Please Help - Mysterious Death - Any Ideas?

[Jue]

Hi

On Friday night, our 1 (of 2) red robin gourami managed to get itself stuck on the filter twice in the space of 20 minutes. After turning the filter off briefly to free it, it just sat at the top of the tank in the corner and looked very pale and thin. The other gourami wouldn't leave it alone so we assumed it was probably being bullied and have moved it to another tank on its own. He seems to be making a good recovery and is eating and pooing and other than still looking a bit on the thin side seems to be ok.

However... about 20 minutes ago we looked in the main tank to find one of the guppies floating upside down, very obviously dead. We had only looked in there less than half an hour before and they had all been totally fine. No sign that anything was wrong. We have since removed him from the tank and there are no obvious signs of any disease or bite marks.

I've just done a water test and they all seem fine too:
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0 (had never changed colour when I've tested for it and didn't change colour again tonight)
Nitrate 0.6
Water temp 27C
180litre tank

The last water change, using dechlorinator, was done last monday, and nothing has been added to the tank. We appear to have a slight problem with hairy algae on the plants and rocks in the tank but other than that I can't think of anything that could have caused the guppy to die so suddenly.

Any ideas would be very welcome, as we don't want to lose any others.

Thanks
Jue

 

[WILDER]

Don't like the sound of the fish being thin, how thin, does the fish have a sunken in belly, check the anus to see if its red and inflamed or enlarged, what colour is the poo.

 

[Jue]

Don't like the sound of the fish being thin, how thin, does the fish have a sunken in belly, check the anus to see if its red and inflamed or enlarged, what colour is the poo.

I've just had another look at him and I wouldn't say that his tummy looks sunken in. He just looks thinner than the other one. Also he has lost a lot of his red colour on the top third of his body and was quite a pale colour.

I can't see anything around his anus to suggest that it's red (sorry but his whole underneath is a lovely red colour so it's difficult to see), and when he pooed yesterday and today it looked pale in colour as normal.

 

[WILDER]

Not stringy looking the poo, how long has he been thin, grossly thin as in wasting away look.
As being quite thin can be internal parasites or fish tb.

 

[Jue]

Not stringy looking the poo, how long has he been thin, grossly thin as in wasting away look.
As being quite thin can be internal parasites or fish tb.

I noticed him looking thinner than the other one a few days ago, and as the other one is chasing him all the time and won't leave him alone for 2 minutes, I thought that he was being bullied. This next bit probably sounds a bit mad but I hope you can understand what I'm trying to say but it's almost like you can see his tummy through his skin. With the other one he is a quite dark red colur and you can't see through it, but this one is very pale and where his tummy is it's darker and quite shiny.

I don't think that his poo was what I would call stringy. It was about 10mm in length and didnt seem to stay attached to him for very long.

 

[WILDER]

I wondering if he has a parasite like velvet as they can go thin with external parasites, any excess mucas on the gills or body, any laboured breathing or flicking and rubbing against objects, as with being stressed a fish can soon come down with parasites.
Does the patch on his belly look like a greyish white in colour like a dusting.

 

[Jue]

I wondering if he has a parasite like velvet as they can go thin with external parasites, any excess mucas on the gills or body, any laboured breathing or flicking and rubbing against objects, as with being stressed a fish can soon come down with parasites.
Does the patch on his belly look like a greyish white in colour like a dusting.

Before I moved him from the other tank I would have said that he did possibly have laboured breathing. He wasn't gasping for breath but just stayed at the top. Since he has been in the other tank he has been a lot better. I can't see any sign of mucus on him. It's just his lower fin that has still got the red colouring the rest of him looks like a grey white but I wouldn't say that its a dusting either. He hasn't got anything on his skin, It's just as if all the colour has drained out of him.

 

[WILDER]

Grey white patches can be bacterial or parasites,does the greyish white patch run along the back and down the sides to form a saddle look.

 

[Jue]

Grey white patches can be bacterial or parasites,does the greyish white patch run along the back and down the sides to form a saddle look.

I'll reply as quick as I can, I'm just trying to upload some pics of him

Grey white patches can be bacterial or parasites,does the greyish white patch run along the back and down the sides to form a saddle look.

I'll reply as quick as I can, I'm just trying to upload some pics of him

Can you believe that the little bugger doesn't look as pale on the photos. They are not brilliant but at least you can see him. I'll see if I can get some more. He keeps ducking behind the filter as soon as I get the camera out

don't know if you can see from the third photo but he is pooing again. I looks pale in colour still but red on the end

 

[WILDER]

No he looks in a bad way, going to be hard as it can point both ways to parasite and bacteria. but gouramis are more prone to bacterial problems. Is he in issolation.
Have you been feeding bloodworms.

 

[Jue]

No he looks in a bad way, going to be hard as it can point both ways to parasite and bacteria. but gouramis are more prone to bacterial problems. Is he in issolation.
Have you been feeding bloodworms.

Yes he is on his own. He has definitely improved since Friday night but obviously I don't want to lose him. What treatment would you advise me to get? Also, do you think this could explain the loss of the guppy earlier tonight? That was so sudden and I just can't think of any explanation for it at all. All the others are behaving totally normal.

Jue
edited to say that bloodworms are given every couple of weeks for the corys, but obviously they all tuck in

 

[WILDER]

For now i would go with a bacterial med, you could maybe add a parasite med at half dose.
As he looks in bad shape and there isn't much to lose.

Don't like the sounds of that red poo on the end, do you feed any red foods or bloodworms in the last couple of days.

 

[Jue]

For now i would go with a bacterial med, you could maybe add a parasite med at half dose.
As he looks in bad shape and there is much to lose.

Can you tell me any specific ones to try? It's the first time we've had a problem with any of the fish since we got them, let alone a death, so I haven't got a clue what to do next.

Should I just treat his tank or should I do the main one as well in case that is what caused the death of the guppy?

edited to add - his food is just normal flake food which does have red bits in it. Could it be this?

 

[WILDER]

Increase aeration in the tank as meds take the 02 out of the water.

Need that info on the feeding as it important as red poo can be internal parasites Camallanus

 

[Jue]

Increase aeration in the tank as meds take the 02 out of the water.

Is this when I need to use a carbon sponge or just the normal filter. I've only been using normal sponges until now. Unfortunately I haven't got any cycled sponges to put in the filter with him, unless I cut one of the others up that are in the main tank. I only set it up on Friday night for him.

If I increase aeration is he likely to get sucked onto the filter again?