Cories And Salt

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Akasha72 said:
thank you for that link Byron. I've read the bit about salt 'dips' mostly as that's what I'm planning to do with the tetra. I'd never add salt to my tank. I only use it as a dip for sores/cuts/external parasites. I've used it a few times as getting a good external parasite treatment in the U.K is hard work. 
 
I'm shying away from dipping the cory though unless several people say 'yes, it's fine to dip her'. I'd be so upset to lose her and I'd rather find another way to cure her
 
I would suggest that there is less risk using salt as a dip than adding salt to the water and forcing the fish to live in that water for a period of time, and I believe this is what Dr. Monks and other reliable sources advocate.  This makes sense from my understanding of how salt affects the physiology.  I did an article on this for another forum so can't link it, but I will cut/paste a couple of relevant excerpts (this is not the entire article).  Keep in mind that this is talking about the detrimental effects on soft water fish when salt is added to their water permanently.
 
[SIZE=9pt]As the scientific data presented in this summary article indicates, adding salt to a freshwater aquarium on a regular basis will, at best, do nothing of any value at all.  But at worst, it will stress salt-intolerant fish, making them more vulnerable to disease and less likely to live a healthy and normal lifespan.  To understand why, we need to understand what salt does in water, and how fish are affected.[/SIZE]
 
[SIZE=9pt]Salt makes the water denser than the same water without salt.  The aquarium contains water.  The bodies of fish and plant leaves also contain water, just as we do—humans are approximately 70% water.  The water in the aquarium and the water in the fish/plant are separated by a semi-permeable layer which is the cell.  Water can and continually does pass through this cell; fish do not “drink” because they don’t have to in order to take in water.  When either body of water is denser, the other less-dense body of water will pass through the membrane to equalize the water on both sides.  The fish must control this process through what is termed osmoregulation.[/SIZE]
 
[SIZE=9pt]Freshwater Fish Physiology[/SIZE]
 
[SIZE=9pt]Salt definitely interferes with the osmotic regulation of fish and plants.  It should be left alone; nature regulated that part itself, by creating freshwater, brackish and saltwater fish.  The vast majority of freshwater fish live in waters having no measurable salinity, and this has been crucial in the evolution of their physiology.  Fresh water fish differ physiologically from salt water fish in several respects: their gills must be able to diffuse dissolved gasses while keeping the salts in the body fluids inside; their scales reduce water diffusion through the skin; and they also have well developed kidneys to reclaim salts from body fluids before excretion.[/SIZE]
 
[SIZE=9pt]Freshwater fish have physiological mechanisms that permit them to concentrate salts within their bodies in a salt-deficient environment; marine fish, on the other hand, excrete excess salts in a hypertonic environment.  Fish that live in both environments retain both mechanisms.  Freshwater fish concentrate salts to compensate for their low salinity environment.  They produce very dilute but copious urine—up to a third of their body weight each day—to rid themselves of excess water, while conducting active uptake of ions at the gills. [2][/SIZE]
 
[SIZE=9pt]The kidneys of freshwater fish have two functions: osmoregulation [discussed below] and hematopoiesis, which is the formation of blood celular components.  Each fish species is adapted to the range of salts in its habitat water, and the kidneys function well within that range.  The kidneys have to work harder whenever the salt content of the water in which the fish is living is greater than that of the fish’s preference, i.e., the natural habitat.  The closer the water is to the species’ requirements, the easier it will be for the fish to maintain proper osmotic levels.  One of the myths about the “benefit” of regular addition of salt is that it allegedly maintains an osmoregulatory balance; in point of fact, regular use of salt has the exact opposite effect and can cause bloating due to an osmotic imbalance. [3][/SIZE]
 
[SIZE=9pt]Osmoregulation[/SIZE][SIZE=9pt] is the technical term for the physiological mechanism fish use to control the amount of salt and water in their bodily fluids.  As the name suggests, it's based on osmosis.  Water is constantly passing through the cells of freshwater fish by osmosis in an attempt to equate the water inside the fish with the water in the aquarium.  Freshwater fish regularly excrete this water through respiration and urination; the average fish will urinate 30% of its body mass every day.  The more salt in the aquarium water, the greater the strain on the fish's kidneys, which in turn adds to the fish's stress in attempting to maintain their internal stability.[/SIZE]
 
thanks for that Byron. I've just managed to get three half decent photo's of her - not easy when she doesn't want to stay still!!
 
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It doesn't really show up the furry fungus and it is looking better today than it was yesterday so maybe it's healing. I'm going to do another water change this afternoon though
 
just to let you all know I've just got brave and dipped her in salt water.
 
I got a plastic bottle out of my recycling box, cleaned it well with hot water and bicarb and then added some hot and cold water straight from my tap - I didn't bother with dechlorinator I thought some of the copper in my water might work in my favour. I added a good pinch of table salt, mixed it well and then got my poorly tetra in there first. I covered it up to reduce stress and set my timer for 10 minutes and then got on with a 50% water change (the cory was still in the tank at this point) Once my water change was complete then 10 mins was nearly up so I netted the tetra back to the tank and filled my jug half way with some of the fresh water. I then tipped the salt water into the jug (my thinking was I was reducing the salt concentration for the cory) I then netted the cory and dipped her for no more than 2 minutes before adding her back to the tank.
 
The salt water went down the sink.
 
