Fishless Cycle

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Pebblo

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Hi all,

Been reading through these forums for a while now, gettin ready for when I got my tank so I knew what would be needed.

Bought My tank just over a week ago, set it up, added de-chlorinated water (Its a 60L), temp set at 80, left it running for 2 days to let it settle. Then added Ammonia (Jayes Cleen off multi-purpose house hold ammonia) to what seems like about 5/6ppm (bit har too tell imo, but supose you get used to it)

Filter is an interpet PF2

I'm using an API Freshwater Master Kit to test with.

Now, my first test was about 6ppm, but even now after 6days of leaving it running it's still showing the same reading, Ph is 8. I'm trying to use the 'add & wait' method. Am I missing something?

I'll attatch a picture of my last ammonia test, taken last night, see what you all think.



Cheers all
Peb
 
what are the ingredients in the ammonia?

also, i think that if you add too much, it can actually make it really difficult for the bacteria to grow. have you used the calculator at the top of this page to figure out how much to add?

you added some and are now waiting for it to reduce right?
well list the ingredients on the bottle, or if it has any smell.
you could probably do a small waterchange to cut back the ammonia a bit, and the ph, i think the process works better at lower phs, but i might have that backwards.
 
what are the ingredients in the ammonia?

also, i think that if you add too much, it can actually make it really difficult for the bacteria to grow. have you used the calculator at the top of this page to figure out how much to add?

you added some and are now waiting for it to reduce right?
well list the ingredients on the bottle, or if it has any smell.
you could probably do a small waterchange to cut back the ammonia a bit, and the ph, i think the process works better at lower phs, but i might have that backwards.

The bottle doesnt list any ingredients but have read alot of forums which say using what I'm using is fine. Yeah Ive used the calc but actually used a bucket to work it ou myself.

Ive added ammonia and am now waiting for the level to dorp down to 1ppm yes.

Other way round, the bacs grow better at 8.0+ PH rather than lower ph, well actually its just different bacteria, but wont go into that.

The ammonia won't go down that fast. It can take up to 3 weeks before you notice a difference.

Ive been reading a lot of fishless cycle diaries and they all pretty much show a difference by day 4/5 I'm on day 6... well actually 7 and still no difference.

If it does actually take that long I'll wait, but would rather not if possible :(
 
Increase the temp of your tank to 84 F/29 C, this is an optimal temperature for the bacteria to grow.

A pH of 8.4 is the best for bacteria growth; so a pH of 8.0 is good.

Also, at around 8 ppm of Ammonia; this is when we start to colonize a different type of bacteria in our filters, ones that we don't want.

So keep your ammonia under 8; aim for 5 ppm.

It can take up to 2 weeks for the ammonia to go down, so I would wait a little longer.

When you shake the bottle of Ammonia, do the bubbles produced stay around for more than 10 seconds, or do they disappear within a couple of seconds?

-FHM
 
The ammoina is in a white bottle so can't see inside it but I fillied a test tube with some and shook that, get no bubbles watsoever.

I've just increased the temperature to 84 as advised, and also added another dose of de-chlorinator as I realised last night we complain the water smells of chlorine alot round here, so doubled up on the dose and will do from now on.

From my tests I would say the ammonia level is at least 4 if not slightly darker but no-were near 8 thankfully.

Will give it another couple of days and test again.

Cheers for the replies.
Peb
 
Just to reiterate the patience message. Yes some may have seen it go down in only a few days - but most don't. It can take ages - but as long as your ph is above 6.5 - nearer 8 the better, and you keep the temp up and don't let the ammonia go over app 5ppm - then the cycle will start. It can and does seem to take ages to start and then to complete - you just have to be patient. It will come through in the end. Good luck.
 
I know I'm being impatient, i'm just bored of watching an empty fish tank! lol

Anyway, I'll go back to tending to my bubbles for a while.

