Fish Wars

[fighter.dori]

Hi Guys,

I've had a 55 gallon aquarium with the following fish:

2 Parrot
2 Tiger Oscars
2 Kois
2 Cateye Sharks
2 Discus
2 Suckers

But over the past month 4 have died. Initially the parrot died while I was changing the water, so didn't get to observe how it died.

The second to go was the Tiger Oscar. As I remember the Koi fish harassed this Tiger Oscar and bit into its fins and tail. It died shortly afterward. The same happened to both my Koi fish. The first one died over night, and the second just yesterday. I've seen the Suckers attacking my Silver Koi and biting into its fin.

Of the 12 fish, just 8 are left, and they continue to attack each other. Especially the Oscar, it chases the Discus fish. I've checked my water levels and they seem to be normal. I use two POWER filters on either sides of the tank. I've also installed a temperature regulator in the tank. The water is treated for chlorine before being fed in to the tank.

I clean the filters once in 10-15 days and replace about 50% of the water in the tank. I still find that a lot of dirt sits at the bottom of the tank. I've considered getting a UGF, but the width of my tank cannot accommodate a UGF.

PLEASE help me understand and resolve this issue, any comments directed toward improving the cleanliness and sanitary conditions of my tank are most welcome.

Fighter Dori.

 

[wetwetwet]

Wow what a combination!

How long has this tank been set up and how big are these fish?

Dont know what your cateye sharks and the sucker - any more details/pics,

First thoughts are they are not fish that would normally be put together - maybe you had some bad advice?

Short of knowing what your cateye is and the size of these fish I would look at the oscar maybe...

www

 

[Crossfire]

Holy frijoles that is one massivley overstocked tank there....I think that's were your problems are coming from

 

[fighter.dori]

Wow what a combination!

How long has this tank been set up and how big are these fish?

Dont know what your cateye sharks and the sucker - any more details/pics,

First thoughts are they are not fish that would normally be put together - maybe you had some bad advice?

Short of knowing what your cateye is and the size of these fish I would look at the oscar maybe...

www

I set up the tank about 1.5 months ago.

Wiki pages of the two fish:

http/en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shark_catfish

http/en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypostomus

They are all medium sized fish. Between 10 cm to 15 cm in length. It could've easily been bad advise, but I'm in a tricky situation now anyway. From what I've read over the net, it isn't impossible to breed these fish in the same tank. Although, as I now realise, it could be a tad bit tedious.

Only one Oscar remains, and even he gets aggressive some times. The smallest fish in the tank is the parrot.

I feed them all once a day, again this could've been bad advise. Any comments?

 

[Aquascaper]

Sorry but this will sound harsh.....

Your tank is way overstocked with too many different types of fish, all that require different conditions, and I am not surprised that the aggression levels are through the roof with fish killing each other. If you don't drastically change your stock very soon you will be left with very few fish.

There are so many incompatibilities in there I don't know where to begin.

I would suggest you think hard about a particular 'type' of tank you want to achieve and members can then help with changing your stock to suit.

Sorry again but.....Wow!

 

[Crossfire]

Ok, all the fish in your tank are either way to big or with the wrong tankmates.

Oscars need a minimum of 75 gallons for one Oscar
Koi fish need a minimum of 1000 gallons
The Shark Catfish need brackish water and get 40 inches long!
Parrot Fish are too aggressive for the Discus or the other fish
Discus need perfectly clean water stats, and are finicky. As well as they need groups of +6.


My advice? Return or rehome all the fish besides the Discus. A 55 gallon can easily sustain a nice school of discus as long as you keep good water stats

 

[mossonthemoon]

On top of everything mentioned above, have you cycled the tank? If not, I wouldn't keep the discus. I don't know a lot about them, but I do know they are very sensitive and I don't think they would survive a fish-in cycle.

 

[fighter.dori]

Ok, all the fish in your tank are either way to big or with the wrong tankmates.

Oscars need a minimum of 75 gallons for one Oscar
Koi fish need a minimum of 1000 gallons
The Shark Catfish need brackish water and get 40 inches long!
Parrot Fish are too aggressive for the Discus or the other fish
Discus need perfectly clean water stats, and are finicky. As well as they need groups of +6.


My advice? Return or rehome all the fish besides the Discus. A 55 gallon can easily sustain a nice school of discus as long as you keep good water stats

Ok, so its clear to me NOW that the tank is overstocked. There are 8 fish left. I love my discus so I try my best to keep clear water stats. Again, do I need to change the filters for better ones?

Also rehoming is not something I've explored in the geographic area I live in. Might not be a possibility. Anyway even if it is a possibility, which all fish do I rehome?

Also your advise is absolutely different to what the vendor told me. The #16##### cheated me.

On top of everything mentioned above, have you cycled the tank? If not, I wouldn't keep the discus. I don't know a lot about them, but I do know they are very sensitive and I don't think they would survive a fish-in cycle.

Yeah I've cleaned the tank. But like I said, there are deposits of dirt at the bottom still. Anybody know if that'r normal and its just okay to just cycle 50% of the water periodically?

 

[Aquascaper]

The vendor took your money....we didn't

Ok, if you can list everything mentioned below we can all try and sort this out....

Tank dimensions (LxHxD)
Filter makes
Water parameters (ammonia/nitrite/nitrate/pH)

As for rehoming, it's a case of sorting it out or losing more fish I'm afraid. The priority is to get the Koi out first, they are a pond fish and have no place in an aquarium. If the LFS guy told you they would be fine in an aquarium I would take them back and demand a refund (if you're sure they are Koi and not just goldfish).

Changing water and cleaning the actual tank is not cycling. Please take a look at the pinned threads for full information on what to do.

