Is This Big Enough For 1 Betta?

[Tolak]

Hi
I believe there has been some misguidance to the actual volume of water this item can hold??

I see someone said it would hold 2.5 gallons, well thats incorrect.

The volume of a sphere measuring 11x11x5.5 inches = 696 cubic inches
696 cubic inches = 2.5 UK gallons

As this item is only half a sphere, the maximum it can hold is 1.25 uk gallons. That would more than likely end up being less than a gallon, bearing in mind you cant fill it to the top. Also, it may not even be half a sphere, but could be less depending on the angle of the sphere sides?

That size is in no way acceptable for any aquatic animal let alone a betta that may grow to 2 1/2 inches long. I find it very disturbing that moderators on a large fish forum would say it was acceptable without working out the size correctly?

You are correct, it is, after looking closer, a half sphere. I did the calculations based on it being a 5" thick disc, which on further examination it is not. Thank you for the clarification, as well as the mathematical calculation of the volume.

That converts to a hair over 1.5 US gallons, probably closer to 1.25 once reasonably filled. Per my previous links to documentation, still good enough. Personally I wouldn't use it, just due to the wall hanging aspect.

 

[cookiemonster]

Every time i have attempted to contact "Betty Splendens" through their site I have had no replies? They were just general enquiries/help questions. They have neglected to respond to about 5 emails.

I challenge anyone to keep a fish in an unfiltered 1 gallon jar for a week. Then run water tests - Ammonia will be way up, i garentee it.
Is this any way to keep a fish? I think not, especially when you consider the bettas natural environment. And betta in their natural environment have short fins rather than long flowing fins, so are more adapt at surviving in tight spaces.

The breeders you have stated are American, and there is a fundamental difference between fish keeping morals in the UK. In the UK, we dont display bettas in champagne glasses at weddings etc etc Yes some shops will keep their betta in small containers, but these are only temporary homes. This isn't an attack on Americans btw, but merely pointing out a fact.

The fact still remains that this item will hold less than 1.25 gallons, unheated and unfiltered.

 

[Tolak]

I believe this discussion was about a container, not morals, there are plenty of those sort of topics here.

Back to the container in question;

http/www.ibcbettas.org/pages/qa-betta/1-betta-qa/5-live-jar.html

"If you don't have an aquarium, a plastic or glass 1 gallon goldfish bowl will suffice as a container for a Betta. Those are fairly cheap, allow the Betta plenty of room to move around it, and are easy to clean. Even a 1/2 gal bowl is fine for most Bettas as long as the water changes are kept up with. Remember, male Bettas will fight with other Bettas and as such, must be kept separate."

http/www.ibcbettas.org/pages/about.html

"The IBC is a nonprofit, world-wide organization of approximately 700 Members, promoting the selective breeding, raising and study of the genus Betta."

The only time I had any difficulty contacting Betty is when she was about to get married & go on her honeymoon some time back, to be expected.

 

[Curiosity101]

Although I agree that breeders successfully keep their breeding stock in much smaller containers. They also keep them in containers which are much squarer, even jam jars are easily a better shape that a mounted bowl (hemisphere).

Due to the shape I completely agree with cookie monster, and personally reckon only the central 1/3rd of the bowl will really be useable by the fish.

It seems unfair on what is basically a pet, to force it to live in those conditions when you could either not buy it, or you could make a bit of room on a side table.
Or perhaps go and buy a cheap side table (12"x12" surface area would be all that was needed).
And I'm sure it could fit somewhere...maybe next to a sofa? or a desk? Or a table?

 

[lljdma06]

I'm probably late in the game here, but I'll offer my two cents. A 2.5g rectangular (12" x 6" x 8") tank is easier to clean, and at roughly half the price of the proposed wall mount, a steal. The tank I'm talking about is also all glass which won't scratch up like acrylic and it usually comes with a glass cover.

A wall-mounted aquarium wouldn't last 2 seconds in my house, too many heavy door slammers!

