Water Storage For Water Change System

[Waterloo Kid]

Hi,
I'm looking into using a standard water butt to store and heat water for my water changes. The idea is to fill the butt with approx 150 litres of water and heat it with a standard 300W heater to the required temperature (the butt will be located indoors by the way). I will use a powerhead to circulate the water for 24 hours or so to drive off any chlorine and then use the same powerhead to pump the water into the tank when required.
Can anyone see any issues with my plan and am I safe using a standard garden type water butt to hold the change water. I'm aware that some plastics can leach chemicals over time and I want to play it safe.

Any opinions?

WK

 

[salty pig]

Why do you need to change such a vast amount of water 150 lts ?? I have just done a water change where I filled a new wickes builders bucket( thats the black 80 ltrs one) half way up with water that is a few degrees hotter than the water in the fish tank, put the stress coat in and leave it to stand for a couple of hours if its too cold for the tank I will near boil a kettle of water and add that to the water I have a digital food thermonitor which gives me the exact temp and then with a cheap submersible pump, fill the tank up, No fish have died, so it works for me. Hope this helps but Im still a bit confused with the 150 lts so can you get back to me on this one Cheers Salty Pig.

 

[raptorrex]

Hi,
I'm looking into using a standard water butt to store and heat water for my water changes. The idea is to fill the butt with approx 150 litres of water and heat it with a standard 300W heater to the required temperature (the butt will be located indoors by the way). I will use a powerhead to circulate the water for 24 hours or so to drive off any chlorine and then use the same powerhead to pump the water into the tank when required.
Can anyone see any issues with my plan and am I safe using a standard garden type water butt to hold the change water. I'm aware that some plastics can leach chemicals over time and I want to play it safe.

Any opinions?

WK

I would not bother. if you change large amounts,. look at a Python system. if its, 20-100ukg i do it with a bucket, filled from the tap (hot and cold.) though, there is no need to match the water temperature either. unless you are doing more than 30% changes.

its an, ingenious, if unnecessary, system though.

 

[Waterloo Kid]

I do a 25-50% water change, once a week. I find this the best way to keep my fish in tip top condition. I used to use a bucket myself but I have very poor water pressure in my new house and it would take forever to fill 15 buckets of water and I doubt it'd have the pressure to run a python properly. I would also have to cart them through the house and even though i take care I've had one too many 12 litre water escapes (kicked the bucket over etc.) for my liking. the tank is now also on a carpet so minimal water lose is my aim.

The tank is a Rio 400 by the way.

I know they are big water changes but there's no better way to see your fish in their best colours. Even Glowlight tetras look fantastic when on top form!

WK

 

[yabadaba]

I do a 25-50% water change, once a week. I find this the best way to keep my fish in tip top condition. I used to use a bucket myself but I have very poor water pressure in my new house and it would take forever to fill 15 buckets of water and I doubt it'd have the pressure to run a python properly. I would also have to cart them through the house and even though i take care I've had one too many 12 litre water escapes (kicked the bucket over etc.) for my liking. the tank is now also on a carpet so minimal water lose is my aim.

The tank is a Rio 400 by the way.

I know they are big water changes but there's no better way to see your fish in their best colours. Even Glowlight tetras look fantastic when on top form!

WK

I know where you are coming from as I struggle with water changes on my 5x2x2 tank (approx 125 USG). I can't really use the python method as my hot water comes from a hot water cylinder (not directly heated from the mains) and I also like to do regular water changes. What I've found works best is to do twice weekly 7-8 bucket changes rather than 15-16 buckets once a week. This method seems to keep the water looking clean whilst breaking what would be a real time consuming task into two more manageable events. A by-product of doing 2 smaller changes per week is that I get to syphon up the debris that collects on the sand more regularly too, which can't be a bad thing.

 

[Waterloo Kid]

Good point there. As I'm rather short on time at the moment and trying to get the tank up and running on a minimum maitenance schedule I think I'll stick to a once a week method. I also want to move away from buckets for reasons stated above! I've been researching water butts and they seem to be made out of HDPE or polypropylene. Any issues with leaching from either material?

WK

 

[salty pig]

Good point there. As I'm rather short on time at the moment and trying to get the tank up and running on a minimum maitenance schedule I think I'll stick to a once a week method. I also want to move away from buckets for reasons stated above! I've been researching water butts and they seem to be made out of HDPE or polypropylene. Any issues with leaching from either material?

WK

Does that mean your going to have a big water butt in the house next to the tank ??. That would not be allowed in my house. What about having a look at the containers you can buy from the lfs which have ro water in them ? and using them to store the water in there for a couple of hours ? how important is it to have the water sitting there overnight.? I feel Im getting out of my depth with this topic but it is interesting.

 

[Waterloo Kid]

The water butt will be located under the stairs behind a wall adjacent to the tank. The RO containers were a thought but they are too small.
I've progressed the design a bit and have started planning the layout. Just got to figure out a safe water removal system to empty the tank now. It needs to incorperate a trap as I've been known to hoover up small fish at times in the past! It will be siphon based. No pumps needed for that bit!