Peb
 
Thanks for that correction, i didn't feel like looking it up at the moment

anyways, WELCOME TO THE FORUM!
glad to hear you're getting started the right way and everything.
i know it sucks waiting for the fishless cycle to complete...but once it does, its well worth it. you can finally have fish, and they won't all die or get diseases and stuff.

i still think a small waterchange might help..but no one else suggested it so maybe not..i'm just basing that on reasoning, like maybe there's soo much ammonia it's actually difficult for the bacteria to get started..maybe if you cut it back a little bit it might be easier for it to develop initially..just a guess though

if you have high chlorine it would be good if you were able to set your waterchange bucket out over night or for 24 hrs. add dechlorinator, and then let it set for a day. i think if you let it set for a day, most the chlorine evaporates anyways..but adding the dechlorinator and letting it set might help ensure there's no chlorine going in the tank. chlorine can kill that bacteria, and could completely hinder it from colonizing
 
Welcome to TFF Pebblo!

Totally normal for the very first dosing of ammonia to the tank to take up to two weeks to work its way down to zero ppm, or even 3 weeks perhaps as drobbyb says! After that it will get slowly faster at acoomplishing the drop from 5ppm to zero ppm.

Agree wtih the optimal temperature being 84F/29C. The optimal pH range is 8.0 to 8.4, 8.0 being just as good as 8.4 for fastest growth. pH is not a thing we will alter to accomplish this unless we find that it is dropping too rapidly towards 6.2, where the process stalls. The bacteria also use a small bit of calcium, which they normally get from the tap water not being totally soft and a tiny trace of iron, which they normally get also from traces in the tap water.

Its ideal to avoid water changes during a fishless cycle as it disturbs the bacterial growth, slowing the process by a day or so, but, confusingly, a water change can also be the best "kickstart" of a stalled cycle later in the process if tank parameters have progressed too far away from ideal. The overall nitrification process of fishless cycling produces acids which will often cause this stalling eventually.

While its true that setting out tap water to "air" is effective at allowing chlorine to "gas off," the use of chlorine by the local authorities to lower bacterial counts during water distribution is being replaced more and more by an approach where chloramines (a chlorine-ammonia combined substance) are used about 11 months of the year and then chlorine is substituted still for about 1 month of the year. The chloramines most definately will not "gas off" and so a "conditioner" product that handles both chloramines and chlorine is called for. Its actually a good risk reducer during fishless cycling to dose this conditioner at 1.5x or 2x the recommended dosing instructions, because your bacterial colonies are particularly fragile and the water people will sometimes overdose chlorine/chloramine and of course they won't tell you that. You don't want to go above 2x dosing because there's cause to believe that would slow the growth of one of our bacterial types. This overdosing thing is less needed after the bacterial colonies get big and robust by the end of your fishless cycling.

Good luck with your fishless cycle. We all enjoy hearing from people as they go along the path. Be sure to read lots of other threads, you can pick up a lot.

~~waterdrop~~
 
Hello again guys.

Well I just thought I'd add an update.... the update is.....

Still no change! lol

I think I'll have a gander round some of the LFS's round here and see if I can persude any of them to donante some filter media or some 'gunk'. The guy from my area in the donation thread hasn't been active since last year.
 
Patience is key to fishless cycling. I know it seems like it takes forever, specially when you want to get fish in the tank, but just wait and it'll start going :)
If you can get some mature media though, then by all means do that *nodnod*
 
Hello again guys.

Well I just thought I'd add an update.... the update is.....

Still no change! lol

I think I'll have a gander round some of the LFS's round here and see if I can persude any of them to donante some filter media or some 'gunk'. The guy from my area in the donation thread hasn't been active since last year.

Hi,

I am replacing the white filter media in my Juwel filter on Saturday or Sunday, you can have that for your filter if you want as it will have lots of nice bacteria on it.

I am only in Rainhill so I am not far from you
 
Hi,

I am replacing the white filter media in my Juwel filter on Saturday or Sunday, you can have that for your filter if you want as it will have lots of nice bacteria on it.

I am only in Rainhill so I am not far from you

That would be great mate, will contact you via pm.

Peb
 

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