Now 8 Dead Guppies! I Need Help!

[andy.ahad]

Hi All,

I've been keeping tropical fish now for about a year and have 3 setups. The setup in my bedroom is a 90 litre tank with an adequate submerged filter and heater. in this tank I had 12 guppies. 4 males and 8 females and 5 neons. I noticed about a week ago that most of the guppies and a few of the neons were "Flashing" alot. They were constantly flicking off of the gravel and the ornaments. (This started about 2 days after I introduced all the fish to a bigger tank which I got from a family member who could no longer care for her fish. (My mother in law got the fish, I got the tank). Anyways I decided I probably had an ich infestation as no spots or marks were visible on any of the fish. (I read ich can be like this in the earl stages). Rather than use any chemicals I decided to go the heat and salt route. I raised the temp to 86f and added 1 table spoon of aquarium salt per 5 gallons. However since doing this I have lost 7 of the guppies!! I have inspected the dead guppies with a magnifying glass and still can't see any white spots or growths of any kind, but they did appear to be very red around the gills.

Also the fish that are still alive seem to be healthy and active, but are still constantly flicking off the gravel and the ornaments. My water chemistry is as follows:

PH 7.2 (Tap PH is 7.8)
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 10.

My water is described by the water company as moderately soft.

Obviously I have something going on. Could it be ich, or does it sound like something more sinister? Any urgent help would be much appreciated.

BTW I don't have a QT tank as it cracked, but I do have a spare 13 litre tank and a spare 25w heater.

Andy

 

[glolite]

Sounds like something unhealthy in the new tank to me. Are there different ornaments like rocks etc in the tank you recently got? If the treatment for ich isn't working then personally I would do a 50% water change, turn the heat back down and treat the whole tank with an all round antibacterial medication. eSHa 2000 has worked for my fish and it's also recommended for treating fish in quarantine although that could be down to the manufacturers wanting to sell more of course. However, I have had successes with it. Hope this helps.

 

[andy.ahad]

Sounds like something unhealthy in the new tank to me. Are there different ornaments like rocks etc in the tank you recently got? If the treatment for ich isn't working then personally I would do a 50% water change, turn the heat back down and treat the whole tank with an all round antibacterial medication. eSHa 2000 has worked for my fish and it's also recommended for treating fish in quarantine although that could be down to the manufacturers wanting to sell more of course. However, I have had successes with it. Hope this helps.

Hi and thanks for the response.

I have 3 small ornaments in the tank which I've had for some time. However when I swapped tanks I also added some new silk plants as most if not all of the females were pregnant and I wanted to provide some good hiding places for any fry that might have survived.

I take it that I would have to gradually reduce the temp over a few days, so as not to cause temp shock? I will also go to LFS tomorrow to see if they stock the esha 2000. I do have some Melafix, and malachite green around here somewhere, but have been reluctant to use it as I wasn't sure what I was dealing with. Would they be of any use do you think?

Andy

 

[glolite]

I wouldn't think the silk plants would be harmful. Melafix is antibacterial but not always so good if you have a serious infection. Depends how old the bottles of meds are and I don't know much about malachite green.
Was the new tank empty for a while as sometimes bacteria can grow around the seals etc. I'm sure you cleaned it well before setting up but there's always the odd bacterial lurker waiting to strike Personally I'd go for the eSHa. More expensive but good.

 

[andy.ahad]

The tank had only been 80% emptied before I got it as I didn't want any of the beneficial bacteria to be destroyed before I got it. It had still been in use right up to me transporting it home and as far as I know the previous owner (My wifes Aunt) hadn't had any problems with her stock. I did clean the glass and did a small gravel vac whilst I emptied and refilled it.

I take it from your replies that you think it is some sort of bacterial infection??

I will go get some of the stuff you reccommend first thing!

Just hopeit works!!

Thanks for all your help
Andy

 

[glolite]

It was only the redness around the gills that made me think bacterial. Fish keeping is often guesswork with a bit of experience thrown in. Might be worth waiting for a few other replies from other members but if that many fish have died I would suspect a bacterial infection. Could have got in during transporting the tank as it sounds like you did everything right.