WK

 

[salty pig]

The water butt will be located under the stairs behind a wall adjacent to the tank. The RO containers were a thought but they are too small.
I've progressed the design a bit and have started planning the layout. Just got to figure out a safe water removal system to empty the tank now. It needs to incorperate a trap as I've been known to hoover up small fish at times in the past! It will be siphon based. No pumps needed for that bit!

WK

Sounds like its sorted

 

[waterdrop]

I have two comments for you Waterloo: First one you've probably already done but will just mention that its good to double-check with your water authority to try and be completely sure its chlorine they are using (and that they haven't recently switched to chloramine and you've just missed the communication.) It would be a shame to be assuming the time in the bucket was allowing chorine to escape and then have it turn out that they are using chloramines, which won't go away.

Secondly, and this goes to Raptors comment questioning why - I will say that as a happy user of a Python, one of my few disappointments came on learning that the elevated CO2 in water fresh from the tap (because of the greater pressure in the mains) is a cause of a large enough CO2 fluctuation on a large water change to stimulate BBA (black brush algae.) Aerating water seems to be perhaps the only way to combat this (if there's another I'd be interested to hear it!)

WD

 

[Waterloo Kid]

Good point on the CO2. I do not believe that Chloramine is used by my water supplier, but will double check!

Ta.

 

[raptorrex]

Secondly, and this goes to Raptors comment questioning why - I will say that as a happy user of a Python, one of my few disappointments came on learning that the elevated CO2 in water fresh from the tap (because of the greater pressure in the mains) is a cause of a large enough CO2 fluctuation on a large water change to stimulate BBA (black brush algae.) Aerating water seems to be perhaps the only way to combat this (if there's another I'd be interested to hear it!)

WD

lol, couldn't agree more. however, I've gone over the way to, greatly, reduce CO2 in tap water. and it still does not need this "butt". its cool however you do it. to be fair, it does not matter. but, thinking its "necessary" or, even, "desirable", is an error, imo.

 

[waterdrop]

Secondly, and this goes to Raptors comment questioning why - I will say that as a happy user of a Python, one of my few disappointments came on learning that the elevated CO2 in water fresh from the tap (because of the greater pressure in the mains) is a cause of a large enough CO2 fluctuation on a large water change to stimulate BBA (black brush algae.) Aerating water seems to be perhaps the only way to combat this (if there's another I'd be interested to hear it!)

WD

lol, couldn't agree more. however, I've gone over the way to, greatly, reduce CO2 in tap water. and it still does not need this "butt". its cool however you do it. to be fair, it does not matter. but, thinking its "necessary" or, even, "desirable", is an error, imo.

Yes, I suppose its getting into pretty subtle stuff and I'm the first to admit this is not something I've been even willing to test, much less actually -do-. I still greatly appreciate the added efficiency that my quick Python water changes allow - makes it more likely I will actually get off my butt and do the weekly water change. Once I read over at James's planted algae page that CO2 swings are the main cause of BBA (and I've got some BBA in the higher flow regions of my tank, in front of my Koralia for instance) I assumed that if I ever bothered to store up a 50% water change worth and let the CO2 gas off, that my BBA problem would be lessened or go away. Does anybody think that would happen or not happen? WD

 

[OldMan47]

If you decide to go with a water butt, make sure that the one you buy is rated for use with food. A food grade water butt should be fine as far as leaching chemicals into the water. One of my club members has a water supply from a deep well that comes into the house with no dissolved oxygen in it. If he uses it directly for a large water change, the fish do not get enough oxygen and they suffocate. He has started using a day of letting the water stand just to give the water from his well a chance to absorb enough atmospheric oxygen to be safe for his fish. With a well there is no reason for him to worry about chlorine, but the oxygen issue caught up with him instead. He simply fills the water butt and lets it stand for a full day before using it for his water changes.

 

[Dave Spencer]

Once I read over at James's planted algae page that CO2 swings are the main cause of BBA (and I've got some BBA in the higher flow regions of my tank, in front of my Koralia for instance)

I`m not sure of your tank specs, WD, but there is the possibility that the CO2 is a limiting factor, which could cause a BBA bloom. If you have lower light levels, this will be unlikely. I have been involved in one or two chats elsewhere where it has been noticed that alga that are specifically CO2 induced appear directly in the path of highest flow areas, particularly where there are plants involved. Plants are probably not able to sequester carbon when the flow is too high. Pointing a power head in the right direction can be a bit tricky, and the direction needs changing as plant mass changes and influences flow around the tank.

I assumed that if I ever bothered to store up a 50% water change worth and let the CO2 gas off, that my BBA problem would be lessened or go away. Does anybody think that would happen or not happen? WD

It would most likely be lessened because you will have removed the cause. The BBA you have in your tank will be there to stay, unless you physically remove it, or start dosing a liquid carbon supplement such as Excel. Spot dosing the algae will certainly do the trick. You could always consider injecting CO2. Either method would show an increase in plant health.

Dave.