Sick Pearl Gouramies

[Wasserpest]

About 4 weeks ago I added a pair of Pearl Gouramies to my tank. The male showed some discoloration at his back/fin, which has now developed into an ulcerlike spot with some white stuff hanging out. The female is infected as well.

Here some pics to show what I am talking about

Edit: See my next post for the links.

From searching on the web, I think it is Columnaris, another name for it is "saddlepatch disease" and that's how it looks like. There is no cotton-like substance growing anywhere. Septicemia is another guess.

First I tried a treatment with Furan-2. There was no improvement, but the male started growing one of those white attachments out of his eye.

After the Furan useless green-blue water painting procedure, I tried Maracyn-Two. After reading the package I realized that actually Maracyn (not TWO) is for treatment of columnaris accd to the manufacturer.

That confused me... since columnaris is a gram-negative bacterium, and Maracyn-Two is for gram-negative, and Maracyn for gram-positive, one would think...

The Maracyn-Two quickly killed my lonely ghost shrimp. The Gourami male got rid of whatever was growing out of his eye, but both Gouramies still show that same stuff coming out of their dorsal fin base, although the area is somewhat less red.

So I am not sure what to do... today is the last of the 5 treatments, the water has gotten cloudy (as expected with Maracyn), both Gouramies are still eating as always, actually apart from rubbing against plants and sometimes swimming a little funny they don't seem to be too affected.

Has anyone seen this, knows what it is, and had success treating this disease? Potassium permanganate, Copper sulfate, Acriflavine, Terramycin, Green, Blue, Oxytetracyclin, Melafix?

I guess I just go back to regular water changes, trying to ignore and hope it will all clear up by itself

 

[Dragonslair]

I can't get into the sites you've provided, however from your description, I would try Melafix. Most treatments are harsh on any inverts. They just haven't got the backbone for it.
You obviously are a knowledgeable person and have approached treatment from the right direction.

 

[reg2k2]

I, too, had a fish w/ the saddle-back lesion, no cottony growth.
Do you have a separate tank you could move them to...any other fish seem affected?

I used Melafix when I spotted the developed wound (it was never red, tho), which closed it up nicely.
If u feel medication is needed, oxytetracycline is one choice for columnaris, pref. in food form (tho I've been told FDA pulled them...I was able to find old stock). Can't say whether or not it helped; apparently my fish was as healed as he was gonna get...he's got a mark left in place of the wound.

Tank clean? The pathogen thrives on excess detritus...

jme, dunno if it helps much.

perhaps you could post a pic in the 'pictures' forum...

 

[Wasserpest]

I heard many opinion about Melafix, from "It's a miracle" and "That's all I need" to "Totally non-sense, stinks up your water and makes you believe it works".

For now, I am trying to find out what the problem is before madicating my fishies anymore.

Let's see if this works better:

http/www.pbase.com/image/19353035
http/www.pbase.com/image/19353011

 

[reg2k2]

Looks to me like you've got yourself an anchor worm.

Sry, not up on treatments...perhaps you can find something here or run a search.

good luck.

 

[Wasserpest]

Looks to me like you've got yourself an anchor worm.

Sry, not up on treatments...perhaps you can find something here or run a search.

good luck.

reg2k2,

That's it! Thank you soooo much!!! Wow, that was a quick turnaround. Looks like I wasted a lot of medicine, except that perhaps I prevented secondary bacterial infections

Will see if I get something that contains Dimilin/Diflubenzuron (I know that stuff from my pesticide classes...) Not sure where though, doesn't sound like it's sold in LFS.

Anyway, thanks again...

WasserPest

 

[val]

Says in my book, to treat anchor worms, remove the fish from the tank and carefully pull out the worm with tweezers. (good luck with that.) Do not break off the head! Treat the wound with antiseptic. For serious infestations, administer Metriponate. 1.125-1.8 mg per gallon/4.5 liters. Those white threads come with anchor worms, if you were wondering.

Hope you get rid of those suckers,
Valerie

 

[Wasserpest]

Do not break off the head!

Off the worm?!

Just kidding... thanks for the help. I am a little hesitant to catch the fish and start operating on them... although perhaps at night, when they sleep, they won't even realize... Since they have it already for 4 weeks, I think I should do something to kill the juvenile stages that are sitting in the water looking for new hosts.

I was looking for Dimilin which seems to be ideal in my case... but I am out of luck, looks like it is not registered in California, at least nobody will ship it here...

Metriponate? Never heard that one

 

[Mogo]

Yikes, the dreaded anchor worm. The first step in dealing with these critters is understanding the life cycle. Funny enough, this things are not actually worms, they are crustaceans, guess they got their name because they are elongate and resemble worms. Now the worms you see with the Y-shape are the females, they get this distinct shape because of the egg sacs. The males and females mate on the fish, and then the males die. The female then releases her eggs into the water. The eggs turn into larvae and at this point they are free swimming for a little while, and then they find their fish host. They then become infectious and reside in the gills of your fish. That is the reason why your fish are rubbing and scratching, from the irritation. The larvae grow, and eventually reside on the skin of your fish where they mature and reach adulthood, and become sexually mature and start the cycle all over again. The whole life cycle takes about 6 weeks to complete.

The first step would be to set up a hospital tank for your infected fish, and hope that none of your other fish have already been infected. Then I would start removing the adult worms, maybe one or two a day. This will help minimize the stress you put on the fish. Keep an eye on the open wounds at removal sites for signs of bacterial/fungal infections. As for meds, Aquatronics has a med called Dyacide which I've heard works quite well for Lernea, or there is Clout which is also supposed to be effective (although I know that in the Clout intstructions they do not specify how long to use it for, but since it works by screwing with the nervous system of organisms I would suggest that 5 days be the max, to avoid any damage to your fish). After medicating, I would keep your fish in isolation for six-seven weeks. This way you can make sure all the life stages are gone. Hope this helps, and keep us posted!

 

[Wasserpest]

I was considering removing the worms/crustaceans last night, but since they have been there for quite a while I guess they can stay there for another day or two until the poison hits them

Now that I know what it is I feel much better (for my fishies). From what I read the best medication would be something containing Dimilin (Insect Chitin Inhibitor). There is a dog pill called "Program" against fleas on dogs, I hope it is available here somewhere.

I would prefer that way over clout or other organophosphates since it is totally harmless to fish and (good) bacteria.

I don't have a hospital tank, but since I have misdiagnosed that for such a long time I would assume there are some juvenile stages already searching for new victims, so I consider the whole thing a big 100 gal hospital tank

Thanks for the help, and I will let you know how it goes... and perhaps post some pics of HAPPY Pearl Gouramies!

 

[Wasserpest]

Looks like there is no Dimilin containing pill or drop to be found in California

Has anyone experiences/success stories/horror stories with something called Anti-Fluke ??

 

[Mogo]

What company is Anti-Fluke by? I'll check it out, need to know who manufactures it.

 

[Wasserpest]

Google Google Google.... here you go: http/www.aq-products.com/Catalog/DIRECTI...nstructions.htm

Aquarium Products

 

[Wasserpest]

Instead of Anti-Fluke I got a bottle of pills called Metronidazole (by Aquafish) which hopefully will do the trick 8)

Anyone with experiences with that stuff?

 

[Mogo]

Hmmm, I don't know how effective Metron would be. Never tried using it for larger non-protozoan parasites. The stuff works great on flagellated protists, but don't know how much it would do for the Lernea. Have you consider using copper sulphate?