Fish suggestions? Beginner.

[Tomie]

Me and my partner recently decided to get fish as we both share an interest in fish keeping. We bought a 25 litre tank and added 6 fish gradually. We currently have 2 Harlequin Rasbora's, 2 Lemon Tetra's and 2 Rosy Tetras. They have been in the tank 2 weeks now and they all seem to get along perfectly and we've had no problems what so ever. Because we've really enjoyed the hobby we recently decided to upgrade our tank as we want to have more fish in the future. We've now got the Juwel Lido 120 litre tank which we have up and running waiting to put our fish in.

Our next fish we are interested in buying is a Siamese Fighter but the woman at the pet store told us that you can only mix certain fish (i knew this but i'm not too sure what you can and can't mix). We are absolute amatures as of right now so suggestions as to what we can mix with Siamese Fighter would be great. Also, would the fish i currently have any effect on a fighter?

We want the tank to look even too, fish that swim at the bottom, fish that like to swim in the middle and fish that like stay at the top. I'm aware that most fish will enjoy roaming around the tank but if there is any specific tropical fish that would most likely stay in one area suggestions would be appreciated.

Hope this post was easy to understand, like i said... i'm an absolute amateur lol

 

[Byron]

Welcome to TFF.

I read your second thread/post, so I will leave my comments concerning these fish for that other thread. This 25 liter is not sufficient space for any of these fish, but the larger 120 liter solves that.

Siamese Fighter (Betta) is not a community fish. A single male in this 25 liter (once the other fish are out to the larger tank) would be fine, but nothing else.

A caution...are you aware of the nitrogen cycle, and cycling new tanks? I'll wait for your answer before getting into that.

 

[Tomie]

Welcome to TFF.

I read your second thread/post, so I will leave my comments concerning these fish for that other thread. This 25 liter is not sufficient space for any of these fish, but the larger 120 liter solves that.

Siamese Fighter (Betta) is not a community fish. A single male in this 25 liter (once the other fish are out to the larger tank) would be fine, but nothing else.

A caution...are you aware of the nitrogen cycle, and cycling new tanks? I'll wait for your answer before getting into that.

Thank you for taking the time to post. Highly appreciated.

So putting a Betta in the large tank with other fish wouldn't work? Will have to explore other alternatives. How about angel fish? Do they do well with the kind of fish I have already? Me and my partner have said that when we move the fish into the larger tank we are defintely going to buy another 6 of each as we read online that you should have a minimum of around 6-8 in a tank.

And if i'm being honest, I was briefly educated about the nitrogen cycle at the pet shot but I didn't fully understand what they was talking about. Until a couple week ago I have never owned fish so I really am a beginner. The reason why I came onto the forums today was for help. I ring the pet store every day asking them different questions and I'm sure they're getting fed up of me ha ha.

 

[Byron]

So putting a Betta in the large tank with other fish wouldn't work? Will have to explore other alternatives. How about angel fish? Do they do well with the kind of fish I have already?

Betta are not community fish. Now, there will be those who say they have had luck with a Betta in with this or that, but it is a freak and not normal. A male Betta belongs alone, and your small tank would just be sufficient space.

Angelfish. This too is a shoaling species, so a group of five minimum. But they get large, six inches length with a vertical fin span of 8 inches. A group needs at least a 4-foot length tank. But that doesn't end the issues. Pairs will likely form, and that can mean removing the other fish or the pair. Angelfish need lots of space. Aside from a group, a pair that have bonded and are intended for breeding can work in a smaller tank, but the 125 liter tank is pushing this very much. And the other fish would be out by and large. Some will suggest a single angelfish, but I do not advise keeping any fish contrary to its expectations as that can depend somewhat upon the temperament of the individual fish. But as with the Betta, one must keep in mind that the species is programmed to expect certain things, and forcing any fish into abnormal conditions is not responsible, and usually cruel to the fish.

On the cycling, there are articles in that section of this forum, have a read.

 

[seangee]

Please do read up on cycling, it really is important if you want healthy fish. Provided that your water parameters are ok I would aim to move what you have into the 120 litre and aim to have 6-8 of each type. That will probably be enough for the tank. Then keep the 25 litre for a betta on it's own.

If you post the results for pH and hardness we can better advise what is suitable.

 

[seangee]

Just seen your other thread and Byron's detailed reply. Please don't add more fish until you have resolved the ammonia / nitrite issues and got further advise about suitable fish.

 

[Tomie]

Please do read up on cycling, it really is important if you want healthy fish. Provided that your water parameters are ok I would aim to move what you have into the 120 litre and aim to have 6-8 of each type. That will probably be enough for the tank. Then keep the 25 litre for a betta on it's own.

