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Godwin's Law, my friend, Godwin's law. Once someone has introduced a reference to Hitler or the Nazis then the conversation is pretty much dead. It's well known netiquette for discussion groups. :)

Your reason for not getting a bigger tank seem to be that the fish don't need that big a tank right now and it would be a waste to keep such a tank heated and powered. Never mind the fact they would be in an even better environment for them. That to me is a weak argument. You are at the planning stage, you know you will have to get a bigger tank, why not get it now? You then have the ability to spread the cost of setting up such a huge tank by buying the LR over time as well as gradually building up the flow and getting a better skimmer as the fish grows. Simple conscientious and best policy fishkeeping that. But hey, I'm a stupid moron with social skills who needs to read book son constructive criticism and people skills, so I would know nothing about setting up larger tanks for larger fish, would I?

I'm sorry, did I not sugar coat my advice enough for you. How awful that someone on the internet with the written word appeared to be so horrible to you. Get over it son. Most of the best advice on this forum comes from the straight talking members who have been there, done it and seen many people make very similar mistakes (the classic one being: "I will get the fish a bigger tank when it needs it"). You never did answer exactly how you will. know when the fish needs an upgrade other than "When it looks like it needs a bigger tank". That does not bode well IMO and IME for the fish getting the upgrade at the most appropriate time. Who knows, maybe you will be the exception, but the odds are against it and I certainly won't hold my breath.

My post could have been drafted in a more flowery way, but that isn't me. You may not like me, but you have to admit from reading the replies of others that many begrudgingly accept that I do know what I am talking about for most of the time. I have given nothing but honest advice on this thread, unfortunately you don't like my advice so have chosen to keep being nasty about me personally to deflect the fact you have never kept these fish so are not going to truly be able to know when they need a bigger tank, or when the current one is going to cause problems as early as someone who has.

However, since you do not know why you are dealing with me, I shall darken your thread no more.
 
Andywg,

Please do not consider what I said as an insult, they were more of an observation of your behaviour and netiquette. If you act like 'Fish Gestapo' (or should I refer to the former Russian Secret Police... Cheka?) then I will comment on that unfriendly and bossy nature. Godwin's Law or no Godwin's Law.
Also, there is no need to 'sugar coat' your advice - just lose the sarcasm - Just think.. would you talk to a stranger like that in a pub?

I have plumbed in and set up a SW Rio 240 and arranged sand / rocks etc. MY OPINION (which is also shared by some other members) is that there is no need to get another 6' or 7' tank unless the fish are of a size that warrants one. When the fish get larger then a new tank will be bought. Simple really - why do you have a problem with that?

Considering that I haven't even thought of what fish to keep in there, I'm unsure to why you have made this such an issue? - Did you ever think 'Maybe I'll be HELPFUL and suggest some alternatives'? - No, I thought not... it's just not you is it! ;)

So, in short, I wouldn't have had a problem with you had you had spoken to me with a little respect. Maybe in time we'll grow to like eachother an skip through flowery meadows ;)

If nothing else Andy, we've made edge-of-seat reading for our fellow members.


One final point...

When you consider where these fish live (the Ocean) I should imagine they're going to be pretty hacked-off being in any tank. Therefore, does and extra 12" or 24" make any odds when you consider their natural environment? I mean, if I was taken hostage it wouldn't matter a toss to me whether they kept me in garden shed or a garage... I'd still be unhappy at not having my freedom!
The above statement is more of a discussion point rather than something I believe in by the way (before I get shouted down)

Sam :)
 
I think in any terms things can be mis read unless there is body language to go with it

or its just an outright flame!

I think really what people are saying and myself if you read back, This is the impression you implied in your posts.

You shouldnt buy fish that are gonna quickly out grow a tank on the fact at some point you gonna buy a new tank.

And also people understand you arent gonna do things that are gonna put live stock at risk, but also this is a forum and its all about opinions and every one has one.

:)
 
I think in any terms things can be mis read unless there is body language to go with it

or its just an outright flame!

I think really what people are saying and myself if you read back, This is the impression you implied in your posts.

You shouldnt buy fish that are gonna quickly out grow a tank on the fact at some point you gonna buy a new tank.

And also people understand you arent gonna do things that are gonna put live stock at risk, but also this is a forum and its all about opinions and every one has one.

