Something Is Wrong!

[Mauricia]

Tank size: 5 gallons (it's just temporary)
pH: very high, the city water has a ph of 9, and I'm workign to lower it but I think it's still at like 8.5, but I took a good couple hours to acclimate them to the condition
I'm doing the tests for these now, I'll update when I have them
ammonia:
nitrite:
nitrate:
kH:
gH:

tank temp: 80 degrees, one slight temperature drop last night when I changed the water, but otherwise very steady

Fish Symptoms (include full description including lesion, color, location, fish behavior): The male juvenile guppy is staying at the top of the water. It seems almost like he's shedding this sort of white film falls off of him. This is hard to describe but his tail fin seems a tiny bit tattered, but when you look closely it's all intact, it's just see through in a couple spots at the back.
The juvenile male platy is just sitting at the back under the heater, I can't really see if he has white stuff falling off of him or not since he's sort of in the dark.
Neither are interested in food. They were both fine when I went to bed at 4 last night.

Volume and Frequency of water changes: 10% daily, 25% yesterday though. It's sort of complicated but I couldn't cycle their tank due to an emergency situation, and I'm trying to save them for a friend.

Chemical Additives or Media in your tank: I added kent pH control minus to the water that I added (not directly to the tank. Otherwise, there's just stuff to neutralize the chlorine/chloramine. Oh, and cycle was added the first day.

Tank inhabitants: Just those two

Recent additions to your tank (living or decoration): None, and all the decorations were kept in old tanks for years with no issues, I boiled them before I put them in. No live plants right now.

Exposure to chemicals: None, except those listed above. I think it could be the ph minus that's causing the problem? I didn't want to use it but peat moss wasn't working and the ph is so high.

Digital photo (include if possible): sorry no camera

 

[Mauricia]

So I just tested the ph again, and it's really low! about 6.4.... well this explains the platy not being very happy! can this cause the guppy to shed stuff like that? what sort of water changes would be suitable not to stress them too much? I'm still waiting for the amonia, but nitrite is at 0 and nitrate is 30ppm

Oh and the platy seems fine now, when I took the top off the tank and looked in he swam up to the top expecting food, I'm not going to feed him though till I have a better idea of what's going on.

 

[WILDER]

A white film on fish can be due to ph shock, you have altered your fish far to fast.
Don't use ph adjusters there more trouble then there worth, you are better off running some peat in your filter to lower ph.

The white on the fish does it look like slime or fluffy in appearance.
The spots on the fish are they the size of a grain of salt or bigger.
If bigger do the spots have and redness to them like a circling of red on the outside of the spot or a red centre.


pH Shock

As its name suggests this condition occurs when a fish is introduced to quickly into a new environment which has a very different pH from the one it came from, when the pH is adjusted to quickly and the fish have little or no time to adjust themselves, or when the pH is to far outside the fishes normal range.

It is very important that any change in water chemistry is made slowly and fish should never be exposed to changes of pH greater than 0.5 of one unit on the pH scale in either direction.

Avoidance is by far the best solution because in most cases the symptoms don't appear until the second or third day by which time the damage has been done and the fish will probably die.

A fish suffering from this condition will show all the typical signs of shock -

Lying on the bottom and paying little or no attention to its surroundings and ignoring potential threats.
It may even lay on its side or go upside down completely.
There could be other signs to, related to Acidosis and Alkalosis
Excessive mucus production.
Rapid breathing.
Swollen abdomen. (Alkalosis only).
If the condition is allowed to go on for one or two days then the chances of a successful remedy are greatly reduced because a lot of damage will have taken place. If the symptoms are spotted early enough there are a couple of things that will help.

Begin to return the pH to the original pH in steps of 0.4 of one unit on the pH scale and allow 3 hrs in between the adjustments. Make these adjustments until the pH is returned to a safe and satisfactory level.
Treat the tank with a broad spectrum anti-Bacteria/Fungus compound to prevent secondary infections of the Skin and Gills.
Prevention is easy. A successful treatment isn't!

 

[Davo86]

So I just tested the ph again, and it's really low! about 6.4.... well this explains the platy not being very happy! can this cause the guppy to shed stuff like that? what sort of water changes would be suitable not to stress them too much? I'm still waiting for the amonia, but nitrite is at 0 and nitrate is 30ppm

so your ph has come from 8.5 to 6.4? sounds like you've overdosed the ph minus, you would have been better to just let the fish get used to the high ph

 

[Mauricia]

Thank you for your replies. Yes I'm pretty sure that is the problem. I tried to be very careful with it, but apparently I have not done well, I certainly won't use it any more. So if the pH in my water is a 9, then if I do like 5% water changes every 3 hours would that be adjusting it back slowly enough? The white coming off the guppy looks sort of slimy? certainly not fluffy

 

[WILDER]

The fish then sounds like there suffering from ph shock which can be fatal.

This info is taken from the above thread.

Begin to return the pH to the original pH in steps of 0.4 of one unit on the pH scale and allow 3 hrs in between the adjustments. Make these adjustments until the pH is returned to a safe and satisfactory level.
Treat the tank with a broad spectrum anti-Bacteria/Fungus compound to prevent secondary infections of the Skin and Gills.
Prevention is easy. A successful treatment isn't!

 

[Mauricia]

Yes, I see that advice makes sense, I'm just asking if this seems reasonably slow enough, because I lack the sophistication and intelligence to be able to figure out how to raise the pH is such a specific way. I mean I understand if you can't tell because it's so vague, but I don't really have any idea what to do without making it worse. I feel very terrible that I've caused this problem anyway

 

[WILDER]

I would do water changes every three hours to return the ph back to your tap ph.Once fish have settled and you want to lower your ph I would add some peat to your filter.
Fish do get used to ph if you climatise them slowly so there no need really to be altering your ph.

 

[Mauricia]

Ok, thanks so much for your help, I really appreciate it! Hopefully this will end well, but at least I've learned my lesson.

 

[WILDER]

Good luck.