If your tank is not cycled (which I doubt) then Discus are going to be extremely difficult to keep alive until it is.

 

[Lizi_angelfish]

Hey fighter dory!

When we say 'cycle' we mean building up bacteria colonies in the filter. There is 'fish in' cycling and 'fishless' cycling. Both are explained really well in the beginners resource centre in your new freshwater tank discussion. That is where I have gotten loads of good advice in the past few months so I would advise setting aside an hour or so and trying to read the information in there. Fish shops are notorious for their lack of knowledge on good fish to keep together (on the whole). This forum is full of experienced fish keepers who are much more qualified in my opinion to give out sound advice!

You cannot cycle a tank with water so I presume (sorry if this is incorrect) that you haven't cycled your tank and this could be creating further problems for your fish, on top of the incompatibility. As a someone who is new to the hobby myself, I am unsure of fish compatility but having gone through a cycle, I have some experience with this.

Hope you manage to sort everything

 

[Crossfire]

When you say you clean the filter, do you replace the cartridges or wash them in tank water?

And once you rehome the fish, I'm sure we can help you get a good stocking compatible with discus

 

[fighter.dori]

The vendor took your money....we didn't

Ok, if you can list everything mentioned below we can all try and sort this out....

Tank dimensions (LxHxD)
Filter makes
Water parameters (ammonia/nitrite/nitrate/pH)

As for rehoming, it's a case of sorting it out or losing more fish I'm afraid. The priority is to get the Koi out first, they are a pond fish and have no place in an aquarium. If the LFS guy told you they would be fine in an aquarium I would take them back and demand a refund (if you're sure they are Koi and not just goldfish).

Changing water and cleaning the actual tank is not cycling. Please take a look at the pinned threads for full information on what to do.

If your tank is not cycled (which I doubt) then Discus are going to be extremely difficult to keep alive until it is.

Hey fighter dory!

When we say 'cycle' we mean building up bacteria colonies in the filter. There is 'fish in' cycling and 'fishless' cycling. Both are explained really well in the beginners resource centre in your new freshwater tank discussion. That is where I have gotten loads of good advice in the past few months so I would advise setting aside an hour or so and trying to read the information in there. Fish shops are notorious for their lack of knowledge on good fish to keep together (on the whole). This forum is full of experienced fish keepers who are much more qualified in my opinion to give out sound advice!

You cannot cycle a tank with water so I presume (sorry if this is incorrect) that you haven't cycled your tank and this could be creating further problems for your fish, on top of the incompatibility. As a someone who is new to the hobby myself, I am unsure of fish compatility but having gone through a cycle, I have some experience with this.

Hope you manage to sort everything

When you say you clean the filter, do you replace the cartridges or wash them in tank water?

And once you rehome the fish, I'm sure we can help you get a good stocking compatible with discus

Just read all the relevant literature about CYCLING. Shucks. Should've ideally done it earlier. Anyway, I'll have to go ahead with fish-in cycling now.

To answers your questions:

I used to clean the sponge entirely before. Massive facepalm moment. Anyway lets say I cleaned my tank just yesterday so I will begin with the fish-in cycling process from today. Wish me luck.

My tank dimensions are 210 cm x 40 cm x 25 cm.

I'm not sure of my filter makes, but they'r not some swish ones. I live in Dubai and don't really know where to get some good branded filters here. Mine are made in China by an obscure manufacturer. I'm considering if I should switch from an internal filter that requires cleaning (now i know that implies just a rinse in tank water) to a permanent external filter (ANY SUGGESTIONS?)

Water Parameters as per today's tests:

Water hardness - 8 deg kH
pH level - 7.5
Ammonia NH4/NH3 - 0.5 mg/l & 0.009 mg/l
Nitrite test - 0.5 mg/l
Nitrate test - the silver powder did not dissolve


As for rehoming - both the Kois are dead, sadly . I'm left with 1 tiger oscar, 1 parrot, 2 sharks, 2 plecos and 2 discus. And my discus were being attacked, so i've rehomed the two in a 15 gallon fish bowl, just a couple of hours back. IS THIS OKAY? PLEASE ADVISE.

In my conclusion, I don't think I have too many options - rehoming a fish in Dubai might not be very much possible, unless there is someone in this forum living here and is willing to help me out. So I'm going ahead with the Fish-in cycling process. I've temporarily rehomed the discus as said. This is subject to advise from more experienced hobbyists. Tough luck that I'll have to push on with what i've got. Hoping that my fish survive, keeping fingers crossed.

I'm attaching a picture of my fish tank below

http/i.imgur.com/5x6iU.jpg

http/i.imgur.com/XhZkj.jpg

Here's a picture of the fish bowl in which I've housed the Discus temporarily. The discus are not really as big as they appear, that's just because of the bowl curvature.

http/i.imgur.com/JU15r.jpg

 

[mossonthemoon]

The discus will not do well at all in that bowl. Is there any way you could get a temporary divider for the tank, until you find a more suitable arrangement?

Can you return some of the fish to the shop they came from, with your new knowledge to back you up?

 

[Aquascaper]

As mossonthemoon said, sort out a divider and put the discus back in the main tank. Something like a rigid plastic mesh or grid would be ideal, anything the fish can't swim through but still allows the water to flow freely.

Sad as it is to lose fish it may be a blessing in disguise that the Koi are no longer in there, they would have had a huge impact on the bioload of the tank.

Keep doing big, daily water changes of around 50% if you can manage them to keep the water as good as possible and look for an external filter. Before you run it on the tank let us know what you've got and we'll advise you the best way to set it up (would do it now but might be information overload with everything going on).

 

[mossonthemoon]

By the way, it is a really nice looking tank. Try not to be too discouraged. I really do think that if you can follow some advice here you will have something beautiful to look at for a long time.