Cleaning Filter Media Whilst Cycling?

[xamy_valox]

Hi, I have had my 23 litre tank cycling for about a month now (with fish in) and have been doing regular water changes etc. I didnt know if I am meant to be cleaning my filter media whilst the cycle is still happening? I know you are only meant to do it every month (or so I have been told) but was unsure as I don't want to get rid of the bacteria that the filter needs to complete its cycle?
Also, how often should I be testing my water? I've only got strips at the moment which have all been coming up fine, but they don't test for ammonia so I have been taking samples to my LFS for that to be tested, which at the moment is still a little high (last time it was tested it was at 1).
Thanks, Amy,.

 

[nessar]

You should do water changes any time it gets above 0. That means even 0.25. 1 may not seem a high number but it is.

I'd get an ammonia test kit straight away.

If you want to wash the filter sponges you need to do it in tank water, as chlorine will kill your bacteria. I wouldnt do it unless there is visible gunk on the sponges.

 

[xamy_valox]

You should do water changes any time it gets above 0. That means even 0.25. 1 may not seem a high number but it is.

I'd get an ammonia test kit straight away.

If you want to wash the filter sponges you need to do it in tank water, as chlorine will kill your bacteria. I wouldnt do it unless there is visible gunk on the sponges.

Hi Nessa, thanks for your reply.
Yeah I am considering getting the API Freshwater Master Test Kit so that I can test my ammonia more often and more accurately as I don't like being unsure of my levels.
I don't think I will clean my filter media for a while yet then as I can't see any visible gunk as of yet and don't want to upset my cycle.
I am currently doing water changes of about 25% every 5 days, is this sufficient?
I know my ammonia is high, but touch wood my fish don't seem to be being affected by it. I am just working to try and get it down by usin API's 'Ammo Lock' and 'Stress Zyme' to try and get my ecosystem up and running quicker.
Amy.
Amy.

 

[shurton]

You should do water changes any time it gets above 0. That means even 0.25. 1 may not seem a high number but it is.

I'd get an ammonia test kit straight away.

If you want to wash the filter sponges you need to do it in tank water, as chlorine will kill your bacteria. I wouldnt do it unless there is visible gunk on the sponges.

Hi Nessa, thanks for your reply.
Yeah I am considering getting the API Freshwater Master Test Kit so that I can test my ammonia more often and more accurately as I don't like being unsure of my levels.
I don't think I will clean my filter media for a while yet then as I can't see any visible gunk as of yet and don't want to upset my cycle.
I am currently doing water changes of about 25% every 5 days, is this sufficient?
I know my ammonia is high, but touch wood my fish don't seem to be being affected by it. I am just working to try and get it down by usin API's 'Ammo Lock' and 'Stress Zyme' to try and get my ecosystem up and running quicker.
Amy.
Amy.

I would think you need to do way more water changes, but it depends on how many fish you have in your tank, and how much you're feeding them.
I'm doing a fish in cycle on a 12 gallon tank, and I'm testing my water every day. Based on the test results, I'm doing 30% water changes every 2 days.
You should probably get a test kit ASAP.

 

[chrisbassist]

If you still have lots of ammonia, you're still at the start of the cycle. Really I'd start doing daily changes. The ammonia will be having an effect, even if you can't see it yet. Maybe do 10-20% daily. Once you have your tests use them daily and use the results to determine how much needs changing.

I'd also get the liquid tests for nitrite. And do them daily. Pretty soon it's gonna soar. And that will start killing fish if you're not careful.

I'm coming to the end of my fish in cycle now and I'm sure glad I haven't needed to do a water change for the last 2 days now. So I know how much of a pain daily changes can be.

 

[nessar]

I believe ammonia burns the gills. It has long term and short term effects, but your fish are probably suffering, even if they look okay. Fish used for cycling often have shorter lives even after the process, too. So try to do daily changes and cut back on feeding. When you get a test kit, test every day and change water as soon as ammonia levels are at detectable levels.

oh just to let you know, ammo lock will help your fish, but might muck up your ammonia levels, as it is still ammonia so will test as ammonia, if that makes sense.

 

[raptorrex]

Hi, I have had my 23 litre tank cycling for about a month now (with fish in) and have been doing regular water changes etc. I didnt know if I am meant to be cleaning my filter media whilst the cycle is still happening? I know you are only meant to do it every month (or so I have been told) but was unsure as I don't want to get rid of the bacteria that the filter needs to complete its cycle?
Also, how often should I be testing my water? I've only got strips at the moment which have all been coming up fine, but they don't test for ammonia so I have been taking samples to my LFS for that to be tested, which at the moment is still a little high (last time it was tested it was at 1).
Thanks, Amy,.

whatever you do in the tank. leave the bio media alone. dont touch it till the cycle is over. its fine to clean the "white pads", if any, as they are mechanical, more than bio.

