New Fish Keeper, Aqua Nano 40. Is It Cycled?

[addy157]

 
Hi guys, i would appreciate a little advice on my new tank as it is my first

 
So i have had my Tank for 6 weeks for and i have been testing the water with the proper test kits (not strips) and has always been around PH - 7.4
                                                         Ammonia - 0.25
                                                         Nitrates - 0
 
I do about 20 % water change a week and as you can see i have two mickey platies,
I did originally have 4, i got them a week after i had set up my tank and i had been using the denitrol stuff to speed up the bacterial growth and as advised by the pet store i should be fine with my platies.
However the other two orange ones have died, the first (male) died after 48 hours and the other a couple of weeks after. I was testing the water and everything was fine and the other two silver ones are so hyperactive ( even jumping out of the tank haha) i wondered why the other two had not made it. 
I wondered maybe they where bad fish? I got them from a good store (Abyss in Stockport.. im always a little nervous about ones from pets at home no one who works there seems to know what they are on about).
 
Anyway i was wondering if i could start introducing other fishes? even if ammonia is 0.25... altho it doesn't seem to change and what fish i should get. I was looking at corys... or rams..altho i don't think my tank is big enough for a couple of rams? Or a school of tetras (small ones)
Also are the two platies ok with just two of them now... or should i considering getting more for company. I just want to be careful about overstocking.
 
And with a tank this size .. does it harm do a couple of water changes a week...or should i stick to 20% a week?
 
 
                                                   

 

[the_lock_man]

You say "Nitrates - 0", do you mean "Nitrites"
 
On the face of it, Ammonia should not be at 0.25ppm, it should be at 0ppm. That said, if you are using the API kit, it is notoriously difficult to tell 0ppm from 0.25ppm especially under artificial light.
 
If you are only changing 20% per week, and have always only changed 20% per week, then the 2 platies would have died because of ammonia poisoning - the other two would have been suffering just as much, but were that bit stronger and able to survive it. Fish are like humans in terms of susceptibility to illness and whatever, I've only had one cold in the last 3 years, whereas my missus has had 5 or 6. I hear good things about Abyss, so I would say that you wouldn't have had particularly weak stock, certainly not due to any mismanagement of them at the shop.
 
Working on the assumption that your ammonia is actually 0ppm (because of the API misread), then yes, I would say you can increase your stock. What you don't say is what size tank you have, and what your Carbonate Hardness (KH). Let us know that info, and I can give you a bit more info on stocking.
 
The platies you have - if they are both male or both female, then they will be fine as they are, if you want a bit of variety. If you've currently got 1 of each, then getting another female would be a good idea - male platies are a bit, erm, pushy when it comes to a bit of owsyerfather, to the extent that females can be stressed to death over it. Having multiple females per male means that individual females get a bit of a breather every now and then.

OK, doofus here didn't spot the fact that it's an Aqua Nano 40, which is 55l.
 
I would say you could have a shoal of a nanofish (see this thread here), as well as another platy.

 

[addy157]

Thanks for your response...
 
I did actually test my tap water's ammonia to see if there would be a colour difference... and looking at that it is bit yellower and i would say looks zero on the chart... and thus my tank would be 0.25.
 
The two platies are females. I did ammonia may be reason why but like i said it always only ever been 0.25 and the other two have always been sper hypeactive... so i was confused. There is one platy that is a bit of a bully.
 
Do you think 20% water change is too much or too little? Should i increase this once i get more fish?
 
Thanks

 

[Arcticfox1977]

To lower the 0.25 ammonia you need a larger water change. Like what's been mentioned, ammonia should be 0
If you are in doubt if it reads 0 or 0.25, do a water change. I'm guessing your tank is not cycled. Since you have fish in already be prepared to do daily water changes for the first couple of weeks. Keep testing your water for ammonia and nitrite. If any shows 0.25 or above do a large WC.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

I am sorry bus I do not agree with much of the above suggestions because they do not comport with the fact. The tank has been up for 6 weeks and half the fish died- one in 2 days and the other in 2 weeks. There is no way that the fish load which remained (combined with the initial two week)s that there should be any ammonia at all in the tank. The ammonia oxidizing bacteria should already be at full strength for the bio-load and there should be 0 ammonia.
 
The curve ball here is that denitrol. I did a quick check and found very little information that leads me to believe I would ever put it into any of my tanks. I can not even find out what is actually in any of their products and can not find any research that shows it. Most of it looks to be heterotrophic bacteria which will do little to help with either ammonia or nitrite long term. The fact that a pet store told you to use is pretty much enough reason for me not to do so. Normally, I would tell you that you can not have a constant .25 ppm ammonia reading in a tank and have 0 nitrite all the time, unless one had something to take care of the nitrite but not the ammonia? Not common but remotely possible in this case.
 
