Swordtail Mouth Out Of Water

[hananfarag]

Hi
i had 4 swordtail from 3 monthes (1male- 3female)
the male is the largest about 2 inch with the tail
in a 30 liter tank with sponge filter and air pump
i change 5 liters twice a week (tape water left for 48 hours)
2 days ago the male is sometimes swiming vertically  and many times getting his mouth out of water , he is eating well.
the other fish is acting well
i tried increasing bubles of the air pump and changed 5 liters a 3rd time during this week  but no change, he is always trying to get his mouth out of water.
what's wrong ? and what can i do?
unfortionately i have no test kits and no near fish store have>
thanks a lot
 

 

[the_lock_man]

It could be a number of issues low oxygen, high ammonia, high nitrite. Part of the problem is the tank is too small for swordtails, they need a much bigger tank than 30l, I would say at least 100l for them. It could well be that your filter is not big enough to deal with the ammonia produced by the fish.
 
Since you have increased the rippling at the surface by increasing the bubbles, it suggests it's not low oxygen.
 
At the moment, it sounds to me as though your fish are poisoning themselves, but without test readings I can't tell.
 
I see you are in Egypt, and am aware of the tensions in your country at the moment, which I guess makes travelling around a more risky thing to do, but you do need to get the test kit - could one of your local fish stores order in a test kit for you? Do you have the facility to order via the internet?
 
In the meantime, I would also say that you aren't changing enough water, because those fish are producing an awful lot of ammonia. At the moment, I suggest you change 25l daily, until the fish show signs of improvement, and then start cutting back until you reach a level where they are comfortable, and is less work for you.

 

[betta fish]

A 30L tank is very small for 4 Swordtail, it does sound like he may be suffering from oxygen deprivation what is the temperature of the tank? increasing bubbles does not really add anymore oxygen you need to get the surface of the water agitating, I would swap the media of the sponge filter into an internal filter and keep this splashing on the surface to make ripples, this is what will add oxygen to the water, cooler water will help too depending on current temperature, I would also look into getting a bigger tank for them or reducing numbers.

 

[the_lock_man]

A 30L tank is very small for 4 Swordtail, it does sound like he may be suffering from oxygen deprivation what is the temperature of the tank? increasing bubbles does not really add anymore oxygen you need to get the surface of the water agitating, I would swap the media of the sponge filter into an internal filter and keep this splashing on the surface to make ripples, this is what will add oxygen to the water, cooler water will help too depending on current temperature, I would also look into getting a bigger tank for them or reducing numbers.

 
Increasing the flow of bubbles will increase surface agitation, thereby helping oxygenation of the water.

 

[hananfarag]

thanks a lot for quick reply
it is difficult to get test kits these days
but the other fish is good. can water quality be the reason??
i have a heater 18degree temprature , do u advice reducing temprature??
the other fish are small ,one 0.5 inch and the other 2 are 1 inch,  i thought that i could wait till they grow then i get a larger tank, is this wrong?

 

[betta fish]

 

A 30L tank is very small for 4 Swordtail, it does sound like he may be suffering from oxygen deprivation what is the temperature of the tank? increasing bubbles does not really add anymore oxygen you need to get the surface of the water agitating, I would swap the media of the sponge filter into an internal filter and keep this splashing on the surface to make ripples, this is what will add oxygen to the water, cooler water will help too depending on current temperature, I would also look into getting a bigger tank for them or reducing numbers.

 
Increasing the flow of bubbles will increase surface agitation, thereby helping oxygenation of the water.
 

True, but not as much as a filter splashing on the surface of the water. 

thanks a lot for quick reply
it is difficult to get test kits these days
but the other fish is good. can water quality be the reason??
i have a heater 18degree temprature , do u advice reducing temprature??
the other fish are small ,one 0.5 inch and the other 2 are 1 inch,  i thought that i could wait till they grow then i get a larger tank, is this wrong?

The temperature is quite cool already so I would not reduce it further, the water quality will be easier to maintain in a larger tank so if you can get one I would do so now rather than wait for them to get larger.

 

[Ch4rlie]

thanks a lot for quick reply
it is difficult to get test kits these days
but the other fish is good. can water quality be the reason??
i have a heater 18degree temprature , do u advice reducing temprature??
the other fish are small ,one 0.5 inch and the other 2 are 1 inch,  i thought that i could wait till they grow then i get a larger tank, is this wrong?

