No gh from tap

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Jwgoff7772

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I'm currently keeping corydoras and gourami in my 40 gal breeder. My tap has 0 kh and 0 gh. Was having issues with ph swings because of no kh but now I got that under control and acclimated my fish to the neutral ph with a kh of 3-4. Now onto my next issue. I know my fish like soft acidic water but I've read that all fish need some gh to get electrolytes. I have seachem equilibrium but am afraid to use it because I'm dont know if I even need to address my gh. I spoke briefly on this on another thread but my kh/ph was main topic but now I want to figure my gh out on what I should do if anything. Any help is very much appreciated. Thank you
 
I know my fish like soft acidic water but I've read that all fish need some gh to get electrolytes.

The second part of this is absolutely not true. All fish species have evolved to function best in quite specific water, and while some have adaptive capability it has limits.

Most all of the fish species occurring in the Amazon basin have water with zero GH and KH. The pH establishes and remains with very little actual fluctuation. This is why it is so important to know the source habitat of the fish we keep; if we provide what they are designed to require, it goes a long way to healthy fish.

My tap water is zero GH and KH, and I have had fish for more than thirty years now and they live to if not beyond their expected species lifespan and spawn frequently. They are all soft water species, primarily wild caught. I presently have some 50 cories representing 12 species and some of these are 11 years old (since I acquired them).

The minerals required for life processes come in the foods the fish eat, naturally and in the aquarium. Quality food will ensure this is the case. Species that need mineral in the water (for example livebearers, and several other types) do need a higher GH and corresponding pH. But cories and gourami are not in this category.

I dealt with this and pH in the older thread so no point in repeating. Buffering ph is not needed here, and is only adding to possible problems.
 
So my ph going from 6.8-7.0 down to a 6.0 in the span of a week will not affect my fish in a negative way? Because since my tank has not been set up long I check my water twice a day and notice my ph does swing my as much as .2 in just a couple days, that's my main concern because my tank has not been set up long and its swinging this much now and I'm just concerned about how much it could swing 6 months from now. I do not want to add anything to my tank, I just want stability in my ph. That much swing in my ph isnt gonna cause problems?
 
Seeing my tank go from 6.8 to closer to 6.0 in just 3-4 days just made me really nervous
 
So my ph going from 6.8-7.0 down to a 6.0 in the span of a week will not affect my fish in a negative way? Because since my tank has not been set up long I check my water twice a day and notice my ph does swing my as much as .2 in just a couple days, that's my main concern because my tank has not been set up long and its swinging this much now and I'm just concerned about how much it could swing 6 months from now. I do not want to add anything to my tank, I just want stability in my ph. That much swing in my ph isnt gonna cause problems?
Seeing my tank go from 6.8 to closer to 6.0 in just 3-4 days just made me really nervous

First, let's make sure we are on the same page regarding just what is happening. Are you saying that the pH is fluctuating from 7.0 down to 6.0 in one day, and then bouncing back up to 7.0 in a day, or any other timeframe? Or are you saying that the aquarium pH has lowered from 7.0 down to 6.0 and remained around 6.0? These are two very different things; the first is seriously dangerous, the second is normal and harmless (with suitable fish of course).
 
When I first set my tank up for the first week my tank stayed at 6.8 to 7.0 on the pH, even after water changes. But after about 3 weeks I noticed my ph was dropping slightly. Before I change my water it will be around 6.2-6.4. I'll change my water and after the WC it will be back 6.8, then 3-4 days later after the wc it will be closer to 6 sometimes even turning yellow on the api master kit. Usually it will read about 6.2-6.4 but I've seen it come up 6.0 a couple times in the last 10-12days
 
The changes arent within a day but over a couple days but the changes can be as much as .4-.6
 
My concern in my tank getting down to 6.2 (sometines even 6.0) which I'm fine with but then changing water out of my tap that is 6.8-7.0 is causing it to fluctuate between 6.2 and 7.0 between WCs. I'm fine with a low ph but I just cant keep it the same between water changes
 
OK, this is easy to explain (I hope ???? ). I may have gone into this in the other thread, but no matter.

In any aquarium, the accumulation of organics and the slow decomposition of these by various bacteria (primarily in the substrate) produces ammonia and CO2. We can forget the ammonia here as it is the CO2 that is directly involved. This produces carbonic acid, which naturally lowers the pH. The extent to which this occurs depends upon the GH and KH (the buffering aspect as you know) and obviously the level of organics accumulating. There are other factors too, all of which is why even with the identical water the pH may be different from tank to tank, as in my own fish room.

