Ich issue

[mattbeau]

Im quite the amature aquarist so bear with me. I first recieved my setup as a gift a few months ago. after finally getting over the nitrogen cycle and getting rid of excessive nitrite, loosing various fish, things looked good, PH, Nitritr and nitrite levels had been consistantly low for about 3 weeks. The tank was running smootly with two corry cats two cherry barbs and 3 neon tetras in a 20 gallon tall tank with two penguin bio wheel power filters.

Things were on the up and up so i decided to restock the tank. I added an additional 3 cherry barbs 2 neons and two honey dwarf gauramis. The tank ran smoothly for about about a week, all of a sudden one cherry barb got the ich in a matter of 24 hours his body was completely covered the next morning he was dead, that same day i went to the LFS to pick up some RID-ICH and aquarium salt. I started medicating and observing. next morning lost another cherry barb, the other non-cherry barbs fish seem un affected. 2 other cherry barbs became covered and as of this morning they were dead.

Currently there is one cherry barb left with no noticable symptoms other than scraping against the gravel (which leads me to believe his time is comming soon). The 5 tetra neons are just begining to show some sign of ich but it isnt affecting thier productivity nor is it as prodominant as it affected the cherry barbs. Im continuing treatment untill it shows no more signs as ive read in so many places, the problem is the tank has become clowded as it did when it was cycling and I'm afraid that the good bacteria has been killed by the medications. Any suggestions would be most appreciated. Thanks

 

[Briarmoor]

Did you remove your charcoal filter before medicating? Also, the neons cannot withstand some of the Ich treatments full strength. I did it one time, at the advice of the LFS, and thought all of mine were going to die. Their color got dull, but they pulled through. Gave me a fright though.

I read an article in Tropical Fish Hobbyist on treating Ich if you'd like me to dig it up. The guy went about it different after finding his Ich was resistant. His rainbow fish survived that were treated.

I raised the temp on my tank a few degrees although the treatment said it wasn't necessary. You could do a partial water change too as long as you don't shock them with real different parameters or big temp changes.

Are your levels high again having added so many new fish at once? Can you move any or are you back down to pre-addition limit with the recent losses? Thinking the bene bac hasn't risen to take on the new ammonia load yet. If the tank is cycled, ammonia and nitrite should be Zero, not low.

Maybe some of the more experienced fish folks will have more options too.

Good luck. It is stressful having sick fish. Hang in there.

 

[mattbeau]

thanks for the reply, sorry its a bit long
I did after three days of medicating relized i needed to take out the charcle from the filter today, I'll be medicating again in the morning. I also did raise the temp to about 80 degrees. current water condition reads

0-20 nitrate
0 nitrite
7.2 PH

Interrestingly the levels have remained the same for a while even after restocking the tank. The only thing i did differently right before this all happened is I put a large towel ovr everything while I painted the living room. Do you think just the paint fumes could have an affect, or just having no light throughout the day?

I did just do a 25% water change, cleened the gravel up, and cleened the fake plants and decorations. Two days ago i removed all the live plants because they were looking sickly(frayed and brownish).

The neons color did fade for a day but they seem to be ok now aside from a few spots of ich, still feeding and shoaling normally. The gauramis and cory's show no sign of any infection, (though I know that we only see the end of the cycle)

Is there a safe alternative for neons that I should be using instead?

will the lone cherry barb be ok by him self, aside from losing all his pals in a matter of a few days.

 

[tttnjfttt]

Hmmm. I know earlier today I was reading that the best treatment for ich was malachite green and formeldahyide in this discussion, and I know that Wolf is really knowledgable. However, i'm not sure if neons can handle this. The other thing you can do is add a little salt. I have heard mixed things about neons being able to handle this, so if you decide to go this route, be sure to add it very slowly to aclimate them. You can also turn the temp up a little bit, to about 84, but do so slowly.

Do you have a test for ammonia? If not, I recomend you get one. Ammonia is the other chemical that always needs to be at zero, and is one of the first things you should check when something goes wrong.

Whatever you decide to do, just go with it slowly. Sorry I can't give you more species specific advice. Tetras have never really caught my eye. As for the cherry barb, don't worry about adding more immediately. Get your tank through this ich outbreak and make sure your ammonia and nitrite stay at zero. As for the cloudy tank you noticed, it could be what is called a bacterial bloom. It looks like someone poured milk in your tank or like the fluffy white clouds? It is harmless to fish, just really annoying for the owners, especially with a disease outbreak. This will clear up on its own in 1-2 weeks.

