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Corydoras flashing, possible bully issue

Discussion in 'Tropical Fish Emergencies' started by Jwgoff7772, May 15, 2019.

  1. Jwgoff7772

    Jwgoff7772 New Member

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    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCQVuFROpmRD2YKH8IoDQpQA

    You'll see my adult false juli flashin twice in 46 seconds.

    40gallon breeder
    Parameters
    Temp: 76f
    Am: 0
    Nitrite: 0
    Nitrate: 10-20
    Ph: 7.0
    Kh:2
    Gh:2
    30-40% weekly wc with prime

    Before I can upload a video I posted this concern last week but I am not sure if it is still active so I'm creating another thread.

    9 corydora: 2 adult, seven 1.5 inch
    1 pearl gourami but had been removed
    Did have 10 cories but lost a young panda to what I believe was fin rot 2-3 weeks after I got him. Noticed 2-3 weeks ago my adult panda flashing here and there, maybe noticed it once a week. Then most of cories started flashing except for 2 and 2 out of my 3 young pandas are losing some color, the black bands are faded. They are very skittish and seemed to stress and I'll explain how. 4 days after my original post I noticed my 3 inch male pearl gourami picking on my cories, even after being fed first in a betta feeding square if he thought a cories had something he would bump them to get to it and then started doing it just because, I knew they can get bossy so I only fed him at the top of the tank and in the same spot each time and on the opposite side of aquarium to which I feed the cories in their open area. Tried time out in a breeder box because I didn't want to get rid of him but I tried it two occasions. the first time for 2 days and then a second time for 3 days and it didnt work. As soon as I would let him out he would go right back to bullying the cories and I don't have the means to support another 30 to 40 gallon tank on top of my current 40-gallon breeder and so back to the pet store he went. I've had two of those cories a long time and I was not going to give them up no matter how much I like the gourami. But my concern now that the stress brought by the gourami opened my cories up to disease or maybe the flashing and color fading a symptom of the stress itself? But they seem very stressed but are still eating and active, maybe a tad less active and if any Cory bumps into another Cory they both take off into opposite directions and then hide for a second, which is a Behavior I've never witnessed in the three years I've been keeping cories because when I used to see it before and they weren't expecting to be bumped by another cory they would just do a flick and land a couple inches away and go right back to doing what they were doing and would never go and hide so I wonder if they are just thinking it's the gourami bumping them still..? Any advice is much appreciated. Thank you
     
  2. Byron

    Byron Member

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    I see that now and then. It is most likely ich. Ich first attacks fish in the gills where we do not see it (the common spots) and the flashing is the fish attempting to dislodge it. I never worry about this, as left alone fish are able to fight it off and it rarely escalates, and may even disappear for the most part.

    Obviously there are other reasons for flashing, but from this video I believe it is ich. Ich can be present in many of our aquaria but never become an issue until the fish are stressed. This is why newly acquired fish are so prone to ich; they are under severe stress from the transport, store conditions, chased/netted, then released into another strange environment. Stress is the direct cause of ich outbreaks, always. I frequently see a bit of flashing with newly acquired fish while in their quarantine tank (in my case I use a planted 20g tank to quarantine all new fish for a few weeks). It has so far never escalated and the flashing disappears within a few days. Treatment beyond clean water and quiet stress-free conditions is generally not needed nor is it advisable, esp with cories that are highly sensitive to any and all substances added to the tank water. So treatment is often only making it worse, and that is not worth the risk.

    Sometimes this can linger for a time, but I wait it out and monitor thee situation before resorting to specific treatment. In that case, heat is usually the best. If even more is needed, as it may sometimes be, salt is safest over most any so-called ich remedy. I've used this with cories, wild caught characins, and loaches in the past.
     
  3. Colin_T

    Colin_T Member

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    You could raise the water temperature to 30C (86F) and keep it there for 2 weeks. If it's whitespot, the high temperature will kill it off without needing any medications.

    If the water temperature is in the low 20s Celcius, then raise it slowly over a few days until you get to 30C.

    Do a big (80-90%) water change and gravel clean before raising the temperature. This will dilute the gunk and number of pathogens in the water and allow the water to hold more oxygen.

    Increase aeration/ surface turbulence to maximise the oxygen levels.

    If the filter is established (been running for a couple of months), then clean it if it hasn't been done in the last 2 weeks.

    The Cories won't particularly like the heat but as long as it goes up slowly they should be fine. After 2 weeks of high temperature you can lower it back down and if the problem is whitespot, it should be gone and the fish should stop rubbing on things.
     
