Conflicting Advice Re New Tank - Please Help

[NewBea]

I'm completely new to fishtanks and I'm trying to do a good job however I'm finding conflicting advice on a lot of things so I'm still no wiser.
I started of with doing research online and buying a tropical fishtank book before even setting up the tank. I bought a 100 litre tank which I set it up with gravel, plants, decor etc and started running it fishless. When I asked in the store if I need to buy any tests they said don't bother, they can check the water for me for free in the store before we get the fish. The store also said that I can run the tank for about a week before buying any fish - which luckily we didn't do as we were waiting for my son's birthday to buy the fish - which was about 2 months down the line. During the 2 months I did a few partial water changes, removed and replaced dead plants etc. When we went back to the shop 2 months later they found the water fine and we bought some fish. Again when we asked how much they reckon we can buy in one go they said between 5 and 10 - we ended up getting 8. (as I knew we had to stagger it out and buy fish in batches) Well once I read more forums - some people only recommended 3 fish to start with. So now I'm all paranoid that they will get ammonia poisoning! I check the fish a number of times a day to see how they are doing - I'm really careful when feeding them - only twice a day and a good pinch of flakes that they can eat in 2-3 minutes. By the way when I asked the shop what food they recommend they simply given me a tub of flakes but I read that a variety of different food is better.
To make things more complicated after a day we had some fry - well more and more as the days have gone by. I'm on day 11 of my new fishtank and I have about 14 molly fries. Oh I forgot to mention that fish that we bought 2 sailfin mollies, 4 mollies and 2 swordtails. Now I don't know what to do again as I would like to buy a number of different fish with different colours/patterns that complement each other and can live nicely alongside each other (which I've done heaps of research on as well) If I'm only allowed 20-24 fish in my tank then do I need to "get rid off" the fry or I can get the new fish as the fry is too small to count at this stage? How long do I need to keep the fry before I can pass/sell them onto someone?
Some of the fish started to swim right under the surface of the water as if they were gasping for air so I've done a partial water change but I'm still concerned - some sites seem to suggest that it's a normal molly behaviour and some says it is signs of ammonia poisoning. Which one is true?
After worrying so much about the water quality I decided to go against the fish shop's advice and ordered a test kit online (the ones in the shop were a bit too pricey) but should I worry in the meantime? How long does the nitrogen cycle take after having added 8 fish in one go? How long should I wait before I get the next batch of fishes? And how many to get next time? Also do I need to worry about what some sites/books recommend about the number of fish from 1 spieces - ie buy 4-5 neons as they like to swim in a shoal? Can I "mix and match" within the same family ie different colour tetras to make up 4-5?
Apologies for the length of this post but I have so many questions in my head and I want to make sure I look after them poor creates properly. I never thought fish keeping would be so complicated and addictive
I welcome all advice from experienced fish keepers!

 

[msasa19]

this is completely unrelated, but where did you get your test kit? i have also looked in the pet shop and they are stupid prices!! thanks!


PS. hope you get your tank sorted, wish i could help but i am also a newbie!!

 

[Aquascaper]

Until you can test your water for ammonia & nitrites there's no way of knowing what's going on in there but I would put money on it not being good.

Until you can test the water I would suggest at least 50% daily water changes.

 

[phoenixgsd]

you need to cycle your filter please read the link in my signature on cycling, then ask any questions you didnt understand, as it stands now, you are fish in cycling, (also in my link) you have alot of hard work ahead, are you uk? a essential bit of equipment is a liquid based test kit the API master kit is a general reccomended one

 

[NewBea]

Msasa19 - I've got the test kit from Amazon - it was only a pound or two cheaper elsewhere but I trust Amazon more than unknown places - I've got API Master Test Kit for Freshwater 120g

Aquascaper - I will definitely test the water when the test arrives. In terms of the percentage of water change - I read elsewhere that the maximum amount water that should be changed in one go is 25% as too much water replacement can compromise the healthy bacteria in the water. Is this something that you have done yourself and know it works?

 

[NewBea]

Phonixgsd - thanks for the advice. There are loads of good stuff through your link. I only quickly read the fishless cycling to start with - you see I didn't know that I actually have to add ammonia to the water. I just read that you have to run the tank on its own for a few weeks and thought that a couple of months is ample of time for it. The API kit is own it's way now.
Oh I don't doubt that I have a lot of work ahead of me
Yes from the UK, why?
Have you guys used Swallows before? I seriously started doubting the advice I've been getting there.