 

[cookiemonster]

Refering to the "tank" in question, its virtually impossible to heat and filter, it will only be 5 inches wide in one very small spot i.e. bang in the middle. I cannot understand why people want to use these things? Would you use it for any other fish? Why is it always the Betta that can fit in a tiny tank?
Their natural environment is millions of gallons of paddy field. My opinion is, if a person cannot provide the basic requirements an animal needs, dont get one.

Another point about this bubble is what happens when the owner goes on vacation for 2 weeks? The water will have to be changed. Thats where a much nicer 4 gallon regular tank, heated and filtered, will save to issue of whose going to do the water change.

Re: Betta breeders - I know there are many many breeders who keep their bettas in 1 gallon jars, but if you ask them to answer honestly about the lifespan of their bettas, it would be considerably less than it would be if it were given a better environment. There is no reason to keep a betta in a 1 gallon jar unless its for a)Aesthetics i.e.wall bubble, b)Lack of knowledge as to the bettas needs, or c) Maximising space to increase profits. All these reasons are not putting the needs of the fish first, which I believe is the most important part of fish keeping. Giving the fish a stable healthy environment, which half a bubble isn't. If people that use these type of containers can accept the fact that their betta isn't going to live its life to the full, and are ok with that thought then go for it. But not for one minute should they consider themselves fish keepers.

This half a bubble certainly has more cons than pros, the only pros are refering to aesthetics and space which are biased towards the human. Where as the cons are all directed at the betta i.e. small space, cold water, ammonia spikes etc

 

[Tolak]

Why is it always the betta that can fit in a smaller tank? Perhaps that species is particularly suited for smaller volumes of water, more so than other species. The natural environment of most fish is millions of gallons or more, looking at it that way most all of our fish are in substandard conditions.

Vacation; that is something the owner will have to take into consideration. Breeders have fry tanks that must be tended to daily, they have to take their individual situation into consideration. Breeders go on vacation, this is worked out without too much trouble.

Betta breeders; if there was any risk to potential breeding stock or show winners I don’t think they would take the risk of using gallon jars. If it were a risk to profits they wouldn’t be using gallon jars. Taking risks & putting out substandard fish can taint a breeder’s name, word travels fast, and no breeder I know of wants that. Most breeders I know of are lucky to make any significant profit, most are happy if they break even, they do it for the enjoyment as well as love for aquatics. The breeders mentioned are not breeding on a commercial scale, no Asian corporations, no pond breeding in Florida, all small breeders working out of the home. Being small breeders they work for improvement, any profit is secondary. They have been doing it for decades, and have plenty of show wins and other awards to show continual improvement. These are the sort of people you search out, and question to the point of interrogation; I’m sure they wouldn’t mind if you did just that.

Are there cons to that wall hanging bowl? Well certainly, to me it would be a pain to maintain hanging on a wall. Personally I would go with the 2.5 gallon lljdma mentioned, as I have those on hand, with the nice tight fitting lid. Sponge filter & a 25 watt heater, all on hand. Space is not an issue for me, yet.

The OP mentioned space constraints, if this is an issue for them that con may be outweighed. The other cons you mentioned seem to be worked around quite well by breeders who have been in it for a long time, put out show winning fish, and have subsequently made a good name for themselves, their breeding techniques, and the betta community as a whole.

 

[Inchworm]

I challenge anyone to keep a fish in an unfiltered 1 gallon jar for a week. Then run water tests - Ammonia will be way up, i garentee it.
Is this any way to keep a fish? I think not, especially when you consider the bettas natural environment. And betta in their natural environment have short fins rather than long flowing fins, so are more adapt at surviving in tight spaces.

There is no reason to keep a betta in a 1 gallon jar unless its for a)Aesthetics i.e.wall bubble, b)Lack of knowledge as to the bettas needs, or c) Maximising space to increase profits. All these reasons are not putting the needs of the fish first, which I believe is the most important part of fish keeping. Giving the fish a stable healthy environment, which half a bubble isn't. If people that use these type of containers can accept the fact that their betta isn't going to live its life to the full, and are ok with that thought then go for it. But not for one minute should they consider themselves fish keepers.

