Fire Extinguisher Co2

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hellohefalump

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Right... so after spending over £30 on two disposable bottles of CO2, which will last me approx just under 2 months on my tank, I'm starting to think about using fire extinguishers. Aqua essentials do a disposable bottle that is cheaper, but I bought some and I've found they're lasting only half as long as a JBL one from my lfs. So I think they're a false economy and I've gone back to using the JBLs.

I'm scared though. I'm a self confessed wuss. When I change my disposable bottles I am very careful and I don't rest them on my knee because i'm scared I'll blow my knee caps off. I have a toddler and although she doesn't have access to my fish tank (stairgates!), accidents happen. What if I leave the stairgate open one day and she comes through to the tank?

How does the fire extinguisher thing work? I've seen articles about it so I am fairly confident in how it's done, but do you get them refilled or are they disposable? How long would one last and how expensive would it be?

I've heard they're really dangerous because the CO2 is liquid not gas. Is that true? Are there extra safety precautions you should take if you're using them?

My tank is 100gals and I'm running two CO2 systems - one on each end. So I'd be wanting to use two fire extinguishers at once.
 
The possible dangers with a FE & a Toddler:

knocking the FE over - get a strap and screw it to the wall or tank cupboard.
turning the knob on the reg and/ or needle valve (could gas your fish) - only way i have thought of is to get a small cardboard box and place that over the top so it covers the reg and rest of equipment.

FE's are refillable, find a local dealer, some do it for as little as £5, or take it to the scrap yard and get some money for it.

IMO they are only a bit more dangerous than the regular disposables, it is all about handling them:

keep the saftey pin in at all times, the only time you take it out is once you are going to run the CO2
keep it upright

Also when fastening the handle down, some allow you to re-insert the saftey pin in although this may not be the best option incase your toddler pulls it out so get some cable ties aswell for an extra measure.

FE.jpg
 
Put a lock on the cabinet..... i know it makes it a bit of hassle when you want to get in there but safe.

As said. strap it to stop it knocking over. TBH most FE's are more resilient on being knocked over compared to other cylinders as there built to be in the open where people could knock them ETC.

Explosion is the least likely occurance. if it does leak due to the valve going its more likely to become a missle. this is whats the danger. by keeping it upright there is less likely its going to happen.

Explosion will only happen from a cracked cylinder and this would only happen from a flaw in the cylinder.
Missile happenings would happen with all compressed air..
 
thanks guys - I'm definately thinking about giving it a go.

One more question - how long will 2 fire extinguishers last me in a 100gal tank at 30ppm?

if it does leak due to the valve going its more likely to become a missle. this is whats the danger. by keeping it upright there is less likely its going to happen.

that sounds really scary - is it likely the valve will leak? What valve is this? Is it in the extinguisher or my regulator?
 
thanks guys - I'm definately thinking about giving it a go.

One more question - how long will 2 fire extinguishers last me in a 100gal tank at 30ppm?

if it does leak due to the valve going its more likely to become a missle. this is whats the danger. by keeping it upright there is less likely its going to happen.

that sounds really scary - is it likely the valve will leak? What valve is this? Is it in the extinguisher or my regulator?

It the bit the handle is bolted too. remember you carry it by this so needs to be hit quite hard. as to leaks as long as the reg is on tight then a leak will not be an issue it will just slowly release.
 
Why not phone up your local gas supplier (look in yellow pages) and rent a CO2 bottle off them. I have a short 10 litre bottle for £10 deposit and about £1 a month rental. It costs £10 to refill each time too. Fire extinguishers are designed to vent the gas very quickly from the liquid part of the bottle whereas a normal cylinder outlet take from the top of the bottle where the gas is. Liquid CO2 can damage regulators so best to use the correct bottles especially as they are so cheap. They also collect and drop off from your house so no worries with refills.
 
Liquid CO2 can damage regulators so best to use the correct bottles especially as they are so cheap. They also collect and drop off from your house so no worries with refills.

There are vast numbers of people using the fire extinguisher setup with no liquid going into their tanks!!!

All compressed CO2 bottles are in liquid form and use the gas off the top. therefore the regulators are made to do this. Using fire extinguishers with welding/aquarium regulators usees the gas from the top as they are not pullling the same output as a fire extinguisher handle/horn.

Fire extinguisher outputs are made to push out at incredibly high rates and the bottle empties in less than 10 minutes. Using a regulator and the output we use means the bottle lasts over a month 10 minutes versus a month shows how litle pressure we are using for output.

As for the OP question if you are using disposables at the moment then you are using a regulator for disposable bottles. You ill have to find an adaptor to use a refillable source as they are different.

I wouldn't worry about blowing your knee caps off. I don't even move my bottle/reg combo when I swap over. I hold the reg, unscrew it and once loose I spin it to unscrew the rest. The same with the new bottle. I spin it in position until it starts to tighten and then turn the final turn or 2 with a little more force (not too much or you can break the thread off and then you have 1 useless bottle with a thread stuck in the regulator.

Also when you buy disposables check the weight on them. The standard weight is 390g. There are sources for 500g (JBL) and 600g (Halfords.)

However on a 100USG tank I would go the fire extinguisher or BOC/Air products route.

AC
 
CO2 = CO2. Aquarium CO2 bottles are the same as welding CO2 bottles with a different label.

Make sure you don't buy Argon or Argon/CO2 mix. pure CO2 is the one you want.

My regulator and bottles are both from welding suppliers!!! Things are much cheaper without the word Aquarium printed on them ;)

AC
 
Interesting - I'll be going down to halfords to investigate! What is the actual name of it - is it 'welding gas'? Will it be obvious when I see it?

As for the OP question if you are using disposables at the moment then you are using a regulator for disposable bottles. You ill have to find an adaptor to use a refillable source as they are different.

I already thought of that! Aqua essentials sell an adaptor, so I'll be getting those if I go down this route.

BOC/Air products
What's that?
 
I also go scuba diving, you can buy boots that go on the bottoms of the tanks which make them more sturdy, heres a link to where i dive at and the actual boot my scuba tank has got, hope this helps. They also check the tanks for cracks and crosion (cant spell), for extra peice of mind
cylinder boots
 
I would guess somewhere like Halfords will buy different brands all the time. Larger organisations (you may notice in places like Tescos too) may source things from different places all the time whilst still getting in the big names. No one rally cares which brand the cheapo items are just that they are 15p and the name brand is 60p.

Last time I bought one form Halfords is was the same as I get from welding supplies. Brand name was Clarke. White bottle with bright orange label. And was a tenner for a 600g bottle so thats nearly half the price of Dennerle and you get 100g more

BOC/Air Products are companies that deliver gas products to pubs/businesses/households etc. As a previous poster said. You get an account. Pay a deposit on the bottle and then a silly £1 a month or something similar rental. when you get it refilled you pay a tenner. When you don't want to have it any more you take it back and they give you your deposit on the bottle back.

AC
 

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