 

[phoenixgsd]

i asked if you were uk so we can point you in the direction of shops that sell water test kits ect the USA, is of course different, as your fish in cycling you will need to do huge water changes every day especially if your fish are breeding and the amount of fish in the tank is increasing, the bacteria you refer to is growing inside your filter not the water


adding ammonia is for fishless cycling only, your fish poop will cause enough ammonia on its own, unfortunatly as its toxic its your job to keep on top of it untill your filter has enough bacteria to remove it for you

ive not used swallows before, do you have a maidenhead aquatics near you, very knowledgable staff in their shops

 

[The Taffy Apple]

Do you know of anyone with a healthy, mature tank and filter? You could ask for a 'donation' of filter media... not water, or filter sponge 'squeezings'.. you need a donation of filter meida, be it sponges, ceramic balls/noodles or even some filter floss...this will contain millions of the bacteria we need in our filters to safely get rid of the Ammonia and NitrItes. There is a section commited to donating media within this forum somewhere, it maybe worth having a look.

Terry.

 

[NewBea]

We actually bought our tank second hand from someone who grew out of it (ebay, so it's not a person I can contact again for filter media). It came with filter system, lights and some gravel but it was all cleaned before we got it. The filter system only contains some chip and ball looking things (excuse the lack of knowledge on the specific names) I will definitely look for that donating site and ask around if anyone has any working tanks amongst my friends.
I actually cleaned the pipes and rinsed out the filter system today along with the partial water change – do you reckon I just made things worse? It looked so gungy – I thought that might slow the filtration down.

I have one of these gravel vacuum devices but when I tried to use it (before fish) the water was only moving through the pipe if I kept moving the “head” up and down at the bottom of the tank. As soon as I stopped the water flow stopped as well even though I made sure the valve was open as per the instructions. It made such a mess and cloudy water I thought surely this can’t be doing any good. Stupid question: what am I doing wrong?

The closest maidenhead aquatics shop is around 20 miles from us

 

[The Taffy Apple]

There have been instances where fellow fish-enthusiasts are only to happy to send some media in the post...if you was anywhere close to South Wales or the West Country, i would be only too happy to help.
With regards to your gravel cleaner, the best way to start it going is by sucking the end until water starts moving, then use gravity to remove the water.

Terry.

 

[NewBea]

Thanks, Terry - I will give it a try with the sucking method.
I'm down in Essex - close to Southend so not exactly next door I posted a note on my facebook see if anyone has a tank - if not I might ask one of the local fish shops (not swallows)

Phoenixgsd - I just keep reading and reading the posts under the link you posted here!! I've learnt a lot of new things already and put that link in my favourites! I think I will try the 25% daily water change while I'm waiting for the tests to show up.

 

[phoenixgsd]

try having a look on you tube for a guide of how to use gravel vaccs, lots of people have videoed themselves using one and they talk you through it, to see it being used often gives you a 'ahhh so thats how its done' moment

Phoenixgsd - I just keep reading and reading the posts under the link you posted here!! I've learnt a lot of new things already

every day is a school day, even for me

 

[NewBea]

ahhh, I went to bed with such a guilt - didn't actually sleep much and all I was thinking/dreaming about was sorting out our fishtank - I was dreading the morning. Luckily all fish are still alive!!! Quickly started the day with another 25% water change. The fish weren't actually at the top this morning like they were last night - do they sleep? Do they feel comfier at the bottom of the tank during the night, or is this a bad sign as well?

Great idea on the youtube thing!!!!!! By the way I tried to use it again this morning sucking and everything but just made mess in the tank again - and probably stressed out my fish as well

 

[Mrsdubs]

I actually cleaned the pipes and rinsed out the filter system today along with the partial water change – do you reckon I just made things worse? It looked so gungy – I thought that might slow the filtration down

Depending on how you cleaned the filter you may well have just made things worse

You should never clean the filter using tap water as this will kill the good bacteria

When cleaning the filter you should use tank water, this is done while carrying out water changes, siphon the tank water into a bucket then use this water to clean your filter

Tbh I would leave the filter alone for a couple of months while the good Bactria build up, then only clean it once a month or less

I have two filters I clean one each month, again only using old tank water

 

[dannybgoode]

To answer one of your earlier questions - a 50% water change, assuming you match the temperature of the water from the tap to that of the tank (or there abouts) and use dechlorinator (you do have some don't you) will not stress the fish and in your case is absolutely essential.

Without getting the ammonia out of the tank each day your fish are in real danger.

Keep asking questions, keep reading and you will get there!

Good luck

Cheers

Danny B