If you post the results for pH and hardness we can better advise what is suitable.

Thanks for the advice. I will be sure post the pH and hardness but just to be sure, you mean on my new 120litre tank? I'm struggling on how to start the cycle with my new tank. Really wouldn't want any of my fish to die once added into the bigger tank.

 

[Byron]

Thanks for the advice. I will be sure post the pH and hardness but just to be sure, you mean on my new 120litre tank? I'm struggling on how to start the cycle with my new tank. Really wouldn't want any of my fish to die once added into the bigger tank.

We (and you) need to know the parameters (GH, KH, pH) of your source water, which is what comes out of the tap. Not what is in the tank, which may be different. You need to know what you are starting with. Some fish have need for soft water, some much harder, some sort of adaptable in the middle if not too extreme either way.

Once an aquarium is established with fish and cycled, it will develop a unique biological system and water chemistry. Organics tend to acidify the water, lowering pH. But the inherent GH and KH of the source water factor in, and may allow or prevent this from occurring. We can work out what is likely to occur once we have the tap water parameters. Another factor is what can affect this biological process, from organics like wood, leaves softening/acidifying, or calcareous substances increasing the mineral content.

At this stage, you should only continue this discussion in one of the two threads. Some of us are posting in both, and this is only going to lead to confusion.

 

[Tomie]

We (and you) need to know the parameters (GH, KH, pH) of your source water, which is what comes out of the tap. Not what is in the tank, which may be different. You need to know what you are starting with. Some fish have need for soft water, some much harder, some sort of adaptable in the middle if not too extreme either way.

Once an aquarium is established with fish and cycled, it will develop a unique biological system and water chemistry. Organics tend to acidify the water, lowering pH. But the inherent GH and KH of the source water factor in, and may allow or prevent this from occurring. We can work out what is likely to occur once we have the tap water parameters. Another factor is what can affect this biological process, from organics like wood, leaves softening/acidifying, or calcareous substances increasing the mineral content.

At this stage, you should only continue this discussion in one of the two threads. Some of us are posting in both, and this is only going to lead to confusion.

Note taken, apologies. Will continue the discussion in this thread.

So if I buy some of the Tetra SafeStart and add the required dosage to my tank would that start my cycle to then allow me to add my fish? Like i've already stated I really don't want to lose any of my fish. I'm in no rush to add the fish I just want to know what I should do. I will provide you a sample in the next post. If I fill a glass of tap water and do a test would that show an accurate enough read?

 

[Byron]

Note taken, apologies. Will continue the discussion in this thread.

So if I buy some of the Tetra SafeStart and add the required dosage to my tank would that start my cycle to then allow me to add my fish? Like i've already stated I really don't want to lose any of my fish. I'm in no rush to add the fish I just want to know what I should do. I will provide you a sample in the next post. If I fill a glass of tap water and do a test would that show an accurate enough read?

In the larger tank, yes, I see no reason this would not work without harming the fish. But no additional fish until this is confirmed, by daily tests, for a couple weeks, then you can add more fish slowly. I would suggest a species at a time. I am more concerned with what may be occurring in the small tank with these six fish, but you earlier said the tests were OK (ammonia and nitrite being zero, correct?).

Yes, run a clean glass of fresh water, then test for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate according to the instructions. For GH and KH, check your water authority. The pH test is a bit different; with tap water only (never aquarium water) you must ensure the CO2 is out-gassed or it can affect the test. If you could confirm the ph with the water folks, that would help.

 

[Tomie]

In the larger tank, yes, I see no reason this would not work without harming the fish. But no additional fish until this is confirmed, by daily tests, for a couple weeks, then you can add more fish slowly. I would suggest a species at a time. I am more concerned with what may be occurring in the small tank with these six fish, but you earlier said the tests were OK (ammonia and nitrite being zero, correct?).

Yes, run a clean glass of fresh water, then test for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate according to the instructions. For GH and KH, check your water authority. The pH test is a bit different; with tap water only (never aquarium water) you must ensure the CO2 is out-gassed or it can affect the test. If you could confirm the ph with the water folks, that would help.

I have just filled a glass of water from my tap and did a test, here are the results;

Nitrate -0
Nitrite - 0
PH Fresh - 6
KH - 20
GH - 0
Ammonia - 0-0.5

My small fish tank, about 4 days ago there was 3 ammonia in my tank. I contacted the pet store and they told me it wasn't that much to worry about although it should be 0. So i asked them what i should do, they said i should clean the bottom of my tank and stir up the gravel to get out the left over food etc... my partner did this yesterday and did a water change and today when we did a reading of ammonia it was at 0-0.5.

