I think i may be a fool

[Torrean]

I got a 29 gallon tank for my girl recently. It is a semi-aggressive tank so my theory was that the smaller fish would be eaten by the larger ones when they got to big for all of them to co-exist. But I am pretty sure I got conned by the guy at the fish store. I initially bought 3 rainbow sharks, 3 gourami, 1 cuhli loach, 1 pictus catfish, 1 common pleco. Then I went back because all of the fish were hiding. The tank looked empty. So I bought another Rainbow shark, five gold danios, and five zebra danios. Then I got two dwarf puffers. All of the fish are doing fine. Initially the new rainbow shark got pushed around a little but now things have settled down. Actually when I put in the new fish the whole tank came to life. Now even the cuhli loach comes out from time to time. All of my test's have come out ok except for PH. She put some stuff in there and now PH is perfect. The only problem is that the danios get 2 and a half inches long. I think this is too big for the rainbow sharks to eat when they reach full size. So, aside from the many errors that I am sure I made and I am sure you will point out to me, what should I do with the danio's. They are very friendly and my girl doesn't want to take them back. Be kind this is my first big tank. One more thing. I was wondering if an Albino Rainbow shark would school with mine If the one's I have start fighting again and i need to take back one of the males. Thank you.

P.S. If any of you buy frogs make sure there are no holes in the top of your lid. I made that mistake and my two african dwarf frogs climbed out and are gone. Either that or they are INCREDIBLY good at hiding.

 

[pica_nuttalli]

oh you poor, poor deluded soul... not only is your tank overcrowded, the vast majority of it is incompatible. i've also got a quarter what says you haven't cycled the tank yet and are 24 hrs from a major crash.

return everything but the danios and start over. this time, ask questions and do research before you buy.

 

[Torrean]

first of all it's been well over 24 hours and every test comes out perfect. Your right about some of the fish not being compatible, but i don't think your right to the extreme you think. None of the fish are conflicting except for the puffers and the gourami's. Everything else is getting along well. The puffer's nip at the gourami's but they run off pretty quick. All of the fish have lived so far so i think i will press my luck for another day. If things start going downhill i will take your advice. Thanks.

BTW i used distilled water so that may have something to do with my tank not crashing.

 

[NinjaSmurf]

Deluded is a bit harsh, wouldn't you say?...

I have to agree though that your best bet would be to return the fish. I don't know exactly about the rainbow sharks but I have an idea that they get too big for a 29 gallon, but like I said, not sure.

Dwarf puffers are notorius for being anti-social with anything but themselves (and sometimes I think even that can be questionable lol) and armored catfish, like plecos. Common plecos get way too big for that tank, they can get to a foot long and are major crap machines. The pictus would work once the tank is cycled, but they do better in a group of at least three, and if I remember correctly it will eat anything three inches or smaller. The coolie loach will be a noodle to the pictus (if you keep them) which is a shame since they really are cool little fish when you get a bunch of them. I would suggest if you want a tank where the inhabitants grow up to eat the other fish in the tank that you start out with livebearers once your tanks is cycled and wait till they breed, once you get a good bit get a few pictus or whatever fish you discover that would go well in that size tank (there are some really awesome oddballs that would be great for the tank idea you have, among other things) and then you'd have a good setup. It's much cheaper to use livebearers or danios (which you have) as feeders than the more expensive fish, as they can really put quite a 'bite' into your wallet.


edit, the problem with adding all the fish at once (especially without cycling) is that you get a huge spike of ammonia (fish piss, essentially) which can kill of all of your fish, which would really suck, and it stresses the fish out, which can kill them too or at least lower their immune system, which can end up with a case of ich. I didn't cycle my first tank, a thirty gallon, and I went through three guppies, a cory, and a case of ich with my pictus, which luckily cleared up, before my tank was even suitable for more fish. And I hated having had all that money (which I don't have much of), so I just don't want you to have to go through the same thing.

 

[Torrean]

thank you ninja smurf that is comforting. The Sharks are only supposed to get 4 1/2 inches though so they should not be a huge problem. The pictus is at the moment the least aggressive fish in the tank, he just swims up and down in one corner, just like all the pictus i saw when i was shopping. I may take back the dwarf puffers if they get to aggressive, they are picking on the smallest gourami quite a bit. If i see any injuries I will probably end up taking back the dwarf puffers. I think you are assuming that i have a deep tank. 12 wide30 long 16 deep dimensions, so i think pleco will be allright for a good while.

Edit: is that the size you thought the rainbows were going to get or am i wrong about that. I've seen it several places and they all said 4 to 5 inches

 

[The Mohave Kid]

"BTW i used distilled water so that may have something to do with my tank not crashing. "

How do you figure ??? I think you would be better off with hard water ... much greater buffering capacity and more minerals for the fish ... distilled water is a bit lean. Keep a close check on your pH and ammonia.

Do fish eat frogs ??

