnipresent, but only becomes clear that its in the victim once they have some unfortunate lowering of their immune system, e.g. all-nighters, lack of nutrition, etc.. So basically, you're fish probably had the ICH virus (or bacteria or whatever it is) present in the tank, and then the extra ammonia or nitrite in the tank from not doing as many water changes. I would express my sentiments as others have suggested to investigate fishless cycling.

 

[RyAir]

+1 to ich. As i understand this common fish disease, its kind of like human colds (though more deadly to fish than a cold is to a human). The cold virus or bacteria is omnipresent, but only becomes clear that its in the victim once they have some unfortunate lowering of their immune system, e.g. all-nighters, lack of nutrition, etc.. So basically, you're fish probably had the ICH virus (or bacteria or whatever it is) present in the tank, and then the extra ammonia or nitrite in the tank from not doing as many water changes. I would express my sentiments as others have suggested to investigate fishless cycling.

Thanks to all that helped and commented.

Casualty update, I woke up this morning to find the two guppies had died. so now I am the owner of an empty tank full of dodgy water lol

LPS told me neons and guppies were some of the hardest community fish, which is why I got those......

ok, so now I got an empty tank, do I....
empty all water and start again?
Change just 50%
Change less?

thanks agagin for any help given

 

[BethK]

You should always research a breed of fish before purchasing and not go by what the lfs say.

I would suggest tio empty the whole tank, give it a good clean (filter too) and then fill the tank up with fresh dechlorinated water. In my first post on this thread, I placed a link with useful information, click on that link and the information you are looking for would be under cycling a tank/fishless cycling and start from there.

You need to get your self a good liquid water testing kit, API freshwater test master test kit is ideal and you can get it on ebay for £20.00.

 

[KittyKat]

LPS told me neons and guppies were some of the hardest community fish, which is why I got those......

Yes, two of the hardest.. not hardiest!

You should always research a breed of fish before purchasing and not go by what the lfs say.

I would suggest [to] empty the whole tank, give it a good clean (filter too) and then fill the tank up with fresh dechlorinated water. In my first post on this thread, I placed a link with useful information, click on that link and the information you are looking for would be under cycling a tank/fishless cycling and start from there.

You need to get your self a good liquid water testing kit, API freshwater test master test kit is ideal and you can get it on ebay for £20.00.

+1 research & start from scratch with a fishless cycle.