 

[Tomie]

Can I just say, I highly appreciate you taking the time to help. I feel satisfied that I can finally get my questions answered without being rushed along.

 

[Byron]

I have just filled a glass of water from my tap and did a test, here are the results;

Nitrate -0
Nitrite - 0
PH Fresh - 6
KH - 20
GH - 0
Ammonia - 0-0.5

My small fish tank, about 4 days ago there was 3 ammonia in my tank. I contacted the pet store and they told me it wasn't that much to worry about although it should be 0. So i asked them what i should do, they said i should clean the bottom of my tank and stir up the gravel to get out the left over food etc... my partner did this yesterday and did a water change and today when we did a reading of ammonia it was at 0-0.5.

You need to keep separated the cycling issue in a new tank, and the situation in a cycled tank that will become established. We have rather been mixing the two here from time to time.

Taking the tap water tests. Don't worry about the ammonia at 0.5. This could be chloramine--can you check to see if your municipality uses chloramine or chlorine or both? But not a worry. Nitrite and nitrate at zero are good, no worries there. So this means any nitrate in the aquarium will be occurring within the tank, and that is easy to keep low by not over stocking, not over feeding, doing regular (once a week, the same day each week) partial water changes (50-60% of the tank volume), keeping the substrate vacuumed during the water change, and keeping the filter rinsed. The brown gunk that accumulates in the filter, and in the substrate sometimes, is organics and this is one cause of nitrate. Nitrate will not kill fish rapidly like ammonia or nitrite, but over time it can debilitate fish, different species have differing tolerances, leading to weakening, other issues, and premature death. The fish cannot function properly when nitrate is an issue.

The higher ammonia before the water change, this was likely a cycling issue. You are certainly getting bad advice from that fish store. Any ammonia and nitrite is cause for alarm. Knowing it is to do with the cycling allows us to fix it and move on. Occurring in an established tank would be much more concerning, as it never should.

Parameters. GH at 0 means very soft water. KH at 20, I assume this is in ppm or mg/liter (?) is low so not much buffering of pH. This all means the pH will lower in the aquarium as organics accumulate. Not a problem for soft water species (what you have so far are soft water). Never get fish needing harder water--all livebearers, some rainbowfish, rift lake cichlids to name just a few general groups.

 

[Byron]

Can I just say, I highly appreciate you taking the time to help. I feel satisfied that I can finally get my questions answered without being rushed along.

It is my pleasure, you're very welcome; there are many knowledgeable members here. I tend to explain beyond the initial question sometimes, as I feel it often helps to understand the "behind the scenes" as it were.

 

[Tomie]

You need to keep separated the cycling issue in a new tank, and the situation in a cycled tank that will become established. We have rather been mixing the two here from time to time.

Taking the tap water tests. Don't worry about the ammonia at 0.5. This could be chloramine--can you check to see if your municipality uses chloramine or chlorine or both? But not a worry. Nitrite and nitrate at zero are good, no worries there. So this means any nitrate in the aquarium will be occurring within the tank, and that is easy to keep low by not over stocking, not over feeding, doing regular (once a week, the same day each week) partial water changes (50-60% of the tank volume), keeping the substrate vacuumed during the water change, and keeping the filter rinsed. The brown gunk that accumulates in the filter, and in the substrate sometimes, is organics and this is one cause of nitrate. Nitrate will not kill fish rapidly like ammonia or nitrite, but over time it can debilitate fish, different species have differing tolerances, leading to weakening, other issues, and premature death. The fish cannot function properly when nitrate is an issue.

The higher ammonia before the water change, this was likely a cycling issue. You are certainly getting bad advice from that fish store. Any ammonia and nitrite is cause for alarm. Knowing it is to do with the cycling allows us to fix it and move on. Occurring in an established tank would be much more concerning, as it never should.

Parameters. GH at 0 means very soft water. KH at 20, I assume this is in ppm or mg/liter (?) is low so not much buffering of pH. This all means the pH will lower in the aquarium as organics accumulate. Not a problem for soft water species (what you have so far are soft water). Never get fish needing harder water--all livebearers, some rainbowfish, rift lake cichlids to name just a few general groups.

Thank you, put my mind at rest knowing that my water is good. So do you think if I go purchase the Tetra SafeStart tomorrow and add it to my new large tank, the cycle would start and I should be good to go? How long would you recommend doing the cycle before adding fish?