One other thing you can do is add an air stone to help get more oxygen to your fish. If they are hanging out around the surface looking lethargic, that might be part of the problem. I had this problem when treating with antibiotics and a bacterial bloom.

 

[digital_run]

PH, Nitritr and nitrite levels had been consistantly low for about 3 weeks.

If your nitrates fluctuate then your tank is not properly cycled. A properly cycled tank will have a constant of 0 Nitrates.

While Ich can be a fatal disease...I've never encountered it where it kills within 24hours. Ich is almost always brought on by poor water conditions and/or stress from other fish...With any mediacation your active carbon should be removed...It's uaually stated in the directions for the specific med. As mentioned what are your Amonia readings ¿ You need to find out why your fish are being stressed/exposed to poor coniditons and try to fix that along with bringing the Ich situation under control.

If your not medicating then frequent small water changes can never hurt...20-30% a day will only benefit your fish and any type Cyprinid will thrive in tanks that recieve frequent water changes. Also you can put those Nitrate readings away for good. Just curious but what kind of filtration do you have on the tank?

Hope i helped a little

ÐR

 

[tttnjfttt]

PH, Nitritr and nitrite levels had been consistantly low for about 3 weeks.

If your nitrates fluctuate then your tank is not properly cycled. A properly cycled tank will have a constant of 0 Nitrates.

I think you mean that nitrItes will be zero, not nitrAtes.

 

[mattbeau]

digital_run thanks for the reply,

I have had the tank going on 3 months now I had a serious nitrite problem when i was geting it cycled and had the problem stabalized about 3-4 weeks ago using amqual+ and novaqual. If for the last 3 weeks the nitrites are zero and the nitrates are only 0-20 ppm. could we say its cycled. or is it possible that the second good bacteria is just not present and my weekly water changes, amqual+ treatment and duel filters is just offsetting any rise?

 

[mattbeau]

One other thing you can do is add an air stone to help get more oxygen to your fish. If they are hanging out around the surface looking lethargic, that might be part of the problem. I had this problem when treating with antibiotics and a bacterial bloom.

I have an air stone, about 6-7 inches accross, and the gauramis and cory cats occasionally go up for air but i think they always do that.

 

[tttnjfttt]

Ok. I know when I had a bacterial bloom and was treating my tank with meds (although totally different meds), i did have problems with too low oxygen.

Just trying to make sure your fish are as happy as possible.

Did you ever get an ammonia reading from your tank?

 

[mattbeau]

Im going to check the fish out again first thing in the morning if the ICH starts progressing like it did before ill take some pictures to show the progress rate, but it was about 24 hours from a few spots to what resembles full blown small pocks

 

[mattbeau]

Did you ever get an ammonia reading from your tank?

all i have is the mardel 5 in 1 test strips wich dont have amonia readings so, ill pick one up in the morning.

thanks for the help thogugh i do appreciate it.

 

[tttnjfttt]

Its great to be monitoring how many spots you are seeing on your fish.

The reason we are so interested in your ammonia level is because fish usually don't become sick unless something is stressing them out, and ammonia is one of the most common culperates. Once the stressor is removed, it will help your fish become better alot faster.

EDIT: Never mind, I guess we were posting at the same time

 

[digital_run]

I think you mean that nitrItes will be zero, not nitrAtes.

Yea i should probably read what i post....

A master test kit will be a good investment and will probably pay itself off with the fish you'll save.

 

[tttnjfttt]

If you have a PetsMart near you, print out the page showing THIS TEST KIT, and show it at the counter. I walked out with a new master test kit today for $12.99 plus tax. I think I got a manager in a good mood, since i offered to pay the shipping cost as part of the price, but she gave it to me for $12.99.

Alot cheaper than replacing my ammonia and nitrate ones

EDIT: typed in the wrong smiley

 

[IMCL85]

oh if its ich just raise temperture and dump in aquarium salt and ich will be gone. I my self now dont even use salt my cardinal tetra and neon tetra have ich like few days ago I raise the temperture to 87 or so and all the ich just gone in like few days. I dont like to use medicine unless its a must. Ich parasite cant take that kind of temperture and it also speed up the cycle of the parasite. But just check the species of ur fish before raising temperature to 86+ some fish might not be able to take that kind of heat. Good luck