 
I presume you are saying 18 degrees Celsius? 
 
If so, IMO would say 18C is a little bit low although swordtails can survive in anything between 18 to 28 C. 
 
Personally I would increase the temp to somewhere in between, say 21C to 25C but since you live in Egypt and I have been there before, its a very humid and hot country so not sure how much that affects tank temperatures. 
 
Do you have a thermometer in your tank to accurately tell what your water temperature is?
 
And yes, I agree with Lock Man about increasing your water changes and especially getting a water test kit, that helps a lot in checking what may be wrong with your water and help diagnose why your fish are gasping at surface of water.
 
If you can, get one of these test kits via internet or your local fish store to order one for you.

 

[the_lock_man]

thanks a lot for quick reply
it is difficult to get test kits these days
but the other fish is good. can water quality be the reason??

 
Yes, water quality can be the reason. Some humans have a higher ability to resist poor conditions than others, and it's the same with fish.
 

 

 


A 30L tank is very small for 4 Swordtail, it does sound like he may be suffering from oxygen deprivation what is the temperature of the tank? increasing bubbles does not really add anymore oxygen you need to get the surface of the water agitating, I would swap the media of the sponge filter into an internal filter and keep this splashing on the surface to make ripples, this is what will add oxygen to the water, cooler water will help too depending on current temperature, I would also look into getting a bigger tank for them or reducing numbers.

 
Increasing the flow of bubbles will increase surface agitation, thereby helping oxygenation of the water.
 

True, but not as much as a filter splashing on the surface of the water. 

thanks a lot for quick reply
it is difficult to get test kits these days
but the other fish is good. can water quality be the reason??
i have a heater 18degree temprature , do u advice reducing temprature??
the other fish are small ,one 0.5 inch and the other 2 are 1 inch,  i thought that i could wait till they grow then i get a larger tank, is this wrong?

The temperature is quite cool already so I would not reduce it further, the water quality will be easier to maintain in a larger tank so if you can get one I would do so now rather than wait for them to get larger.
 


 
I agree with both points that Betta Fish makes there. If the temp is down at 18C (I guess you must have aircon - since I can't believe the temp would stay that low in an Egyptian summer), then oxygen levels would be higher than the same tank at 28C. Certainly don't turn the temp down any further, but since swordtails can live in quite cool water, I would leave it there for the moment, until we can get to the bottom of the problem.
 
Again, I appreciate the Egypt is not the happiest of places, but you really do need to obtain that test kit from somewhere.

 

[hananfarag]

hi
this morning i found one of the female swordtails was bitting the male (ill) fish, especially the lower fin
i separated the male in a smaller (8 liter) plastic tank with a pump filter
he is lying down near the filter and from time to time he tries to go up  (as if jumping on the tail )
i don't know what to do to save him
thanks a lot

 

[hananfarag]

he refused to eat today

 

[hananfarag]

Help
my swordtail upper fin tips started to be grey
what to do ???

 

[Ch4rlie]

I can't advise anything other than do at least 25% water changes.
 
What we really need is your water test results if you can manage to get a test kit or you local fish store may help you out.
 
Are you having difficulty getting hold of a water test kit in your part of Egypt?
 
Sorry 

 

[hananfarag]

i asked today in several fish stores i didnt find the kit
i could not go to the far stores this week
yesterday i changed 50% of water , i added 0.5 small spoon of salt but in vain
today i changed 50% of water, he refused to eat, swimming vertically, upper fins tips grey, sometimes air bubbles come from the mouth and inverte during swimming>
is it the end??
do i need to add salt again
any advices?

 

[snazy]

If you've no way of testing the water to use as a guide how much water changes to do while the tank is cycling, then I'd advise do an initial 90% water change(leave the fish just enough water to stay upright) followed by a smaller 30-40% in a row. That should bring any possible ammonia/nitrites down to 0 or near 0, then do daily 50% and maybe every other day do two large water changes in a row. Use the fish as a guide. If they look sick, then go as large and as often as you can on the water changes.  Ammonia and nitrite can kill them so you need to keep doing that until you see no visible behaviour issues with the fish. They'll tell you if you are around watching them often enough.