:)

Hi,

Without dragging this out even further then you'll see that my 'problem' was with the initial sarcastic post I received from Andywg.

You wrote,
You shouldnt buy fish that are gonna quickly out grow a tank on the fact at some point you gonna buy a new tank.

WHY? That is your opinion. However, it is one I do not share. I believe tanks should be in proportion - For example, a 2" fish in a 6' or 7' tank looks stupid (just like a 2' Plec looks stupid in a 4' tank!). - I really can't see what the problem is? It's a system I have always used for keeping my Piranha and they're extrememly healthy and active.

Also....

At no point did I state I was going to keep an 8" Clown Trigger in a 240L tank - However, Andywg seemed to think I did and gave me a sarcastic reply that offered zero help.

I began this post by including a list of fish that I was interested in. I did NOT say 'I'm want all of these...' - Other members seemed to understand this and offered useful information / suggestions of alternative fish. Sadly Andywg did not and chose to give some unfriendly smart-arse response.

You might have a lot of kids on here / dreamers but I can assure you I am not one of them! I'm a 25yr old bloke with two good household incomes, an extension used as a fish / reptile house and a genuine interest in animals... why do people find it so hard to believe it when I say I will upgrade?? Do you think I would want friends / relatives / guests to see oversized fish crammed in a set-up which is to small???

I'm the one paying for the water, salt, electricity, lighting etc. so if I don't want to heat / maintain a 6/7' tank with a 2" fish in it as I consider it madness then what on earth is the problem?? It's just a waste!!

Lyden...

Nope, still weighing things up at the moment - I might give the Trigger a miss though (even though they're one of my all-time loves) as they're a bit too coral unfriendly for my requirements. Looking at some kind of Tang and a Fuzzy Dwarf Lion at the moment. Maybe a pair of Clowns too if you reckon they'll surviive in there with the Fuzzy Lion? Not sure about the other tanks yet though.. no real rush yet.

Sam :)
 
Most triggers do not eat coral, including clowns, though their "big brothers" the titans do.

I have seen many people keep the slightly larger Dendrochirus zebra with clownfish, so keep the lion well fed and it should'nt be a problem.
 
Most triggers do not eat coral, including clowns, though their "big brothers" the titans do.

I have seen many people keep the slightly larger Dendrochirus zebra with clownfish, so keep the lion well fed and it should'nt be a problem.

I was under the impression Triggers such as the Picasso and Clown were invert-munchers? Ah well.. they're probably going to be a little too rough / aggressive around the Corals / Community. Although I absolutely love both the Pic. and the Clown I guess I maybe be better with a Tang or two (Yellow and Regal maybe?... would they tolerate eachother?)

Thank you for the advice about the Fuzzy Dwarf - Do you think they might eat Starfish (Blue / Bristle / Minstrel / Red etc) though?

Cheers, Sam :)
 
They may eat some motile inverts such as shrimp and small snails, but corals will almost always be left untouched.

Regal Tang - gets pretty big. A better choice would be any of the Ctenochaetus or the smallest Acanthurus. In the former case add the Ctenochaetus first and give it at least a few weeks before adding the yellow. You understand they may need to be rehomed eventually.

The lionfish most definitely will not eat the starfish. They simply are not physically capable.
 
They may eat some motile inverts such as shrimp and small snails, but corals will almost always be left untouched.

Regal Tang - gets pretty big. A better choice would be any of the Ctenochaetus or the smallest Acanthurus. In the former case add the Ctenochaetus first and give it at least a few weeks before adding the yellow. You understand they may need to be rehomed eventually.

The lionfish most definitely will not eat the starfish. They simply are not physically capable.

Ah great! Good news all round then! - I'm happy enough replacing snails / shrimp when needed but I wouldn't be too happy replacing corals.

I'm taking notes and will come up with a *rough* stocking list for the 240L+ (I say + as it will grow as the fish will :) )

So far I only have the Fuzzy Dwarf Lionfish down on the list but have decided against keeping Triggers for the timebeing.

Sam :)
 
as far as the 24g, what about a firefish? they are very good looking fish in my mind, and I think, correct me if I'm wrong people, you could fit that and a percula clown in the tank? or a royal gramma, those are colorful as well
 

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