i think i'm gunna be sick

[Pointy_kitty]

well for those of you that don't know,
i just recently got a 55 gallon (about 2-3 weeks ago)
i did not have room to have it running to cycle before adding the contents of both of my 20gallon tanks
so i drained the tanks and added the 2 sponges and 2 carbons from the 20gallons to the 55gallon , then added "cycle" (bottled beneficial bacteria)
and put all of the fish into the new tank
i thought i would have enough beneficial bacteria
but apparently not
now the tank is recycling and the nitrates are getting high
i'm gunna do weekly water changes (about 10%), and weekly add cycle
this week i will drive 2 towns over and pick up about 6 big live plants to help the cycle
i just hope i don't loose any fish
my khuli loach (being very delicate and finicky fish) is already looking pale

i'm so worried and i don't know what to do
i HAD just yesterday 4 platy but one was very old and had a "crusty" look to it (it had pale spots and was thin)
this morning i found her all deformed and bent up strange
then i realized she was still alive, so i euthanized
i know she was old and already on deaths door
and the move was probably too much for her
but i can't help but worry about my other fish
my 20gallons always had bad nitrates becuase i had a VERY bad snail problem
and my fish lived like that for the last year and survived
they looked healthy, and no matter what i tried i couldn't lower the nitrates
i'm hoping because of this they will survive the 55 gallon cycle *fingers crossed*

 

[jhd]

If the natrates are high then tank is not cycling, it would be natrItes that are a sign of cycling, after ammonia spike.
Your natrates (if there are natrAtes) are a sign of disturbed gravel, that had all kind of fish poo in it.
You need to change 25 to 30% of water weekly, not 10%.
If you have life plants they should flourish with high nitrates. If you do not, can you consider adding them to your tank?
Gravel: the size of gravel that works the best for me is 2 to 3 mm in diameter (very fine) This will allow of all the uneaten food to stay on the top of it and not fall in between the stones, and this uneaten food causes high nitrates. Addition of 5 corydoras of any kind will help clean that food, as they are a perfect cleaning crew.
Snails: I had this problem too once, I bought 3 clown loaches. They took care of hundreds of small snails for me in a week, I had no snail in the tank since. They are also fun to watch.
Hope this helps a little.

 

[clutterydrawer]

"cycle" doesn't really do much...you want to look for some biospira.

 

[cometcattle]

"cycle" doesn't really do much...you want to look for some biospira.

I have never tried bio-spira, but Cycle didn't do anything for me, other than lighten my wallet.

When was the last time you did a water change?

And I agree with jhd that 10% is too small. 30% is more like it.

When you buy plants, try to buy potted ones. You'll get more bacteria.

What source of beneficial bacteria do you have crammed in your filter?

If you have none , I'd ask the guy at the LFS for a handful of gravel, put it in a stocking (not you good ones ), and cram it in your filter. This will help much more than cycle, IME.

 

[LadyMinion]

I'm going to 3rd the advice about water changes. You need to do a much larger percentage than you mentioned, probably several times a week if you're cycling. A weekly 10% water change is just about enough for an established tank.

Do you have a test kit that checks ammonia, nitrItes and nitrAtes? If not, I would heartily recommend investing in one as it really is important to keep an eye on those toxicity levels during cycling.

I would suggest you do a major water change right away to combat any current problems, then check the levels daily until fully cycled. If it looks like your fish may not make it, consider asking your lfs to look after them for you temporarily.

As for the nitrAtes, I would be more concerned about ammonia and nitrItes as jhd said. If your fish have been used to high nitrAtes then they shouldn't be ill now. But the best advice I can give is to get a test kit that covers the chemicals I've mentioned and keep up with regular hefty water changes until fully cycled.

 

[luxum]

It was not the snails causing the high nitrates in your old tank, they were just a symptom of the real problem which was overstocking, overfeeding, insufficient maintenance, or some combination of all of those, assuming it's not coming from your tap water. The snails produce very little bioload of their own, but find plenty of stuff to eat and reproduce in a tank where the bioload is too high.

But at any rate, i hope your fish make it through the cycle in their new home. Good luck.

 

[Pointy_kitty]

It was not the snails causing the high nitrates in your old tank, they were just a symptom of the real problem which was overstocking, overfeeding, insufficient maintenance, or some combination of all of those, assuming it's not coming from your tap water. The snails produce very little bioload of their own, but find plenty of stuff to eat and reproduce in a tank where the bioload is too high.

