Play Sand for Stingray?

[CarloM12]

Hello everyone,

So I have been wondering, is home depot play sand safe for stingrays? I have 3 Motoro rays in a 75-gallon tank bare bottom, and I am looking to move them over to my 125 gallon tank which has play sand I have had in there for over a year. It looks as though it is safe, and I once had a teacup ray in there and it had done well. I know the whole thing about silica in the sand but the play sand I bought seems to be very fine. Also, what's the difference between play sand, and pool filter sand? I'll leave a link below for what brand it is.

Link: http://www.acehardware.com/product/...9aZ5V0TEUEGDy1oPEbmWvaImknBmnG58aAtL9EALw_wcB

 

[Byron]

With the caveat that I have never kept a ray...I would not think Quikrete Play Sand would pose any problems. I have this in all my tanks. Substrate fish do very well. It is the most refined of the industrial type sands, so no roughness. My cories sift it through their mouths and expel it out the gill slits. Other substrate feeders like cichlids do similar.

Pool filter sand is used by many, though I've always thought it might be more rough than play sand. It is also silica, at least the Quikrete brand is. White should always be avoided, it can stress out fish. I've never used it for this reason; I hear there is a black pool filter sand but I've not seen it locally, and some have mentioned a buff coloured pool filter sand. I like the dark grey play sand.

 

[CarloM12]

Ok, yeah I have the tan version of play sand. Personally, by looking at it, I think it will work like I mentioned before I had a teacup stingray in there and it did fine. Also, another thing is like I don't understand what they mean when everyone says that there are sharp edges in the sand, I don't see anything, and what happens in their natural habitat. The sand isn't exactly as smooth as a baby's butt right? I've seen stingrays on gravel before, whats the difference? Obviously, I've heard there is some sand that has like tiny glass shards or silica in them that is really cheap, that would be harmful. However, it would just be such a hassle for me to take all of that sand out, to then pay 100$ or so to buy more that looks literally the same and then cloud the water. What are the indications that you know the sand isn't working, I didn't remember seeing any scrapings on the teacup ray I had.

 

[Colin_T]

Sand is very finely crushed up rock. Sand that is in a river gets polished smooth by the water flowing over it and the sand grains rubbing across each other. This helps to wear the sharp edges off the individual grains.

I have had stingrays on gravel too and depending on the gravel, some is better than others. Some gravel is smooth and other gravel has edges. I have also kept them on shell and they didn't hurt themselves but they didn't like it and avoided it most of the time.

Sand is much better for rays because they like to bury themselves under it. Gravel, shells and course sand can scratch their skin and you will see lines from the scratches on their belly and back. The scratches can lead to infections and scarring.

In freshwater environments you often get a build up of mud over the sand and this reduces the chance of the fish contacting the sand. However, mud is not good in an aquarium

If you get some sand and hold it with you fingers, then drag the sand across your forearm, you will feel it if it is sharp and it may even scratch you. If it does scratch your forearm then try to find another sand.

You want to avoid extremely fine sand like lime sand because it can get into the rays gills when they grub about on the bottom.

If you can a find sand that is suitable for Corydoras then it will be fine for rays. Basically treat them like a scaleless fish, because they don't have scales.

 

[CarloM12]

I actually have 3 corydoras in there at the moment, by the way, Colin I figured out the issue and I used Pimifix for it along with aquarium salt, it was some sort of a bacterial infection. I am doing a 7-day treatment, and then I'll be good to go. So back to what we were talking about, I had a teacup stingray, and I can't recall seeing anything on him. I'll do the forearm test, but the thing is I actually have a few pebbles in my sand because I used to have gravel and I left some of it in when I put the new sand in, so it might affect the test. If I do have to move the sand, what's the best way to get the sand in there with the water already there? It would just be so much of a hassle. Also, I've heard people ask this already but what happens if you put an additional layer of sand over the existing layer? Obviously, the stingrays can still be affected by the first layer of sand when they bury themselves, but it's still better than nothing.

 

[Colin_T]

Good to hear you found the issue with the sharks dying

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The easiest way to add sand or gravel is to remove a couple of inches of water from the aquarium. Then get a 2 litre (1/2gallon) plastic container and put some sand in it. Put the bucket in the tank and let it fill with tank water. Then lower the bucket to the bottom and tip the sand out.

Once you have added the sand you can spread it out by dragging your fingers thru it, or leave it in piles and the rays will probably level it over the next few days.

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If there are a few bits of gravel left from previously it is unlikely to cause any problems. As long as the majority of the substrate is sand they should be fine.