The breeders you have stated are American, and there is a fundamental difference between fish keeping morals in the UK

Their natural environment is millions of gallons of paddy field. My opinion is, if a person cannot provide the basic requirements an animal needs, dont get one.

Hi cookiemonster

Let me explain something about the basics of fishkeeping so you will understand why good betta keepers often keep their fish in smaller containers.

The most essential elements of creating a safe and comfortable environment for any fish are clean water kept at an appropriate temperature and plenty of good food. Clean water means water that is free of ammonia, nitrites and has a relatively low amount of nitrates. How it stays that way is irrelevant. Frequent water changes is as good a method as filtration. How often it needs to be changed depends on the size of the container and the size of the fish, of course.

While it true that bettas originate in rice paddies, the fish found there are nothing like the fish sold as B. splendens these days. These are not natural fish but fish that have been selectively bred for generations for particular qualities, especially oversized fins and tails. These are not attributes that lend themselves to survival in the wild.

Since these fish have been developed to satisfy certain human ideas of beauty, does it not follow that their environment should be adapted to fit the needs of their new bodies? This has nothing to do with morals but rather is a matter of practicality. Long flowing fins and tail can be all too easily snagged and ruined by clutter added to in a big tank and make swimming against a current created by a filter excessively tiring to them.

Since the work the betta breeders Tolak posted about make a great commitment of time and attention to their fish, most betta keepers look for a compromise between the two extremes that is workable for them.

I don't like the particular tank in question. It's will be difficult to maintain and if a heater is added, the cord hanging down will detract from its attractiveness. The 2 1/2 gallon tank lljdma06 described is a good size if a smaller tank is desired. It's easy to keep clean and a glass lid can be bought for it for a very reasonable price. I use that size to hatch corydoras and to raise them for several weeks. During this time they require daily big water changes and I can attest that they are easy to do with this size and shape of tank. The top is big enough that I can dip a good sized plastic container in there to remove the water and replace it with fresh.

BTW, good fishkeeping practices have nothing to do with nationality and everything to do with understanding and catering to the needs of fish in general and the specific needs of the species you are keeping.

 

[BigC]

Just to add my two cents worth to the excellent comment my two counterparts have made above.
I don't keep B. splendens but have done on past occasions. Whilst I don't advocate keeping any fish sp. in cramped conditions I realise it is sometimes necessary to do so when breeding is required.
That said I have been successfully keeping and breeding killifish in small tanks for over 35 years the key to this success is regular water-changes. Like Inchworm says Ammonia and Nitrite needs to be kept to almost zero, there will always be a certain amount of Nitrates present but the lower the better. These three statistics must always be kept in check for the well being of your charges. Excessive feeding and fish poo in small containers can spell disaster as the above parameters rocket and not dealt with via large water-changes. I personally would perform water-changes twice a week for larger tanks and fry tanks would get 100% bi-daily. As long as you perform proper husbandry in relation to the size of the fish-keeping receptical involved then things should turn out fine. Just don't adhere to the misconception that B. splendens can utilise it's labyrinth organ to breathe air therefore it will be just fine in some kind of ammonia ridden soup.

Regards
BigC

 

[LauraFrog]

Yikes, this topic is getting a bit snipey... I just reread my post and it sounded a bit harsher than I intended it to. My apologies.

The tank capacity of around 1.5 gallons is considerably larger than I'd originally taken it to be - I didn't bother to do the maths, I was going on the photo of the product which shows a betta looking quite big in comparison to the tank. In size it would be adequate PROVIDED that there are not so many narrow corners that the fish can't actually swim in half that space (which is possibly the case.) That said, it is still PREFERABLE to get a larger tank. Generally speaking, the larger the tank is the happier your betta will be - not least because of the stress of having most of the water in that tank changed every second day, which would be necessary to clean it (filtration is impractical because of the current it would create in there.)