Good Day ... B)

 

[Torrean]

yeah the fish eating the frogs at some point was sorta the plan. But, they escaped first. You may be right about the distilled water. I assumed that since it had no ammonia or chlorine or any of the other stuff you have to treat out of tap water it would be better. should i add some tap water or is there a better way to increase the "buffer" capacity of my water

 

[NinjaSmurf]

Well, if they were ACFs, I would be more worried about them growing up to eat the rest of the fish, they get huge and eat anything they can stuff in their mouths...

 

[Torrean]

sorry ninja but i am a noob
what is an ACF

EDIT: hmm could it be an armored cat fish

 

[pnyklr3]

The puffers will more than likely kill everything else in the tank. They are very agressive (even the "calm" ones), and even though they are in a tank with fish for many months, they will one day decide that they want all of the other fish gone. SirMinion has a pic showing the result of having other fish with puffers. Some people will keep ottos with dwarf puffers, but they don't always live together peacefully for a long time. The puffers will nip everything, and anything quick-moving catches their eye.

EDIT: ACF= African Clawed Frog

 

[Torrean]

so the dwarf puffers which grow to a total 1" will kill an 8" catfish?

 

[NinjaSmurf]

They have sharp little beaks, so they'll nip and harass other fish, which can kill them.

Hey, what kind of gouramis do you have anyways?

 

[Discomafia]

You can't keep more than 1 shark in a tank. They're too aggresive towards each other. And don't buy fish so that they can be eaten by other bigger fish, that's just wrong...

 

[pica_nuttalli]

sorry, i suppose i did get carried away with the power of rhetoric. but the following is why i simply told you to get rid of everything but the danios and start over with research:

how did you cycle your tank? unless you performed a fishless cycle as described in the pinned topic, your tank is going to quickly become a giant pool of ammonia.

also, it is overcrowded even for an established tank. these are your final inches:

• rainbow sharks - 4.75 * 4
• gourami (assume dwarf, best case) - 2.5 * 3
• khulii loach - 2.75 * 1
• pictus catfish - 6 * 1
• common pleco - 12 *1
• gold danios - 2.5 *5
• zebra danios - 2.5 * 5
• dwarf puffers - 1*2
• total inches: 74 inches, over twice the recommended capacity!

presuming that all you fish ATM average 2 inches each, you still have 44 inches of fish in there. if your nitrogen cycle is not firmly established, you will have an ammonia overload and your tank will crash and you will have lots of fishy death on your hands.

if your nitrates read zero, i would be concerned. a minor level of nitrate is a good indicator of a properly cycled tank.

the use of pure distilled water is highly discouraged as it is completely devoid of any of the ions necessary for fish to thrive. i am also confused as to how you could have "perfect" general hardness and alkalinity readings if you are using distilled water, which should produce minimal levels of the two. even reverse osmosis water must be "cut" with some other type to make it suitable for demanding softwater fish. yours do not fall into that category.

pH altering chemicals are highly discouraged unless you have extremely picky fish. none of the ones you have listed fall into that category. you are more likely to stress and weaken your fish by having a fluctuating "perfect pH" that if you were to simply acclimate them to your local condition. if you feel you absolutely must alter your pH, use driftwood or calcareous substrate to leach a relatively steady amount of acid or base. i again am puzzled by the use of both a pH altering chemical and distilled water; you must not be attempting a pH of 7, which is absolute neutral and the pH of pure water.

also, the only fish you have which are capable of "eating" the others are the pictus and the puffers. even then, the pictus is likely to attempt eating a puffer, which would puff and quite probably choke the pictus. the other fish are also generally aggressive first to members of their own species and then secondly to additional fish. your plan of thinning the ranks is unlikely to work as you spell it out in the original post, although the highly crowded conditions will greatly aggravate any aggressive tendancies.

my common pleco is barely a year old and is already 6 inches long, not including his tail. i tried keeping him in a 12x18 tank, just until i could finally get the big one and somehow he managed to permanently damage the top of his tail. i've also now reached the point where my pleco does not necessarily "fit" what i want to do with the tank. i'm having no small amount of trouble finding him a good home. you may not be able to unload yours either when that time comes.

since you came here and asked "have I been a fool" then you are obviously capable of conducting research and intelligent fish-keeping. to save time i wanted to say that yes, you have messed up and that the best and easiest way to fix it would be to start over. i'm glad you love the danios; they'd be the best fish for you to keep.

 

[Torrean]

that's a good question. the tank that i bought them from said gourami. It also said that they would grow to 4 1/2 to 5". But any more than that i don't know
I have two blue ones that are about 3 1/2 now and one red one which i think is called a gold gourami. It's about a half inch shorter than the other two. I haven't been able to find pictures of the blue ones so i don't know they're name.

BTW when i say i have i mean she has. When you put so much time and effort into something it's hard to remember that it is a gift. I am helping to care for them and doing a lot of the research so i guess they are a little mine.