But at any rate, i hope your fish make it through the cycle in their new home. Good luck.

ok, i will up the water change amounts
i have a full test kit and that is how i am aware of the nitrates
there is no ammonia and the ph is good
there is also little to no nitrite
but the higher nitrate tells me to worry about nitrite

i didn't fully clean the gravel hoping that the previous owners bacteria would still be alive
but i just ended up with his waste
and his gravel was GROSS
i cleaned it about 85-90% leaving a bit of waste (wich ended up not doing me much good)

my tanks were not neglected
they were cleaned regularly
in the beginning of the snail problem i was overfeeding a bit, but the problem was corrected
the snails were still multiplying like crazy, but without suffiecient food, they would soon die in large numbers, polluting my tank

i will try this "biospira" you speak of if i can find it
and as i stated in the beginning, i am already planning to purchase more live plants this week
i will pick up some potted ones aswell

i don't have any lfs good enough to hold my fish while i cycle
they would take them for free and not return them but NEVER provide a temporary home
i don't even think they will give up a handful of their scummy gravel

i already have 4 cories and an upsidedown catfish, aswell as 1 khuli loach (i'm waiting for my order of 3 more to make a schoal) and a flying fox as bottom feeders

 

[Pointy_kitty]

i also wanted to mention i was looking at getting a pair of botia loaches when the cycle is through
i'm not sure what kind they are
they were labeled "assorted loaches"

 

[jhd]

I still think your tank is not cycling, just using bacteria from previous tanks.
Unless it is very early in your tank cycle and you will see ammonia spike, generally after 8 to 10 days. But if you used old gravel and filter then tank has bacteria and there is no cycle.

I have never tried kuhli loaches, I know clown loaches will take care of any snail problem. Snail is a BIG treat for them.
It would help us if you listed your tank load and water readings in your signature. It is very helpful in determining the problems and saves time.
I have 55g with 3 loaches, I bought them a year an a half ago to eliminate snail problem I had. Loaches were small, less than 2 inches and they took care of snail problem in a week. They will outgrow 55g tank in about 3 years. Mine are at 4 inch now.
More about clown loaches here:
http/www.loaches.com/species_pages/botia_macracanthus.html

 

[Pointy_kitty]

it says right in my signature to see my profile page to see my tank inhabitants
but it may not be up to daye so:

1 Marble Angel
1 Blue Gourami
1 Golden Gourami
1 Dwarf Gourami
1 Kribensis
1 Bolivian Ram Cichlid
1 Balloon Ram Cichlid
1 Flying Fox
1 Female Betta Splendid
3 Platy
3 White Clouds Minnows
4 Corydoras
1 Upside Down Catfish
1 ADF
1 Khuli Loach

and before it is said
i am waiting to be 100% sure that the water quality is PERFECT before adding more Kuhli loaches to form a schoal
for those of you that haven't owned them they are very delicate fish
especially around here (bred from weak chains)

my readings day 1:

Ammonia- 0
Nitrite- 0
Nitrate- 0
ph- 70

my readings day 3:
Ammonia- 0
Nitrite- 0
Nitrate- 40
ph- 70

now how the readings jumped from 0-40 in 3 days i have no idea

maybe i needed to let the water settle before testing so the first day reading of nitrate was false
i know i have been overfeeding in the new tank because i am not use to feeding all my fish at once
but that is only slightly

i will test the water today and keep you guys posted
i am predicting that the readings will be even higher then before
so now i am worried about nitrite
one good thing is, the guy i bought the tank from gave me SOOOOOOOOO much stuff with it including 2 big bottles of water conditioner
the bottle says:
Removes chlorine and chloramine
Detoxifies nitrate and nitrite
Removes ammonia
Premotes healthy slime coat
Helps prevent gill disease and premotes healing

my plan is to get 3 more khuli loaches (once the water is good)
and maybe 2 botia loaches

anyways, yeah i'll get back to you a little later with some tank readings

 

[Pointy_kitty]

WHAT THE HECK???
my test results make no sense!
i redid the ph one 3 times! (twice with a very good brand kit and another from a completley different kit!)

today's test results:

Nitrite- 0
Nitrate- 5
Ammonia- 0.3
PH- 6.0!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

WHAT THE HELL??
i've only ever heard of such a low ph due to lack of airation
but my tank has a penguin biowheel with 2 waterfalls AND a power head
could the drift wood or rocks be effecting it???
i vaugley remember hearing something about some decor that lowers ph
and the guy gave me loads of ph up
so i'm assuming it has to be the decorations (those rough, scratchy rocks that look sorta like they are from satwater tanks and loads of driftwood)

man thats scarey!
i'm glad i checked or my fishies would have been goners!

 

[Pointy_kitty]

EDITED

i redid all of the tests carefully since something looked fishy (no pun intended)
and all the test results were the same except the nitrate
i must have missed a drop the first time because the nitrate read between 30-40 still

so i shall pick up some plants and do a water change!
i will not give up on my dream tank

 

[clutterydrawer]

hmmm

if rocks affect your pH, they'll be raising it (i think)

driftwood can lower it but only if you have a lot of tannins leaching into the water...

 

[Pointy_kitty]

hmmm

if rocks affect your pH, they'll be raising it (i think)

driftwood can lower it but only if you have a lot of tannins leaching into the water...

what are tannins?

 

[appleblossom]

Pointy Kitty, where do you live???
maybe someone from on here lives close enough to donate some mature filter media to run alongside in your tank and keep your water quality up so your fish have a better chance??