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Discus Floating At Top Of Water


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#1 stiffler69

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Posted 26 March 2009 - 09:29 AM

Hi my discus pair havent looked too good over the past few days and yesterday i notice they are uncontrolably floating at the surface of the water their is nothing visibly wrong with them other than their fins seem a little white and ragged in places water quality is good and i done a 15 percent change yesterday.

Any ideas whats wrong with them and what treatment i should use dont really want to loose these guys as they are a stendker proven breeding pair

Edited by stiffler69, 26 March 2009 - 09:30 AM.


#2 stiffler69

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Posted 26 March 2009 - 09:36 AM

Just to add i recently wormed the discus a couple of days ago

#3 WILDER

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Posted 26 March 2009 - 10:02 AM

How many gallons is the tank.
How many fish and which type.
Water stats in ammonia nitrite, nitrate, and ph.

White edging and raggy fins can be bacterial finrot.
Hows there breathing.
Can they maintain there balance in the water.
Do they look bloated.
Are they new fish. If so how long did you climatise them for.

#4 s007

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Posted 26 March 2009 - 10:32 AM

Had the same problem yesterday fo couple of days all of my 5 discus ware floating on top gasping some times on their side. I guess as my other fish did the same it was eather co2 or water quality. So ive checked everything and all was fine. As ive changed too much filter media i assume its a new tank syndrome. Ive moced them to hospital tank for 1 night and done 50% water change last night and this morning... moved them back and they are swimming nice with colours back on them. Fins looks same as u sated so ive added melafix and will do so for 1 week.

#5 WILDER

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Posted 26 March 2009 - 10:35 AM

Melaifx is only good once fins are healing.
Signs of bacterial finrot are.
Fins will look cloudy or transparant.
White or red edging to fins.Red edging is septicemia.
Holes in fins.
Raggy fins.
Red streaking in fins which can be bad water quality to septicemia.
Excess mucas on fins, or fins clumping together.

Edited by Wilder, 26 March 2009 - 10:36 AM.


#6 stiffler69

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Posted 26 March 2009 - 10:41 AM

Had a proper look and things arnt looking good, the female has darkened in colour and has white patches on her gills, fins and parts of her scales, looks like skin is coming off the male is starting to look the same aswell, i have just done a large water change added a large dose of stress coat and tried some swim bladder treatment by interpet incase its swim bladder.

But im suspecting that my water may have become contaminated somewhere along the line as someone else was left to take care of them over the weekend.

The tank has been in operation for over a year and has weekly water changes unless breeding is in process then its daily, not sure on the stats as i no longer have a test kit i only use them when first setting up my tanks.

Airations is good as i use sponge filters powered by air pumps

tanks size is 125 litres

the only occupants is 2 adult discus

weekly water changes around 25% when not breeding these increase when breeding

Edited by stiffler69, 26 March 2009 - 10:49 AM.


#7 WILDER

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Posted 26 March 2009 - 10:44 AM

Sounds like a bacterial infection.
Columnaris can affect the gills.
Do the gills look like bleached out white patches,
Peeling skin can be columnaris, bad water quality, parasites.
Any signs of flicking and rubbing.

Info take from here
http://www.flippersa...flexibacter.htm

The signs of Flexibacter infection run the gamut from fuzzy lesions of the mouth (“Mouth Fungus”) to septicemia (infection in the bloodstream) to white fuzzy patches scattered over the body, sometimes so severe as to cause the skin to look as if it is shedding or peeling, with the fins disintegrating. Due to the white fuzzy patches, Flexibacter also goes by the layterm, “Cotton Wool Disease” and this infection is so common in mollies that it carries the common names of “Black Molly Disease” and “Mad Molly Disease” with mollies often exhibiting “shimmying”. Often the fuzzy patch will be located on the fish’s back, surrounding the dorsal (top) fin, having the characteristic look to it of a saddle, giving rise to the term “saddle-back lesion”. These lesions may also be found on the fins (fin rot), especially on the caudal (tail) fin and on the gills. The natural course of “Mouth Fungus” is that the white fuzzies or patches are followed within a day or two by redness, ulceration and necrosis, which means that the mouth quickly turns into a gnarly mess!

Edited by Wilder, 26 March 2009 - 10:50 AM.


#8 stiffler69

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Posted 26 March 2009 - 10:54 AM

Very similar to that how can i cure it?

thanks.

#9 WILDER

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Posted 26 March 2009 - 10:56 AM

Myxazin by waterlife and pimafix (UK)
Maracyn 1 and 2 (US)
Not sure what the indgredient are in swim bladder med.
There no med that cures swim bladder, only if its bacterial.
Does it sound like columnaris to you.
Columnaris lives in the background in your tank and it only takes a stressed fish to come down with it.
Columnaris can be fetched on by bad water quality, stress, unstable temp, over crowding.

Edited by Wilder, 26 March 2009 - 10:59 AM.


