What Kind Of Goldfish Are These?

[cooledwhip]

Hi all, I was at a new LFS today just browsing around and maybe buy some plants and they had a massive tank with a bunch of "small goldfish" as they were labeled. I bought some plants and decided to buy these "small goldfish" Because they were $2 each... and there were HUNDREDS. I also saw in the showfloor they had some nice show goldfish, Orandas, Black Moors, Ryukins, and I'm sure all these tiny goldfish were fry from a spawning the goldfish they had, and they were so cheap because they were going to all grow out that tank eventually. I bought a trio, and put them in my 20 gallon planted tank.
 
I know they will destroy plants but in the future I plan on moving them into a 20 gallon tub, and if they out grow THAT, I will put them in a 50 gallon tote thing I will be setting up this summer...
 
Anyway: The guy who sold them to me wasn't the BEST educated on fish, he didn't know what species the plants I got were and couldn't answer my questions, but he said the fish were baby oranda goldfish. So I took three home and they are happy in my 20g long. I know I will have to move them out of there and I will soon. Anyway, my question to you all was are these really orandas? They don't look like orandas, and how old are these guys? They are about half an inch in size right now if not smaller. I am not a goldfish expert but when these guys get older are they all going to be this black/grey color or is it just the fact their color hasn't come in yet? 
 
Any tips on raising them? I plan on keeping them all. I might actually go back buy some more if they really are orandas.
 
Thanks much
-John
 
HERE ARE PICTURES OF THEM

)))
http/imgur.com/a/9uE37

 

[AmtotheBurr]

Those do not look like orandas to me. What are their tails like? It's hard to tell from the photos. Are they fantailed or is the tail just single?

 

[cooledwhip]

Those do not look like orandas to me. What are their tails like? It's hard to tell from the photos. Are they fantailed or is the tail just single?

Tails are fantails. Sorry for the bad photos..
 
They didn't look like orandas either.... does the head part grow in when they grow up? Sorry I don't know the terminology I'm not an expert on goldfish like said.

 

[fluttermoth]

The wen (growth on the head) does grow later, but there's no way of telling right now whether they're orandas or some other breed of fantail.
 
They might or might not change colour; most goldfish do, but you always get a few that stay that bronze/grey colour. They will need a tank of at least 150l, with an external filter.
 
As for raising them; water change, water change, water change.
 
Goldies grow fast and need quite a lot of food, so make a lot of mess. Big water changes are the only way you're going to keep them growing and healthy. Try and do at least 50%, twice a week; but more if you can.

 

[cooledwhip]

The wen (growth on the head) does grow later, but there's no way of telling right now whether they're orandas or some other breed of fantail.
 
They might or might not change colour; most goldfish do, but you always get a few that stay that bronze/grey colour. They will need a tank of at least 150l, with an external filter.
 
As for raising them; water change, water change, water change.
 
Goldies grow fast and need quite a lot of food, so make a lot of mess. Big water changes are the only way you're going to keep them growing and healthy. Try and do at least 50%, twice a week; but more if you can.

I'm going back to buy more anyway just because this summer I do plan on having a goldfish/koi pond but since I can  get these goldfish for so cheap I might as well buy a bunch. How many could I put in a 50 gallon tub?

 

[fluttermoth]

To keep them growing properly and not become stunted, then four or five would max out a 50 US gallon.
 
Where in the US are you? Fancy goldfish need quite warm temperatures; where I live in the UK, it's not warm enough for them to live outside all year.

 

[cooledwhip]

I live in a suburb of chicago.. I'm sure its colder here than it is in the UK... I only plan on putting them outside for June, July, and August. And after that I plan on bringing them back inside in my garage or basement where it is heated and they should be warmer. 
 
Also do I really need an external filter? Like a canister filter? I'm looking all over craigslist now to find used ones because I want to get them out of my 20g.  Would a HOB filter do the job? They are doing well in my 20g now but I know they will get large soon and want to have LOTS of extra space for them.
 
Is it worth it to just buy a new filter? I promised myself I wouldn't buy anything new after I started my 20g because everything is so cheap used and it works great and perfectly fine. How much longer before I need to move them out? Thanks.

 

[fluttermoth]

I don't know much about HOB filters; they're not very popular in the UK, so I don't know if you can get one large enough to cope with goldies.
 
External/canister filters are going to be your best option, I think. Goldfish are one of those pets that are very cheap to buy, but housing them properly is expensive!
 
They are very prone to stunting as, like most animals, they do the majority of their growth in the first few months, so you want to move them ASAP.

 

[cooledwhip]

Alright. And yeah here in the US we have HOB filters that support up to 55 gallons I believe. I think I even saw a 90 gallon.. Idk I have seen more canister filters on craigslist though. Don't the canister filters leak? I've heard stories of them leaking. 

 

[fluttermoth]

I've only ever had a canister leak twice; once when I didn't read the instructions properly and put it together wrong, and once when I tried to prime it when it was blocked, and a tiny trickle came out the side, and I've had up to three running at any one time, over the last eight years or so.
 
If you treat them gently and set them up carefully, you'll be fine. Some people stand theirs in a plastic bowl, just in case

 

[cooledwhip]

Sounds great. I will keep my eye out for a used canister filter.  Thanks much.