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If you have sand in there already, and you add a different sand, they will eventually mix.

 

[CarloM12]

So based on the link I gave above, do you think that bag of play sand could scratch the rays? If it is not, I guess I would have to get a strainer and scoop it out. Also, I am going to put sand into the 75-gallon tank and make it a planted tank. However, last time I did this all my plants died and I was doing everything right with the lighting (Gave them around 10 hours a day), just didn't have any fertilizer or soil in the sand to give them nutrients. Do I need like root tabs in the sand, or maybe a layer of soil first and then the sand on top of it? My plan is to make that a planted community tank, and the 125 gallon as the stingray tank with the silver dollars and the Arowana.

By the way, I'm looking for fish to go in with those guys, but the issue I'm afraid to get anything such as large cichlids, I had a horror show with this type of thing before when I had discus and a teacup stingray. I bought a teacup stingray a while back and my discus after two days start grazing on it and biting the ends of it, it got so stressed that night it was dead. At the time I didn't know what was going on, and the LFS thought it was a bad fish, so they gave me another one, and in three days they kill it again the same exact way. So now I'm just terrified to put anything in there that is a cichlid, I know people have had success with more peaceful ones like Geophagus and severums, but I just feel like they are all too aggressive for the stingrays, and can out-compete them for food. I like big dither fish like Silver dollars, and the Arowana is a good fish to have to provide some contrast between the top and the bottom.

 

[Colin_T]

I can't comment on the sand because I have never used it.

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I would not add any other types of fish to the stingray tank. The more fish the faster the water quality will deteriorate. And your Arowana is going to get big (2ft long). When he is full grown, that tank will have a big bioload. Stingrays don't like poor water quality so the fewer fish in their tank, the better.

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You can use a fine mesh net to scoop out sand or gravel.

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If you want sand in a tank and plants, you can grow plants in plastic containers. Use a 1 litre (1/4 gallon) plastic container and put some gravel in the bottom, then a thin layer of plant fertiliser for normal garden plants, then a thin 1/4 inch layer of red clay that has been dried and crumbled into a powder. Then cover in a couple of inches of gravel. Plant the plants in the gravel and as they grow their roots will reach the nutrients.

You can put some silicon on the outside of the plastic containers and stick gravel or sand on them to help camouflage them. Then put some rocks or wood in front of the pots and you have a planted tank with sand.

 

[Byron]

My original post seems to have been misunderstood somehow...play sand is extremely safe for fish. It is the most highly refined of the industrial sands so it has no roughness. There is no need to take it out.

I wold not have rooted plants as the ray will most likely uproot them. And no other fish.

 

[CarloM12]

Ok, thanks. Is pool filter sand rougher than play sand or something? Because my LFS told me it may have rough edges, but I think I told them by accident I had pool filter sand. Also, I am talking about plants for another tank, a 75-gallon community tank I am going to move all the fish I currently have in the 125 to the 75. Also, a question for Colin, I'd prefer to have some kind of soil as the bottom layer in my tank, and the sand on top. Can I actually just buy those plants in the plastic tubes at PetSmart? My LFS is kind of overpriced and they don't have that many plants. Does the lighting have to be something high tech? I have LED lights on the 125 gallon and on the 75 gallon I have just your standard hood with a bulb I got from home depot. It is actually meant for plants and aquariums believe it or not. I will do 8-10 hours a day, I think that is satisfactory.

Something I forget to mention is that a friend of mine is offering me his 15 inch Arowana, and I want to take it off his hands for free. I would put it in the 125 with the 3 stingrays and the silver dollars. I already have a fluval 406 canister filter in there with an aqueon 75 HOB filter, and on the 75 gallon I have two fluval 306 canisters, so I plan to move one of those 306's to help the 406 filter the tank with the HOB. As to what I would do with the existing Arowana, I am not entirely sure, he can't go in there with the larger arowana or he will get eaten right, he is like 5-6 inches. Is that a significant amount of filtration, assuming I will do once a week water changes of 50% or greater? Also, what do you feed an Arowana of that size other than frozen food and large pellets? I know people feed live but I am too afraid of the parasites on live fish, I stay away from it.

 

[Byron]

Ok, thanks. Is pool filter sand rougher than play sand or something? Because my LFS told me it may have rough edges, but I think I told them by accident I had pool filter sand.

As I said previously, pool filter sand might be rough, I've never used it. Play sand definitely is not rough, it is highly refined to remove any sharpness.

