Completed Confused On Tank Results (Not Cycling)

[Brisky86]

Okay, I have a long sob story already with trying to get my water ready for fish, but I will try to just hit the major points. 
 
Purchased new tank 3 weeks ago.
Always floated bag for 5-10 minutes before placing fish in tank.
 
Fish Tank:
2.6 gallons
Included water filer (uses two carbon media filters)
 
Purchased:
10w water heater
Water Temp aquarium stick on
Center Decoration
Fake Plant
 
What I did at the start:
Added water to tank
Used two - three drops of API Stress Coat
Ran tank for 48 hours
 
Fish round one:
Bought two fancy guppies
One nitrite snail
-Fish died within 24 hours
 
Water checked at LFS.
Stated was fine.
 
Fish round two:
Bought two more guppies
Again died within 24 hours
 
Rechecked water at LFS.
Still stated was fine.
 
Fish round three:
Purchased dalmatian molly and guppy
-Bought Tetra Safestart and added to water.
 
Guppy died within 24 hours and molly lasted about two days.
 
Water checked.
Again told was fine (ammonia normal, ph was low, no nitrite or nitrates)
Advised to do water change 50% without using brita filtered water.
 
Fish round four:
Purchased mountain cloud minnow
Checked water 48 hrs after purchasing.
- Ammonia was high 8 ppm.
Advised to do 20% water change every day
Did water change next day, fish died within 24 hours
 
Fish round five:
Water checked, advised normal for new tank.
Ammonia no longer high, ph fine, no nitrites or nitrates
 
Store owner felt bad, gave free minnow
Left tank for five hours, minnow disappeared. 
Tank combined through, gravel, removed decorations, removed and opened up water filter.
Fish no wear to be found (raptured?)
 
No fish Round Six:
Purchased One and Only online via Amazon w/ Ammonia
Added 2 oz bottle to tank water
Maintained heat at 78-80 degrees Fahrenheit
 
Added two drops of ammonia first day
Used API master test kit on day two, used incorrectly, thought had no ammonia and added 2 more drops
 
My excel log is below:

Day

Date

Ammonia

pH

Nitrite

Nitrate

Action/s After Test

Notes

Day 1

4/14/2015

na

7.6

0

na

1 liter water change, three drops API Stress Coat, One and Only, 3 drops ammonia

Tank Empty for four days running

Day 2

4/15/2015

1.0 ppm

7.6

0

0

Added three drops ammonia

Originally measured ammonia wrong, then added more ammonia and measured correctly

Day 3

4/16/2015

1.0 ppm

7.6

0

0

No action

No ammonia to nitrite conversion yet

Day 4

4/17/2015

1.0 ppm

7.6

0

0

 

 

Day 5

4/18/2015

0.25 ppm

7.6

0

0

Added four drops ammonia

Added extra drop of ammonia by accident

Day 6

4/19/2015

1.0 ppm

7.6

0

na

Added two drops ammonia

 

Day 7

4/20/2015

2.0 ppm

na

0

na

No action

 

Day 8

4/21/2015

2.0 ppm

 

0

 

Added bacteria and two drop of API Quick Start

 

Day 9

4/22/2015

0

 

0

 

Added four drops ammonia

 

Day 10

4/23/2015

2.0 ppm

 

0

 

Added one drop ammonia

 

Day 11

4/24/2015

2.0 ppm

 

0

 

Added 2 oz Tetra SafeStart

 
 
 
In summary, I have added Tetra Safestart, One and Only and now again Tetra Safestart to the thank and I still have no measurable nitrites or nitrates after having a tank running with and without fish for at least three weeks.
 
Snail is doing fine though....
 
Any ideas what is keeping nitrites from showing up?
 
My wife REALLY wants to get fish in there again, but I don't want to be responsible for their untimely deaths anymore...
 
Thanks!

 

[Brisky86]

Hmm my excel log did not copy in correctly...
 
I will see about uploading it as a file instead...
 
I also wanted to add that I add one drop of the API StressCoat for every liter of water I put in the tank. Which I know might be a bit high but with such a small tank it is hard to measure it out right...
 
It won't let me edit above, but instead of water changes everyday it was actually every other day....

