Not exactly textbook....

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mcordelia

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Hi guys,

Some of you have probably heard reference to the 20gallon that I set up recently and intended to silent cycle. On getting the most recent feedback on the tank, I bought a large water sprite and on impulse, a mystery snail, figuring even if the tank isn't cycled how much ammonia can a snail generate at the end of the day.

Before I put the snail in I tested the water just to be sure, and measured 0 ammonia (no surprise since none has been added), and nearly 5ppm nitrites. Huh that's weird I thought, and proceeded to do a 75% water change with a full vacuum just in case, and plopped my snail in, thinking that the water sprite should take care of the nitrites in no time and snailypants should be happy as a clam with a whole tank to itself.

Snail was looking lethargic today, so I tested the water again and I was at 1ppm nitrites and a faint green on ammonia. WUTTTT is going on?!?!? Where is this mysterious ammonia source?! Why do the nitrites keep going up? How did I end up doing a traditional cycle when the goal was to do. Silent cycle?!

In the tank apart from the plants is hardware store sand that was washed to high heaven before putting in. It's quartz based and doesn't affect the pH, so I can't imagine it causing ammonia (also wouldn't have read 0 ammonia the other day if it was a source, I don't think).

My only theory is that since the plants took a hit in shipping that there was sufficient dead plant matter stuck in the filter that caused an ammonia source, and then the cycle stalled because the nitrites went too high....? Because I wasn't in the business of trying to cycle my filter and I knew there was the potential for muck in the filter from the plants, I rinsed out my filter in tank water when I did the original big water change, figuring it was better to get rid of plant muck and take a hit on any hypothetical bacterial colonies than leave rotting stuff in the filter. So that being said, the ammonia and nitrites shouldn't keep going up, unless there is a magical source that I'm not accounting for...?

Here is a picture from the day I planted the water sprite, it has already grown since then. I forgot to mention I also added a rock to which I fuddled an attempt of tying java fern to.

IMG_20210108_215028045.jpg


I am using prime so at least the snail should be okay,but how long do I need to expect to be doing daily water changes for? This is an unexpected situation!! Also,am I better off putting snail in a 5gal bucket with a lid and airstone and some cucumber slices and letting the tank do it's thing?
 
Any amount of ammonia is bad for them, and they are pooping machines. Do you have another tank that has been cycled? I can't remember.
 
No this is the first one. It's reading 0 ammonia right now, I'm just confused a) where this is coming from and b) why the plants aren't taking care of it...
 
Hi guys,

Some of you have probably heard reference to the 20gallon that I set up recently and intended to silent cycle. On getting the most recent feedback on the tank, I bought a large water sprite and on impulse, a mystery snail, figuring even if the tank isn't cycled how much ammonia can a snail generate at the end of the day.

Before I put the snail in I tested the water just to be sure, and measured 0 ammonia (no surprise since none has been added), and nearly 5ppm nitrites. Huh that's weird I thought, and proceeded to do a 75% water change with a full vacuum just in case, and plopped my snail in, thinking that the water sprite should take care of the nitrites in no time and snailypants should be happy as a clam with a whole tank to itself.

Snail was looking lethargic today, so I tested the water again and I was at 1ppm nitrites and a faint green on ammonia. WUTTTT is going on?!?!? Where is this mysterious ammonia source?! Why do the nitrites keep going up? How did I end up doing a traditional cycle when the goal was to do. Silent cycle?!

In the tank apart from the plants is hardware store sand that was washed to high heaven before putting in. It's quartz based and doesn't affect the pH, so I can't imagine it causing ammonia (also wouldn't have read 0 ammonia the other day if it was a source, I don't think).

My only theory is that since the plants took a hit in shipping that there was sufficient dead plant matter stuck in the filter that caused an ammonia source, and then the cycle stalled because the nitrites went too high....? Because I wasn't in the business of trying to cycle my filter and I knew there was the potential for muck in the filter from the plants, I rinsed out my filter in tank water when I did the original big water change, figuring it was better to get rid of plant muck and take a hit on any hypothetical bacterial colonies than leave rotting stuff in the filter. So that being said, the ammonia and nitrites shouldn't keep going up, unless there is a magical source that I'm not accounting for...?

Here is a picture from the day I planted the water sprite, it has already grown since then. I forgot to mention I also added a rock to which I fuddled an attempt of tying java fern to.

View attachment 126530

I am using prime so at least the snail should be okay,but how long do I need to expect to be doing daily water changes for? This is an unexpected situation!! Also,am I better off putting snail in a 5gal bucket with a lid and airstone and some cucumber slices and letting the tank do it's thing?
yes pls be nice to snailypants. the ammonia and stuff are spiking, dangerous for them. that also means you are on the right track!
 
But where is it coming from?!! I have not added any ammonia, food, or other deliberate ammonia sources to the tank....
 
But where is it coming from?!! I have not added any ammonia, food, or other deliberate ammonia sources to the tank....
hmm i think the bacteria blooms and then a lot die.
 
I would keep an eye on the ammonia, do daily water changes, and wait for the tank to cycle. Mystery snails produce a lot of waste, and if any of the new plants have decaying leaves, he/she is eating them and turning them into poo. You could temporarily add hornwort to help consume the ammonia.
 
Ammonia and nitrites were there before the snail arrived, I just made the mistake of assuming that there was no ammonia to start with because I hadn't added an ammonia source. So it isn't the snail that's causing the bioload since the snail might honestly be better off in a large uncycled tank since these values are rising higher than what it's poo would provide. It's less than 3/4in in size, so I don't buy that the snail contributes any meaningful amount.

I know that the solution is to just cycle the tank, but I'm confused what the source of ammonia is.

@Essjay @AbbeysDad sorry to bug you - any thoughts?
 
All organic matter creates ammonia, decaying plants, fish/snail poop, dead bacteria, etc. Even some types of substrate produce ammonia, my homemade aqua soil started out as an ammonia factory. Do a good water change and vacuum your substrate really well to help your new snail.
 
I don't know if this is correct, but I think if you let the water sprite float it might be more useful as far as a silent cycle goes as the roots will be more exposed to the water column as well as the leaves. I see something floating in the corner but not sure what it is. It also doesn't look like a whole lot. A successful silent cycle takes a lot of fast growing plants, both floating and stem plants.

I know that doesn't answer all of your questions but just some thoughts.
 
Duckweed. The top is covered, and there are way more roots now than in the original picture posted. I had read that a silent cycle needs 30% plants, but clearly that must be by volume instead of surface area of tank lol. But man, they are not kidding when they say you need A LOT of plants.....

Off to do yet another water change I go!
 
I know many are going to frown and hate this but just martyr the snail like Jesus ... greater good
 
I think I'd carefully test the source water. Also, if chloramine is used, a conditioner will break the chlorine/ammonia bond and neutralize or convert the ammonia into ammonium but it will still test as ammonia....which BB will convert to nitrites, then nitrates.
So perhaps the ammonia 'mystery' is merely chloramine in the water supply.
 

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