My biggest concern would be, as I said before, that it's nearly impossible to heat that tank. No matter how else you look at it, if the tank is not warm enough the betta will not thrive and I just can't see how it can be done. With a small bowl or stand alone tank, a reptile heat mat under the tank sometimes works if a conventional aquarium heater cannot be used. Unless you're willing to leave central heating on in the room all the time though, I don't see how the temp can stay high enough, or stable enough.

Weight is also a consideration - if it is indeed 1.25 gallons, you could end up with a largeish hole out of the wall, and a tank and fish smashed on the floor. I think your better option, if you want a fish tank on the wall, is to use a slimline panoramic tank and a shelf of suitable size. The problem is that the braces needed to support the shelf will be ugly.

 

[Curiosity101]

Laurafrog, I wouldn't use the betta on the picture as a 'guideline' when working out space/size etc. It is 100% photoshopped onto that picture.

 

[LauraFrog]

Yeah, that's what I meant... I assumed the capacity was around 1/2 gallon (which is far too small by anyone's standards) by that photo, but far better to go by the maths since somebody has done it.

 

[lljdma06]

Just to add my two cents worth to the excellent comment my two counterparts have made above.
I don't keep B. splendens but have done on past occasions. Whilst I don't advocate keeping any fish sp. in cramped conditions I realise it is sometimes necessary to do so when breeding is required.
That said I have been successfully keeping and breeding killifish in small tanks for over 35 years the key to this success is regular water-changes. Like Inchworm says Ammonia and Nitrite needs to be kept to almost zero, there will always be a certain amount of Nitrates present but the lower the better. These three statistics must always be kept in check for the well being of your charges. Excessive feeding and fish poo in small containers can spell disaster as the above parameters rocket and not dealt with via large water-changes. I personally would perform water-changes twice a week for larger tanks and fry tanks would get 100% bi-daily. As long as you perform proper husbandry in relation to the size of the fish-keeping receptical involved then things should turn out fine. Just don't adhere to the misconception that B. splendens can utilise it's labyrinth organ to breathe air therefore it will be just fine in some kind of ammonia ridden soup.

Regards
BigC

You are absolutely right, which is why I plant or have plants in the betta tanks that I keep. The plants will readily consume ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates, leaving the environment quite clean. This reinforces the waterchanges. My betta did well for four years in those conditions and I wouldn't hesitate to keep another that way. They are a great fish to keep. You guys are making me want one again.

 

[dthoffsett]

Just to clarify my post, I said there is nothing wrong with the size (ie volume) of the tank, I never said I thought it was ideal. In fact I went on to voice some concerns with using it.

With adequate water changes there is nothing wrong with keeping bettas in small tanks/bowls, bigger is not always better.

 

[kizno1]

While it true that bettas originate in rice paddies, the fish found there are nothing like the fish sold as B. splendens these days. These are not natural fish but fish that have been selectively bred for generations for particular qualities, especially oversized fins and tails. These are not attributes that lend themselves to survival in the wild.

Since these fish have been developed to satisfy certain human ideas of beauty, does it not follow that their environment should be adapted to fit the needs of their new bodies? This has nothing to do with morals but rather is a matter of practicality. Long flowing fins and tail can be all too easily snagged and ruined by clutter added to in a big tank and make swimming against a current created by a filter excessively tiring to them.

surly if there new bodys are longer then they should have more space? evan with daily water changes that will stress out the fish i bet you they will never be able to get 0 amonnia and nitrate and it wont be heaterd unless you want to keep that room constiantly at 28c



This has nothing to do with morals but rather is a matter of practicality. Long flowing fins and tail can be all too easily snagged and ruined by clutter added to in a big tank and make swimming against a current created by a filter

thats why you use a sponge fillter mine is in a 5g tank with a spray bar that he swims againg and his fins have never had 1 rip in them and along as you get silk or live plants and smoth substance theres nothink for them to cut there fins on.

is still think 3g is the min to give it some room to actually move in and so that when you add a fillter and heater (which they need) there will still be enoght water volume and then you can add plant that will make it feel alot safer and happyer but you just cant do that in a 1g tank and if the tank isnt big enought to do that then its not sutable for a betta.