 

[andy.ahad]

Hi All,

Since adding the meds that were reccommended on this thread I haven't had any more deaths, and my remaining fish seem to be doing ok. They are still flicking around on things, albeit not half as much. The problem is I have a few pregnant females which look like they could drop very soon. I want to try and keep as many of the fry as poss, but am worried that there is still some disease in the tank and that the fry may die once born.

My question is what would be the best way to try and save these fry. I do have another 13l tank and heater but no other filters, or substrate.

Also if I uploaded pics (Don't know how to do this so some help would be appreciated) would anyone be able to give me their best guess on when these guppies might drop?


Cheers
Andy

BTW I have a 50l setup with about 40 molly and guppy fry in there atm, but don't want to risk infecting this tank, by putting any new infected fry in. But I will do once they are all clear.

 

[WILDER]

Signs of gill flukes are .
Red inflamed gills, can look like there bleeding, pale gills with excess slime.
Opaque body with excess slime.
Flicking and rubbing, darting, erratic swimming.
Laboured breathing or gasping.
Sores on the body of the fish.
Fish will sometimes swim in a jerky movement.
Spitting food out.
Weighloss sometimes.

Gill flukes also cause bacterial infections as in the parasite hooks or suckers they carry a nasty bacteria, which enter the fish blood stream when it pierces the skin.

 

[andy.ahad]

Signs of gill flukes are .
Red inflamed gills, can look like there bleeding, pale gills with excess slime.
Opaque body with excess slime.
Flicking and rubbing, darting, erratic swimming.
Laboured breathing or gasping.
Sores on the body of the fish.
Fish will sometimes swim in a jerky movement.
Spitting food out.
Weighloss sometimes.

Gill flukes also cause bacterial infections as in the parasite hooks or suckers they carry a nasty bacteria, which enter the fish blood stream when it pierces the skin.

Hmmm Treatment?

 

[WILDER]

Here a link to flukes. Scroll down to flukes.
http/www.swedesdock.com/pondpara.sht

Wormer plus once a week for 4 weeks.
http/wormerplus.co.uk/

 

[andy.ahad]

Thanks Wilder!

Will look into that.

 

[WILDER]

Does it sound like flukes.
Do the fish labour breath.

You can buy the med here.
http/www.aquarist-classifieds.co.uk/php/detail62_45492.php

 

[andy.ahad]

Does it sound like flukes.
Do the fish labour breath.

You can buy the med here.
[URL="http/www.aquarist-classifieds.co.uk/php/detail62_45492.php"]http/www.aquarist-classifieds.co.uk/php/detail62_45492.php[/URL]

Well of all the symptoms you laid out, I can say that they have at least 3 of them. ie Flicking, rubbing, erratic swimming and laboured/fast breathing. So I guess it is a real possibility!!

 

[andy.ahad]

Just had another guppy die He was my favourite too!!

Yesterday he was fine, but this morning he was just sitting still at the bottom of the tank. Every now and again he would try to swim about but would just sink or roll over upside down and then sink. It was so sad to watch. Anyways he died shortly after, so I removed him and inspected him with a magnifying glass. I'm no expert or anything but the only thing I could see wrong was blood on his tail fin. It was actually like a smear of jelly all over the tips of his tail. he also looked very red aroud his anal area.

Does anyone have any idea what this is, as I am really desperate to treat the tank, but don't know what with!! One of my females is also giving birth as I type, and I have noticed that she has lost her colour. Her tail is now a VERY dull white, whereas it was blue. her body is also a very dull whitish colour. Other than that she seems fine atm.

I have also noticed some of my older fry in my fry tank have started flicking on the ornaments and leaves of the plants, and I'm really worried that this tank is now infected!! I really don't want to loose any fry as my kids would be devastated!!!

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE HELP!!!!

Andy

 

[glolite]

Did you treat for three days with the anti bacterial meds? If so perhaps do a 40% water change and treat for gill flukes, Check on the bottle to see if you need to treat for bacterial infection again at the same time as for gill flukes.