 

[gmc1]

I think you may be getting mixed up with api stress coat and api quick start.one is for making tap water safe and one has bacteria in it to help start the cycle of your tank.

 

[Ch4rlie]

Right, need to clear up one of two things.
 
Did you add ammonia while fish was in the tank?
If so, this is a not a good action to take, ammonia is toxic to fish and will, at best, make them ill. Usually death occurs when ammonia is at 0.5ppm or above for a length of time.
 
A 2.6 gal / barely 10 litres tank, is very small for any fish, at very, very mininum a single betta should be ok in such a small tank, white cloud mountain minnows, guppies, mollies are all unsuitable for this small tank am afraid.
 
I'd strongly advise you not to purchase any more fish until you have at least cycled that tank. Specifically a Fishless cycle.
 
Very basically a cycled tank means, the filter and tank should have two types of bacteria that will deal with any ammonia which the fish breathes and excretes into the tank, as mentioned already, ammonia is toxic to fish and will very likely make them very ill or resulting in fatalities. Thats an extrem basic explaination, there is a bit more to it than that but do not want to overwhelm you with information.
 
Therefore in order to properly cycle your tank then would encourage you to read this article, http/www.fishforums.net/.
 
I have cycled at least 4 tank using that article and if you follow the instructions exactly should result in a cycled tank for you.

 

[Brisky86]

Okay, sorry for the confusion.
 
No ammonia was added when fish were in the tank.
I have only been doing that and keeping a log since all the fish have died off and am now attempting the fishless cycling. 
However after 12 days today no nitrites and no nitrates have shown up since I started the fishless cycling with One and Only.
 
I was using the API Stresscoat as a water conditioner (to remove chlorine and heavy metals) and the API quick start to add more bacteria (on top of the Tetra Safestart, One and Only, and now another Tetra Safestart).
 
Could there be something keeping the nitrites and nitrates from showing up?
The water is 78-80 degrees warm and de-chlorinated with the Stress Coat.
 
I feel like I should have 3x the bacteria required for this tank to cycle so I am very confused.
The only time it would have been without bacteria was that four day period after the last fish disappeared (though the snail has been present the whole time so there may have been enough ammonia to keep the bacteria alive).
 
So I am  very lost and confused as to why the tank is not cycling, especially because it is such a small tank.
My filter I have made sure NOT to clean to maintain my bacteria and nothing in the tank has been cleaned since fish have been in it.
 
Is adding one drop of Stresscoat per liter too much and that is why my tank won't cycle?
 
 
Side note.
I have read (including the article in this forum) just about every article on fishless cycling I could find and have not found anything I have done that should have stalled my cycle...
 
 
Thanks again for the input.

 

[Brisky86]

Okay I have a new theory.
 
 
I was only using one drop of API Stress Coat water conditioner in every half liter of water I put in.
 
API recommends putting in 5 ml per 10 US gallons of water.
 
I have 2.65 or about 2.5 gallons of water which is close to about 10 liters of water.
One drop equals 0.05 ml.
 
A 5 gallon tank then would use only 2.5 ml, or half of that (2.5 gallons) would only use 1.25 ml, which would equal 25 drops for the entire tank.
 
So that means I should be putting in about 2.5 drops for every liter, and not simply 2 drops that I have been using?
Which means I should round up and use 3 drops for every liter?
 
 
Could it be that I have not bee using enough de-chlorinater and the live bacteria I have been adding has been killed off by the remaining chlorine in the water?
 
 
 
I am still lost as to what I am doing wrong here...
 
Measured again, same Ammonia and no nitrites or nitrates....

 

[Brisky86]

Well still no nitrites or nitrates after both redoing the chlorine with Stresscoat and adding a 4th bottle of bacteria (a 3rd bottle of Tetra SafeStart Plus).
 
I updated my sheet.
 
Let me know if anyone else has any theories....
 
 

 

[attibones]

What are the expiration dates on your tests? If ammonia has dropped down to .25 ppm, then you certainly should be seeing nitrite. Bad tests could be giving false readings. Also, I have not used Tetra SafeStart, but I have used Dr. Tim's several times. Both have been proven to work. However, if they are not stored in the proper manner, the bacteria within them will often die. 
 