However, I would bet that your .25 ppm reading is not real. You could unquestionably an add fish from here if your nitrite were 0 for sure, i.e without the denitrol. I do not know what is in it and tend to not trust it. However, I still believe you are likely fully cycled for the two small fish in the tank. I know one should normally be able to do a fish in cycle properly and have the initial stage over in under 5-6 weeks. I have seen the lab research where they do this on multiple tanks and lose no fish. But these guys are pros. So we mere mortals may need an extra week. Also that time frame falls apart one is changing massive amounts of water daily at the slightest reading of ammonia or nitrite. Many fish can handle such low levels for a short term period, as in a proper fish in cycle (but this is a topic for a different discussion. We must guard against things getting to high. This is another argument for not doing fish in- what is too high is not a constant and it is pH and temperature dependent.
 
If I am asked what the proper number and type of fish would be to begin a fishless cycle in what is essentially a 15 gal. tank, I would say one platy, two at the most if they are not big and better is two even smaller fish. The odds are good doing this one would not need many, if any water changes. Then once the tank cycled 100%, one would be able to add one more small fish and pretty easily deal with the mini-spike and get to 0/0 again. When they added the next fish, they might even miss seeing the mini-spike because it would end even faster. The goal behind fish in cycling is to make sure not to increase the bio-load of the tank from the addition of the next fish by more than 25-30%. This makes it a lot easier for the bacteria to catch up quickly and for the levels not to get high enough to require a water change.
 
This is the big drawback to fish in cycling, since done right, it takes many months (as many as 6) to become fully stocked. If one starts with too many fish it makes for problems fast, if one adds ensuing fish too quickly or too many, it causes problems.

 

[The Taffy Apple]

I am sorry bus I do not agree with much of the above suggestions because they do not comport with the fact. The tank has been up for 6 weeks and half the fish died- one in 2 days and the other in 2 weeks. There is no way that the fish load which remained (combined with the initial two week)s that there should be any ammonia at all in the tank. The ammonia oxidizing bacteria should already be at full strength for the bio-load and there should be 0 ammonia.
 
The curve ball here is that denitrol. I did a quick check and found very little information that leads me to believe I would ever put it into any of my tanks. I can not even find out what is actually in any of their products and can not find any research that shows it. Most of it looks to be heterotrophic bacteria which will do little to help with either ammonia or nitrite long term. The fact that a pet store told you to use is pretty much enough reason for me not to do so. Normally, I would tell you that you can not have a constant .25 ppm ammonia reading in a tank and have 0 nitrite all the time, unless one had something to take care of the nitrite but not the ammonia? Not common but remotely possible in this case.
 
However, I would bet that your .25 ppm reading is not real. You could unquestionably an add fish from here if your nitrite were 0 for sure, i.e without the denitrol. I do not know what is in it and tend to not trust it. However, I still believe you are likely fully cycled for the two small fish in the tank. I know one should normally be able to do a fish in cycle properly and have the initial stage over in under 5-6 weeks. I have seen the lab research where they do this on multiple tanks and lose no fish. But these guys are pros. So we mere mortals may need an extra week. Also that time frame falls apart one is changing massive amounts of water daily at the slightest reading of ammonia or nitrite. Many fish can handle such low levels for a short term period, as in a proper fish in cycle (but this is a topic for a different discussion. We must guard against things getting to high. This is another argument for not doing fish in- what is too high is not a constant and it is pH and temperature dependent.
 
If I am asked what the proper number and type of fish would be to begin a fishless cycle in what is essentially a 15 gal. tank, I would say one platy, two at the most if they are not big and better is two even smaller fish. The odds are good doing this one would not need many, if any water changes. Then once the tank cycled 100%, one would be able to add one more small fish and pretty easily deal with the mini-spike and get to 0/0 again. When they added the next fish, they might even miss seeing the mini-spike because it would end even faster. The goal behind fish in cycling is to make sure not to increase the bio-load of the tank from the addition of the next fish by more than 25-30%. This makes it a lot easier for the bacteria to catch up quickly and for the levels not to get high enough to require a water change.
 
This is the big drawback to fish in cycling, since done right, it takes many months (as many as 6) to become fully stocked. If one starts with too many fish it makes for problems fast, if one adds ensuing fish too quickly or too many, it causes problems.

 
What level on an ammonia chart do you think is high enough for the need of a water change, then?
I was always under the impression that even the smallest amount of ammonia, over time, will probably affect the fish if not in the short term then more than likely in the long term.
 
Terry.