Both fish are a little stressed - which I'd expect - but both are still alive! Phew ... got away with it 
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Akasha- another really good read for you is to be found here http://www.skepticalaquarist.com/salt This is an excellent site for fish info. The article deals at times specifically with corys and salt.
 
I do not think you will ever get agreement on this. So you will have to decided based upon the source of the information. I have always believed that almost any fish can tolerate salt as a medication because it is such a short term exposure. I have never added salt to any of my tanks because I mostly keep fish from saltless waters.
 
I have also been taught to do a salt bath differently than you describe. The fish goes into a strong salt solution and you watch it. When it begins to act "drunk," its time to take it out and return it to fresh water. Others suggest a gradual build up of salt and then a similar stepped transfer back to full fresh. However, I have no issues with using medications for fish and so I tend to use these more than I use salt. Being in the states I have a medicine kit that would make some fish stores feel understocked.
 
I am not a fan of Epsom as a med because it will alter TDS a lot more and faster than salt. It is basically magnesium. I would for sure never combine Epsom and salt together as this will really shoot up the TDS. Things are different if one is dealing with rift lake fish. They normally have salt in their water and are actually descended from salt water fish.
 
thank you TTA, I'll have a read :)
 
sadly the website won't load. I'll keep trying
 
perhaps a site crash. I'll try again tomorrow. Glad it's not just me, I thought it might be my internet
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EDIT:
 
It's working again now so I've had a read - mostly concerning salt dips as, like you TTA, I have no intention of ever adding salt to my aquarium.
 
The way I 'dip' my fish is something I've had to work out for myself as I couldn't find much info regarding how to do it. I used my common sense and large dose of over caution. I would rather use less salt and dip for an extra few days than use too much and damage or hurt a living creature. I still have no real idea how much salt to add to say ... half a litre of water ... but I've been using a couple of small pinches and hoping it's enough to help and too little to harm.
 
It would be good if I could find a dosage which is why I've been reading the links I've been given here in the hope of finding that out. I've not come across a dosage guide yet so for now I'll carry on as I am.
 
The cory did get a 2 minute dip this afternoon (not sure if you spotted that) and she seems fine. Seen as she's fine she'll get another dip tomorrow ... same with the tetra and once they are both back to full health then they can both go back to the main tank and their friends
 
You do have an alternative here. There is something you can use that would help with fungus and mild bacterial problems. It also kills ich and similar parasites. It can also be used to reverse the effects of nitrite poisoning if needed, The problem is it will stain things in a tank. I am talking about Methylene Blue.
 
Go here and scroll down in the section on M B. About the only part I do not agree with is its use with ammonia issues. If you have these, the problem is not with blood oxygen levels, it is with other much more damaging things. http://www.americanaquariumproducts.com/AquariumMedication3.html
 
I would guess this is easy to find in the UK.
 
of course! I forgot about meth blue! I used to use it when I was hatching cory eggs to help with fungus. It never occurred to me! Funny what you forget!
 
This tank is already stained as this was the tank I used for cory eggs and fry. 
 
Have you any idea if it goes off? I probably still have a bottle in the cupboard but it'll be at least 2-3 years old
 
thanks. I'll see if it's still in the cupboard today and check the bottle :D
 
well I've just checked on the cory and the tetra - I had a busy day yesterday and only really had time to feed and dash off back to my chores - the tetra is looking a little better, there only looks to be maybe a couple of these weird fluke things left on it's body. The cory on the other hand ... she's no different.
 
I have some time today and I've found the meth blue and checked it for expiry - which there doesn't appear to be one so I'm guessing it's still good to use - so today they can both go in the salt dip while I 50% water change their temporary tank and then it's in with some meth blue. I'm getting frustrated now. I just want to get them both well so they can go back to their tank mates
 
Hello, sorry to revive the thread, but did you ever manage to cure your cory?



My panda cory developed these sores on both sides of his body and I have no idea what to do to help her. I was also thinking about epsom salt or maybe mycopur?



A little of backstory:

He lives with my betta and 5 more panda corys and pygymy corys. 3 days ago I dosed tank with esha 2000 and esha exit, because betta was lethargic and his belly was kind of bloated, so I suspected either dropsy or parasites. Betta has recovered to his old self, but today I found one panda cory dead with no visible injuries. Then later I notices this panda with sores, any idea what could have caused this?



Parameters are all fine btw. I checked for ammonia too.
 

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Hello, sorry to revive the thread, but did you ever manage to cure your cory?



My panda cory developed these sores on both sides of his body and I have no idea what to do to help her. I was also thinking about epsom salt or maybe mycopur?



A little of backstory:

He lives with my betta and 5 more panda corys and pygymy corys. 3 days ago I dosed tank with esha 2000 and esha exit, because betta was lethargic and his belly was kind of bloated, so I suspected either dropsy or parasites. Betta has recovered to his old self, but today I found one panda cory dead with no visible injuries. Then later I notices this panda with sores, any idea what could have caused this?



Parameters are all fine btw. I checked for ammonia too.

I am going to suggest that you start a new thread, include the photos, plus all data you can (water parameters being GH and pH and temperature), water conditions (ammonia, nitrite, nitrate), how long the tank has been running, how long have you had the fish. Members with greater experience in disease issues will want this data in order to help. There will be more interest with a new thread of its own. The member in this old thread is, I think, no longer here.
 
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