I'd prefer to have some kind of soil as the bottom layer in my tank, and the sand on top. Can I actually just buy those plants in the plastic tubes at PetSmart? My LFS is kind of overpriced and they don't have that many plants. Does the lighting have to be something high tech? I have LED lights on the 125 gallon and on the 75 gallon I have just your standard hood with a bulb I got from home depot. It is actually meant for plants and aquariums believe it or not. I will do 8-10 hours a day, I think that is satisfactory.

I personally would not mess with soil. Plants do not need this, and it does have serious issues. All aquarium plants will grow fine in sand. You can add nutrients with substrate tabs for large plants, or liquid fertilizer.

I have no good experience with LED, so I will leave that for those who do; if you know what you are getting, it is ideal light. I use T8 fluorescent...what is the light on the 75g? Better tubes might be all you need. The so-called plant or aquarium tubes tend to be much poorer than daylight (5000K and 6500K). The attached photo is my 70g with the dual T8 tubes. Not a great photo, my camera is cheap and very old now, but you get the idea.

 

[CarloM12]

Oh wow, I like it. The light tubes I got are from home depot, so I probably need to change them. Can you show me what you use as a fertilizer for your plants? Also in a planted tank like that do you do the water change once a week or is that too much? So if I get another bag of play sand, and dose the tank with fertilizer, will that work? I used to have plants in the 125 in play sand, but the leaves would constantly be browning or yellowing and dying off. Again, I was only dosing with Iron, nothing else. Also with the plants, could I just get them from PetSmart, the ones in the tubes and grow them bigger?

Link to the bulb I use: https://www.homedepot.com/p/Philips...and-Aquarium-Grow-Light-Bulb-429167/203865702

 

[Byron]

Oh wow, I like it. The light tubes I got are from home depot, so I probably need to change them. Can you show me what you use as a fertilizer for your plants? Also in a planted tank like that do you do the water change once a week or is that too much? So if I get another bag of play sand, and dose the tank with fertilizer, will that work? I used to have plants in the 125 in play sand, but the leaves would constantly be browning or yellowing and dying off. Again, I was only dosing with Iron, nothing else. Also with the plants, could I just get them from PetSmart, the ones in the tubes and grow them bigger?

Link to the bulb I use: https://www.homedepot.com/p/Philips...and-Aquarium-Grow-Light-Bulb-429167/203865702

First on the light, I use Phillips tubes from Home Depot on my 70g and 90g tanks which have a dual-tube T8 fixture. The spectrum is what you want to change. I have had good luck with one 6500K and one 5000K Phillips T8 tube over these two tanks. That is what is in the photo. If you only have one tube in the fixture, the 6500K is best alone.

Fertilizers. I use Flourish Tabs with one tab next to each of the larger swords, replaced every two months. Depending upon your GH, you can get three to four months out of these, but I have very soft water so the calcium and magnesium need to be replaced more often. I prefer the tabs to adding liquid fertilizer (I do this too, but less) because the nutrients get taken up by the plants without getting into the water column so you have less algae issues and less fish problems. I also use a complete liquid, Seachem's Flourish Comprehensive Supplement for the Planted Aquarium, but about half the recommended dose. If it were not for the floating plants, I would probably discontinue the liquid and just use the tabs.

I change 60-65% of the water in this tank once each week. The liquid fertilizer is added the following day. The heavy metal binding in most water conditioners can negate some minerals so waiting a day solves this.

Plant species depend upon your lighting. The dual T8 tubes over this tank is not that bright, but the tank is shallow so I have to be careful with duration to avoid algae. This tank only gets seven hours a day of tank lighting; the other tanks get eight hours. Any more than this, and algae increases. Low and moderate light requiring plants tend to do fine. I could suggest plant species to try when I know your light, one or two 48-inch tubes over this tank.

 

[CarloM12]

Ok, so the two T8 bulbs I have but the spectrum on them isn't enough? So can you send me a link of the light bulb with the spectrum, the root tabs and the fertilizer that you use? Also, I just am interested in relatively easy plants that require low light anyways. I also have 6 decent sized severums that I want to move over to the 75 gallon, will they eat my plants?

Is this what you are referring to, https://www.homedepot.com/p/Philips...-Bulb-Daylight-6500K-10-Pack-451807/205477895

It's 6500k

 

[NickAu]

The easiest way to add sand or gravel is to remove a couple of inches of water from the aquarium. Then get a 2 litre (1/2gallon) plastic container and put some sand in it

Adding sand to a Aquarium the easy way.. Make sure you wash the sand well before use.