 

[xamy_valox]

Hi everyone, thanks for your replies.
Ok, I am going to up my water changes to probably every other day then?
I am feeding them every other day so I will do a water change on the alternate day.
According to my test strips that I have my nitrates and nitrites are at 0 but obviously as I've previously mentioned I can't yet test my ammonia as it doesnt show up on these tests (which I think is pretty stupid to be honest as it is one of the most important!).
If I had known it would be so difficult to set up in the first place I maybe would have thought twice about going in head first with keeping tropical fish! The tank was originally going to be my dads, but if it were left to him I think all the fish would probably be dead by now so it seems I have taken it over and its so stressful! I'm not actually getting any enjoyment out of it at the moment, which is a shame.
I'll get my hands on a liquid test kit asap and do more regular water changes.
I just get confused because I thought regular water changes (as in every other day) would be introducing too much new water too often so the filter would have to cope with trying to sort out that water aswell as the current water?
I don't know, I don't think I will ever get my head around it to be honest =\
Amy.

 

[waterdrop]

Good morning Amy,

Its great that you've decided to increase your water changes for now, since the levels of toxins in the water are currently unsure!

I feel your final conclusion right above this post from all the good advice the members gave above was a little short of what you need to be doing.

A Fish-In cycling situation is not a heathy one for fish. The paper strip testing that you are doing is worse than useless, its misleading and can lead you to make incorrect decisions about the crucial water changes your fish need.

I think getting a liquid-reagent based test kit is a priority for you. Not only do you not have a liquid ammonia test, you also don't have a liquid nitrite one. Without really knowing the results each 12 hours or so of these tests, its impossible to get a feel for what water changes you should be doing. Without test results, putting a size or frequency of water change into effect is just guessing.

The core aspect of Fish-In cycling for a beginner should be to figure out the percentage and frequency (how often and how much) of water changes that will keep both ammonia and nitrite(NO2) (as tested by a liquid kit) -at or below 0.25ppm- (for both poisons) until one can be home again (why we say 12 hours) to perform another test and possibly change water again.

That last paragraph may sound complicated but its not. If you don't have too many fish for your tank size, the tests will often show you that you don't need so many water changes!

Does that make sense?

~~waterdrop~~

 

[xamy_valox]

Good morning Amy,

Its great that you've decided to increase your water changes for now, since the levels of toxins in the water are currently unsure!

I feel your final conclusion right above this post from all the good advice the members gave above was a little short of what you need to be doing.

A Fish-In cycling situation is not a heathy one for fish. The paper strip testing that you are doing is worse than useless, its misleading and can lead you to make incorrect decisions about the crucial water changes your fish need.

I think getting a liquid-reagent based test kit is a priority for you. Not only do you not have a liquid ammonia test, you also don't have a liquid nitrite one. Without really knowing the results each 12 hours or so of these tests, its impossible to get a feel for what water changes you should be doing. Without test results, putting a size or frequency of water change into effect is just guessing.

The core aspect of Fish-In cycling for a beginner should be to figure out the percentage and frequency (how often and how much) of water changes that will keep both ammonia and nitrite(NO2) (as tested by a liquid kit) -at or below 0.25ppm- (for both poisons) until one can be home again (why we say 12 hours) to perform another test and possibly change water again.

That last paragraph may sound complicated but its not. If you don't have too many fish for your tank size, the tests will often show you that you don't need so many water changes!

Does that make sense?

~~waterdrop~~

Hi waterdrop,
Yeah it makes sense. I have a 23 litre tank and I have 5 guppies and a male betta in there at the moment. Which I have been told means its overstocked.
I have literally just bought a liquid tester kit (API Freshwater Master Tester Kit) online so hopefully it should be with me in the next few days. As I have a fluval edge tank I also bought yesterday from a fish shop a little bag that I am supposed to put on top of my filter to stop algae growth as I had quite a bit of it stuck to the sides of my tank (which I cleaned off when I did my last water change on saturday). However whether this will actually help I have no idea.
As soon as my testing kit arrives I will test, and shall I post the results so I can get a rough idea from you guys as what to do?
Also, am I doing the right thing by putting the ammo lock and stress zyme in or should I not bother with them anymore?
Thanks, Amy.

 

[waterdrop]

Ammo lock is a problem: there are at least two different products (I believe one typically in USA, one in UK) and they are different with one being completely wrong (it removes the food the bacteria need to grow) to do and the other being not necessarily harmful but usually not what we want in a typical situation. Stress Zyme I'm afraid is just snake oil. Algae fighting chemicals are also not something we want in the tank. So I'm afraid all these are things we don't need or want!