Once the biological system becomes established, which is usually over the first several months, and provided you maintain a regular routine of water changes, filter cleanings, suitable fish load, and not overfeeding, the system will stabilize at some level depending upon the factors affecting it. Live plants if present will be part of this too. Over time this biological system will become quite stable. Provided the fish species are suited to the GH/KH/pH of the system, no problems, no matter what the pH may be.

Freshwater fish must adjust the pH of their blood to equal that of the water in which they live. This is why any sudden and significant fluctuations can be deadly. There are normal diurnal/nocturnal fluctuations in pH in nature and in the aquarium; this is over a 24-hour period and is (or should be) relatively minor, and fish has no issues. The pH will be lowest at the end of the night/beginning of daylight, and highest at the end of daylight/beginning of night. This is caused by the accumulation of CO2 during darkness (thus raising pH) and reduction of CO2 during daylight (thus lowering the pH). This is especially noticeable in planted tanks. The fluctuation can be several decimal pints, say from 6.2 at dawn up to 6.5 or 6.6 at dusk, then lowering back to 6.2 during the darkness of night. This is why you need to test pH at roughly the same time each day if you want to ascertain stability or not in general. Obviously testing pH at a different time for several days running might cause one to think it was bouncing all over the place, when in fact it is extremely stable within the 24-hour period, which is what we want.

Now, water changes. The larger in volume, the more stability the biological system will develop. And this is quite strong once established. My tanks that run at or below pH 5.0 (the lowest I can measure) get a 70% water change once each week, using fresh water with a pH of 7.0 or 7.2, but the pH in the tank never rises more than one or two decimal points, and after a few hours is back to where it was. If the source water had a GH and KH above zero, this would play out differently as the tank would also maintain those values for the most part.

To your numbers. If the pH is remaining in the 6.0 to 6.2 to 6.4 range over a period of days, and your tests are carried out at the same time each day you test, you have nothing to worry about. The fish will adjust their blood pH to this same level, and be very happy (again provided they are species designed to live in this slightly acidic water, which cories and gourami certainly are).
 
Sorry about so many additions to my response but it's in between water changed is my issue, it's not changing over night but within a few days. Theres been atleast 4 occasions where the api master test came up yellow, not sure if it was at 6.0 or perhaps even below since the cut off is 6.0. For this example lets say my ph is 6.2 in my tank this moment and I do a water change and my tap is 6.8-7.0. After changing my water my whole tank goes back up to closer to the 6.8. After about 2- 3 days my ph goes back down to 6.2-6.4 in my tank. That's what I'm dealing with here. Sorry for any confusion
 
Wow, thank you so much bryon, that makes so much more sense on why in getting different readings because of the difference in time of day. I am very very appreciative in your long explanation and it makes much much more sense now. I cant thank you enough
 
Sorry about so many additions to my response but it's in between water changed is my issue, it's not changing over night but within a few days. Theres been atleast 4 occasions where the api master test came up yellow, not sure if it was at 6.0 or perhaps even below since the cut off is 6.0. For this example lets say my ph is 6.2 in my tank this moment and I do a water change and my tap is 6.8-7.0. After changing my water my whole tank goes back up to closer to the 6.8. After about 2- 3 days my ph goes back down to 6.2-6.4 in my tank. That's what I'm dealing with here. Sorry for any confusion

First point, the tank is not yet biologically stable so thus the larger fluctuations. Once it is, the difference should be much less as I explained previously.

Second point, with a zero GH/KH it would be advisable to see if the pH in the tap water is due to an additive from the water authority. Here in Vancouver they add soda ash which raises the pH from the natural 4-5 up to 7.0 or 7.2, but this is temporary. The additive dissipates out fairly quickly, but even before that the stable biological system in the aquarium is stronger. See if you can ascertain what if anything they add, or if the pH is natural.

Third, you could do smaller volume but more frequent water changes if the difference is substantial over a very short period of time. But here it is worth pointing out that several decimal places is not much of an issue for fish, though a change of say 6 to 7 in a few minutes could be. But if these changes are less than 1 degree (meaning from 6.0 to 7.0) and over two or three days, I would not worry.
 
I live in the Seattle Washington state U.S area and after seeing that you're from Vancouver B.C. I'm sure our parameters out of the tap are very similar, thank you again bryon
 
I live in the Seattle Washington state U.S area and after seeing that you're from Vancouver B.C. I'm sure our parameters out of the tap are very similar, thank you again bryon

You're very welcome. And yes, our water is basically identical as the sources are reservoirs in the coastal mountains.
 

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