Another thing to note is that these micro tanks are very difficult to cycle. They often have troubles after cycling, and I suppose it is reasonable to think they could have troubles during the cycling process. I would actually abort mission, plant this tank completely, keep a few shrimp and get a bigger tank for fish. However, this may not be what you want to do (although I do not advise putting any fish in this tank, even a betta).
 
Your pH has stayed the same, according to your spreadsheet. What is your gH? Typically during a cycle there is pH fluctuation. I'm wondering if there is something to do with the gH.

 

[Brisky86]

My water testkit does not expire until 2020.
My Tetra SafeStart Plus was good unit 2017.
 
Yeah pH has not changed at all.
Solid 7.6, even only 7.4 on the high pH tests.
 
Forgive me for my lack of knowledge, but what is gH?
Is it something I can test using the API Master Test Kit?
 
Should I do a 50% water change and see if that helps?
 
I just measured today and today (3rd day after adding ammonia) it read 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, and 0 nitrate.
I also made sure I was doing the tests correctly and reread the instructions by API to be on the safe side.
I did add more ammonia today since it dropped down to zero.

 

[attibones]

GH is general hardness. If you use municipal water, the city water website should (but not in every case) tell you the gH of your water. The gH is essentially buffering capabilities. If your water is very hard it takes a ton of work to shift your pH. If your water is very soft (like mine), your water is prone to pH swings and can be a little touchy. Typically with hard water we see higher pH, but this is not always the case. 
 
I'm going to shoot a message to Byron. He knows more about gH than I do, and he would be able to tell us if the gH would have any problems with cycling.
 
Oh! One thing I just remembered: when I was cycling a tank, I had some gravel in it that were causing a ton of issues. My ammonia refused to drop until I removed the gravel. What is in your tank right now? Rocks, gravel, decorations?

 

[Brisky86]

Hmm well I live in Kent, Washington (close to Seattle) and can't seem to find gH on the county website.
 
 
I have about an inch of gravel, a center decoration, and a fake plant at the moment along with our nitrite snail (who always seems happy no matter what water quality we have).
 
We rinsed off all the gravel pretty well before putting water in it for fish, and we did the same for our decorations.

 

[Brisky86]

Well you were right about one thing.
 
I had my local fish shop check the gH and it turned green in only 6 drops. 
They told me that it would not have come from my tap water, as we don't have hard water around here, but that my gravel is likely the culprit.
Although they did not believe it would stop a tank from cycling.
 
Curiously they did not find any nitrites (same as me) but found a tiny bit of nitrate (which I did not find with my kit).
The tank also went through just about all the ammonia I added yesterday as on both my tests and the stores there was either none or virtually none in the water.
 
 
Anyway. I removed some of the gravel and replaced about 50% of the water with some distilled water from the grocery store, plus 2 drops Stresscoat per half liter (just in case there was any chlorine, overkill I am sure) and a drop of API quickstart.
 
 
They also thought that instead of waiting for the cycling to happen to simply start with fish again.
So I got two white cloud minnows today too.
 
I will be still watching the water quality daily though, and doing extra water changes as needed if ammonia spikes.

 

[attibones]

No! Return the fish, please. They will only cause issues. They are in no way suitable for this size tank anyway. Is it possible to get a bigger tank? As I mentioned earlier, it's going to be very difficult to stock this tank anyway.

 

[NickAu]

 
They also thought that instead of waiting for the cycling to happen to simply start with fish again.

Sounds like the only thing that LFS cares about is money, My suggestion if you can find another LFS.

 

[Brisky86]

Well the fish seem okay so far, but I am monitoring the water every 12 hours to make sure ammonia stays under control.
Still no measurable ammonia levels after 24 hours.
 
I will likely either get a betta or a single plain goldfish at this point if we can't figure anything else out.
 
 
I appreciate the help and feedback you guys have provided, and am looking at bigger tanks now as well (though it will be hard to convince my wife to spend more money on this little hobby of ours).
 
Do you have any particular brands that you would recommend for fish tanks?
I looked at the Fluval, but those are very expensive.