~~waterdrop~~

 

[xamy_valox]

Ammo lock is a problem: there are at least two different products (I believe one typically in USA, one in UK) and they are different with one being completely wrong (it removes the food the bacteria need to grow) to do and the other being not necessarily harmful but usually not what we want in a typical situation. Stress Zyme I'm afraid is just snake oil. Algae fighting chemicals are also not something we want in the tank. So I'm afraid all these are things we don't need or want!

~~waterdrop~~

=[
I give up!
Amy.

 

[waterdrop]

Ammo lock is a problem: there are at least two different products (I believe one typically in USA, one in UK) and they are different with one being completely wrong (it removes the food the bacteria need to grow) to do and the other being not necessarily harmful but usually not what we want in a typical situation. Stress Zyme I'm afraid is just snake oil. Algae fighting chemicals are also not something we want in the tank. So I'm afraid all these are things we don't need or want!

~~waterdrop~~

=[
I give up!
Amy.

Don't worry, you're going to be fine! There are kitchen sponges I believe (I think one mentioned was Scotchbright?) which do not scratch plastic. Or sometimes people figure out an open-cell sort of sponge material that feels a bit scratchy but won't scratch plastic when you use it. Either of these sorts of things would make a great start on your algae. If you clean a bunch of it off just prior to the water change, a miximum amount of algae will go out with the outgoing water.

When your test kits get here you're going to be able to have some real feedback about your ammonia and nitrite. When ammonia or nitrite(NO2) tests higher than 0.25ppm you know you need to decide on a bigger percentage of water or a more freqent water change or both. When you go 12 hours and the traces of either ammonia or nitrite stay well below 0.25ppm then you've got a breather and can put a change and see what the next set of tests says 12 hours later.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[nessar]

good luck!

and also can I mention your cycle will take longer than usual due to being overstocked
more fish means more ammonia which needs more bacteria to break it down.
so it might be worth your while to give a few fish back to the lfs, or give them away or buy them a new tank.
You'll have to do less water changes and the cycle shouldnt take as long.

If you want to keep them Pets at Home do a 'starter kit' that is a 15 to 21 litre tank (depending on which one you buy), with filter and air pump included for £20. They're no fluval edge, but theyre nice enough glass tanks. You would have to buy a heater though but thats not too expensive. You can also aways take out the decorations (pirate, princess etc) as they are technically childrens tanks. Much much cheaper than the edge too.

by the way, how is your betta getting on with your guppies? And are they female or male guppies, or what mix? I might start up a similar community in the future.

Oh and for some reason I've never had any algae on the actual glass, but I have heard that algae magnet cleaners are a godsend. One piece goes inside the tank, and you hold the other half outside, and use the outside one to move the inside one. Hope that makes sense. Your lfs should sell them.

 

[xamy_valox]

good luck!

and also can I mention your cycle will take longer than usual due to being overstocked
more fish means more ammonia which needs more bacteria to break it down.
so it might be worth your while to give a few fish back to the lfs, or give them away or buy them a new tank.
You'll have to do less water changes and the cycle shouldnt take as long.

If you want to keep them Pets at Home do a 'starter kit' that is a 15 to 21 litre tank (depending on which one you buy), with filter and air pump included for £20. They're no fluval edge, but theyre nice enough glass tanks. You would have to buy a heater though but thats not too expensive. You can also aways take out the decorations (pirate, princess etc) as they are technically childrens tanks. Much much cheaper than the edge too.

by the way, how is your betta getting on with your guppies? And are they female or male guppies, or what mix? I might start up a similar community in the future.

Oh and for some reason I've never had any algae on the actual glass, but I have heard that algae magnet cleaners are a godsend. One piece goes inside the tank, and you hold the other half outside, and use the outside one to move the inside one. Hope that makes sense. Your lfs should sell them.

Hi Nessar,


I had a few platys die and only had one left and felt sorry for him so sent him back to my LFS so now I have one betta, 4 male guppies and a baby female guppy which I think is much better for me at the moment with only having a 'starter tank'.
My betta gets on perfectly with my guppies, as mentioned they are all males apart from the baby, but my betta doesnt bother with any of them.
He has kinda took over this log ornament that I have in the tank which he can swim into, so he only gets a bit annoyed with them if they go in there whilst he is in there, but they soon swim out once they realise he is lurking in there!!
The only bullying I did have was my guppies ganing up on my remaining platy which my LFS found really strange as apparently guppies are quite pleasant!

I do have an algae cleaner, and it is useful for getting the bubbles off the top of my tank, but for actually cleaning the sides of it, its actually a nightmare and looks like its just scratched it instead of clearing it away. I've just bought a soft normal sponge and I clean the sides when Im doing a water change and touch wood so far I havent had much build up since doing this. Plus its much easier to manouver because of the fluval edge being such an awkwared shape!!
Amy.