Fishless Cycling With Live Plants

The April FOTM Contest Poll is open!
FishForums.net Fish of the Month
🏆 Click to vote! 🏆

cjheck

Mostly New Member
Joined
Jan 9, 2014
Messages
38
Reaction score
0
Location
US
I am on day 7 of fishless cycling. I started at 3ppm ammonia and am now at 1.5ppm with no nitrites. I know that my plants will use the nitrogen sources in the water for nutrients, so I won't see the normal levels you would in a fishless cycle without the plants. So, how does this alter what I should be looking for as the end of cycling?

As long as my plants are using the ammonia and nitrite can I add fish sooner? Do I just add more ammonia once it reaches below 0.25 ppm and see what the levels drop to? When is a good indicator that I can safely add fish since my tank won't follow the typical cycle now?
 
It's still going to be about zero ammonia and zero nitrite.

I would say to redoes when the ammonia drops to about 0.25 ppm... But only dose back to 2ppm rather than 3.

Keep testing daily. You may or may not ever see nitrite. But once the tank chews through a dose of ammonia in 24 hours without a sign of ammonia or nitrite the next day, then you are ready for fish.




Please share the plants you have, how many, how big the tank is, and your lighting. And of course, anything else you would like to share.
 
I have the following plants in my 10G tank:

Anubius Nana
Staurogyne Repens
Water Sprite
Java Fern
Hygrophila (narrow leaved)
Wisteria

I know I have 2 Anubius still connected, 1 Java fern, probably about 10 Staurogyne, 5 Water Sprites, 10 Wisteria, and about 5 Hygrophila. Currently using API CO2 Booster and Aqueon Plant Food. You'll have to excuse the mess the tank looks like, I'm waiting to fully scape until my Mopani Driftwood arrives, but I wanted to get the roots started on the plants.

Currently the Anubius is attached to a piece of dead coral that I picked up years ago Scuba Diving (don't worry, it was already dead when I picked it up), and the Java will be attached to the driftwood. Does it have to be attached to anything, or just not buried?

As far as lighting, I honestly don't know what it is. I bought a Topfin 10 Gallon that came with LED lights, but it doesn't say the wattage. I know it's not a super high-end tank, but on a budget and just starting out I didn't want to go all out while I was still learning this (space is also very limited).

 
 

Attachments

  • 2014-01-15 19.06.56.jpg
    2014-01-15 19.06.56.jpg
    118.6 KB · Views: 209
Looks good... You've got some faster growing plants hygro and wisteria, and some slow growers anubias and java ferns.


A nice mix. Keep the light on for about 6 hours a day, and test regularly. It will happen fairly quick compared to a full fish less cycle, but it will still take a bit of time.

Java fern can be allowed to just sort of float, as long as the rhizome isn't buried it will be just fine.
 
It is often not possible to know if plants will handle the majority of the cycling work unless one plants fairly heavily and includes a fair amount of fast growing plants. You are correct to assume that a -lanted cycle will  not proceed the same way as a purely fishless cycle without plants will. The reason is the plants take in the ammonium portion of the total ammonia. Unlike the bacteria, plants do not then make nitrite which needs to be converted to nitrate (the plants will also consume nitrate).
 
Eagle pretty much hit the nail on the head. You are looking for two things- no ammonia and no nitrite. The one thing he did not mention is that live plants have the very bacteria you want to develop on their roots and leaves etc. So, when you plant you seed some amount of bacteria and this includes the ones that convert the nitrite. And for this reason one should never see either the nitrite or the nitrate levels they would with a plain vanilla plantless cycle.In some cases one may never see any nitrite at all.
 
So we have to change what we are looking for, how often we are testing and how we react to the readings. The key remains ammonia. One should not be adding any more until what is in the tank has been processed. you need to see ammonia down at .25 ppm or less before adding more. One also must continue testing for nitrite as its absence or presence gives us an idea of how much bacteria might be at work in a tank. In tanks where the plants do most of the work, nitrite should be a rare thing and if seen it ill be low and never really climb, instead it will disappear fairly fast. In a tank where the bacteria carries more of the load, some nitrite will show up, should rise some and then drop. But the numbers will still be lower than if there were no plants.
 
In the end one looks for the same results no matter what the amount of plants and bacteria may be. You dose ammonia in an amount to produce  2 or 3 ppm for your volume of water, wait 24 hours and test. If ammonia and nitrite are 0, you are good to go. if they are not 0/0, then more bacteria is needed and one would continue until it is in place as shown by getting that 0/0 in 24 hours when you add ammonia again.
 
There are a lot of variables to cycling with plants present. Often, as suggested by eagle, one can work with a lower dose of ammonia and do fine. Plants do grow and as they grow they can handle more ammonia. Also, plants take up space in a tank. This often means one may have a lighter fish load. A lighter fish load means less ammonia creation and thus there is less to process so whatever the need for bacteria to complete the cycling chores is will be reduced.
 
But in the end it is all very simple, you can add fish to a planted tank as long as the number of fish going in doesn't exceed the capacity of the plants and bacteria present at the time to process the ammonia as fast as it is created. Few fish create less ammonia, the smaller fish typical in planted tanks produce less ammonia than bigger fish will. With plants a partly cycled tank is safe for some number of fish because there is no nitrite involved at that level of stocking, a partly cycled tank with no plants will not be safe since there may be some ammonia present and there will surely be nitrite.
 
Hope this info helped.
 
I am also fishless cycling with plants for three weeks now. I started with ammonia at 2ppm. When this dropped to 0.25 after about ten days I introduced another dose of 2ppm. On Friday I got a 0 reading for Ammonia, Nitrite and Nitrate has spiked to 3.3 and 50 respectively. I tested again today and I have a 0 Ammonia reading, but Nitrite hasn't changed.
 
My question is this. Should I wait until I get a zero for Nitrite and then try another dose of Ammonia? Or should I give the tank another dose at 2ppm now?
 
I would let it sit until the nitrite drops more. But I mistrust your readings. Plants will consume nitrate so that should be low or absent with sufficient plants. But your numbers do not make sense to me unless you have a lot of nitrate nitrate in your tap and you are changing water and you have very few plants.
 
From a bacterial standpoint, 4 ppm of ammonia makes 10.24 ppm of nitrite max. which in turn can create a max. of 13.76 ppm of nitrate. Now we know your plants must be taking up some part of the total ammonia and the nitrate. This means your nitrite should never reach 10.24 and your nitrate should very low. This is not what you show.
 
I wonder is how many and what sort of plants you have. In a fishless cycle with no plants one should regularly see ammonia do what your's has and drop from 3 ppm to a much lower number in about 10 days. But you are adding to 2 ppm so it should get there even sooner. Add plants and it goes even faster and the rest of the test numbers should be different than in a plant free fiishless cycle.
 

Most reactions

trending

Members online

Back
Top