  4. Jwgoff7772

    Jwgoff7772 New Member

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    How slowly should I increase the temp and how much salt should I use since cories are more sensitive? it's only the cories in the tank, the gourami is no with me, he was just causing too much stress in my tank. I like the gouramis but my two oldest cories ivr had for almost 3 yrs and I could tell their demeanor changes after about 2 weeks of the gourami being in there so I'm wondering if the stress was brought on by the gourami and that caused the ich...
     
  5. Jwgoff7772

    Jwgoff7772 New Member

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    And does the loss of color and rapid breathing on my two young pandas point to ich as well?
     
  6. Jwgoff7772

    Jwgoff7772 New Member

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    and I guess my other question would be is still be ich without any white spots or without any other changes to the fish's appearance because I don't see any over activity in the Slime coat nor do I see any white spots at all. Nor do I see any difference in the gills or Gill plates or really anything physical. The symptoms are: all of them are swimming kind of erratically and are very skittish compared to normal. But not all of them are acting skittish or swimming erratically I would say maybe 60% of my fish are acting this way. And two out of the nine cories are losing their black colors being there pandas. But all of them are eating normally and in fact are still very active in the tank in or not really showing any signs of being lethargic. So the only real symptoms are at the flashing (which all my cories are flashing now), rapid (on only one young panda) Erratic swimming at times and being very skittish (about 5 put my 9 cories are very sketchy and are swimming erratically). And what I mean by swimming erratically is they are swimming very fast straight into the wall and also they are swimming to the top of the tank and then falling to the bottom very fast and they will also jerk to another Direction very quickly and at the slightest movement I make they take off in the opposite direction and Hide. Those are the symptoms and I'm seeing and I'm not seeing any physical symptoms at all other than the color fading on two of my four pandas and the rapid breathing on one. I'm on my way to get an adjustable heater at this time and I'm plan on raising the temperature a degree every 12 hours and then using 1 teaspoon of salt every 5 gallons. I see that the normal remedy is one tablespoon every 5 gallons but since I have fish that are sensitive to Salt I figured I would use a third of that dose. If any of my plans don't seem vizable please let me know. I do have medicine on hand. I have prazipro, seachem paraguard, API General cure, erythromycin, and fungus cure from API. I have not used any of these medications yet for fear of my fish acting badly to it in treating something they don't have. But I've had some of these medications on hand when I first started fish keeping in a couple I've bought since I noticed the symptoms but I've been too afraid to use since my fish have not shown any physical symptoms other than color fading and Rapid breathing. I really appreciate your info Bryon and Colin. Both of you have been quick to answer my concerns both now and in the past few weeks. Thanks again you guys
     
  7. Colin_T

    Colin_T Member

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    2-3C per day.

    If it's whitespot, you don't need to add salt if you raise the temperature to 30C.
    If you want to add salt, you can add 1-2 heaped tablespoons of rock salt (aquarium salt), sea salt, or swimming pool salt per 20 litres (5 gallons) of water.

    --------------------------
    PraziPro contains Praziquantel, which is used to treat tapeworm and gill flukes and might treat some protozoan infections.

    SeaChem Paraguard contains Malachite Green and will kill external protozoan infections like whitespot, trichodina, costia, chilodonella and velvet. Malachite Green is also carcinogenic so handle with care and wash up with soapy water after using it or working in the tank.

    API General Cure contains Praziquantel (see above) and Metronidazole. Metronidazole is an anti-biotic designed for people and should not be used in aquariums unless the fish have a known internal infection that has not responded to other fish medications.

    Erythromycin is an anti-biotic designed for people and should not be used in aquariums unless the fish have a known bacterial infection that has not responded to normal fish medications.

    API Fungus Cure contains Victoria Green (aka Malachite Green) and Acriflavine. Acriflavine kills bacteria and fungus.

    ----------
    You have a bunch of chemicals here that you don't need.

    If you don't want to raise the temperature you could use a medication with Malachite Green. But if the fish don't have a protozoan infection, then you will be exposing them to a hazardous chemical for no reason. I would simply try raising the temperature for 2 weeks and see how they go.
     
  8. Byron

    Byron Member

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    Raising the temperature alone (meaning, not adding any substance) is all you should consider at this stage. As Colin noted, all of these chemicals will negatively impact the fish whether they work or not. Avoid additives as much as possible. Reducing stress is key.
     
  9. Jwgoff7772

    Jwgoff7772 New Member

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    Understood. Most the meds I've already had in the last year or two. the only ones that I just acquired were the the paraguard and prazipro. But I'll take your guys advice and give the heat method a try for 2 weeks and we'll see what Happens. Thanks again for the advice guys
     
  10. Colin_T

    Colin_T Member

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    check the expiry date on the medications.

    keep test kits and medications in a cool dark dry place to maximise their shelf life. Heat destroys them quickly and so does moisture.

    I kept my test kits in a plastic icecream bucket in the fridge.

    *NB* Make sure children and animals cannot get to them.
     

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