#10 stiffler69

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Posted 26 March 2009 - 10:59 AM

Ok thats great i rear on that page its good to reduce the temp too, but i dont think the discus will like that much do you think i should still bring it down a degree or two ?

thanks.

#11 WILDER

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Posted 26 March 2009 - 11:01 AM

COLUMNARIS
The hospital tank should be heated to approx. 74 degrees. 76 and above is the ideal breeding temperature for columnaris. Though there is some dispute over lowering the temperature, my experience has been that 72 is too low for the medication to work rapidly, 76+ causes the disease to breed more rapidly than the anti-biotic can kill, and 74 is "just right." Remember to keep this temperature stable!

#12 rabbut

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Posted 26 March 2009 - 11:30 AM

The reason you heat up a Discus tank is to ward off internal parasites. If you have just wormed them, that will be of little worry for a few weeks, so the treatment should b esafe at a lower temperature.

Do a 50% waterchange and run carbon for a few hours to clear out the swimblader med
Dose myxazin after another 50% waterchange
Make getting hold of and testing the water with a liquid drop test kit a priority. Get the numbers posted up here ASAP, preferably before starting treatment to confirm that waterquality isn't at fault :good:

All the best
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#13 stiffler69

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Posted 27 March 2009 - 02:09 PM

Things are looking very bleak both fish are exetremely ill, fins are rotting away looks like their is a coat coming off them and they cant swim well.

Ive done another 40% change plenty of stress coat added and the second dose of myxazin the tank is exetremely clean with no left over food on the floor and all equipment has been steralized with hot water after cleaning.

The female is the worse of the two and is currently laying on her side at the top of the water she is breathing ok and seem comfortable.

Ill keep up with the doses's and water changes and iver dropped the tank temp to 74, 23.5 degrees or their and about its a stable temp.

Is their anything else i can try since both occupants have this diesease this is now my hospital tank so i can try anything in there.

thanks for the advice looks like im gunna have to fork out another 150 for another pair but ill try my best for these two first they have only just raised their first batch!

Edited by stiffler69, 27 March 2009 - 02:11 PM.


#14 WILDER

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Posted 27 March 2009 - 02:47 PM

For columanris in the uk you need to add pimafix with the myxazin med.
Do you think it is columnaris.
What sre your water stats.

#15 stiffler69

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Posted 27 March 2009 - 02:54 PM

For columanris in the uk you need to add pimafix with the myxazin med.
Do you think it is columnaris.
What sre your water stats.


I cant source pimafix anywhere local only other med i have is esha 2000 i normally use it when introducing fish to the tanks, ill get the water stats checked tomorrow at my local store.

Looks like like it is fin and scales have a white surface and they is some ragged ness to the fins.

#16 WILDER

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Posted 27 March 2009 - 02:56 PM

Ok.
In a bad case of columnaris you really need the pimafix with the myxazin.
The only other thing is antibiotics in isolaton but only availalbe in the uk through a vet.

Edited by Wilder, 27 March 2009 - 02:56 PM.


#17 rabbut

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Posted 27 March 2009 - 05:16 PM

When you said you sterilised the equipment after cleaning I sincerly hope that does not include the filter media. If so, you can now be sure of water quality issues on top of *possible* disease. Thus far, all I have read would also be consistant with stress, hence why I asked for water stats before you started treatment, as I'm not convinced that disease is at work. When you get the water tested, get numbers, not just "it's OK", or we'll end up asking you to go again to get the numbers. Often, LFS's will say the waters OK when it isn't :sad: Numbers can't lie. IME 90ish percent of issues with Discus are down to waterquality.

All the best
Rabbut

#18 stiffler69

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Posted 27 March 2009 - 09:53 PM

When you said you sterilised the equipment after cleaning I sincerly hope that does not include the filter media. If so, you can now be sure of water quality issues on top of *possible* disease. Thus far, all I have read would also be consistant with stress, hence why I asked for water stats before you started treatment, as I'm not convinced that disease is at work. When you get the water tested, get numbers, not just "it's OK", or we'll end up asking you to go again to get the numbers. Often, LFS's will say the waters OK when it isn't :sad: Numbers can't lie. IME 90ish percent of issues with Discus are down to waterquality.

All the best
Rabbut


No steralised cleaning equipment i meant, why would i steralize filter media?

Only part of my test kit i have left tests nitrit or something similar, if it was a water issue im pretty sure my 3 other tanks with discus in would be suffering too but they are fine plus over the past 3 days i have pretty much removed the whole contents of the tank for fresh water during water changes, they are still looking ill but appear to more comfortable hopefully the swimming will improve aswell ill keep you posted on the water quality and get some number posted up too of the results

thanks.

#19 WILDER

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Posted 27 March 2009 - 09:57 PM

Ok. Good Luck.
Rabbut is very good. Just checking your water quality thats all.

#20 stiffler69

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Posted 27 March 2009 - 10:03 PM

Just done a nitrit test and its less than 0.1 no change in water colour at all this is good ill get the others tested tomorrow




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